The new PSP - NGP

[Dancingweapon]

And I HATE digital copies. They take up so much space... unless they are going to release a terabyte with the NGP or whatever, I don't plan to ever go digital -_-

You sound like my gran.

 

[Elemmire]

You sound like my gran.

Pfft, I doubt your gran knows jack shit about digital copies or whatnot :O

And Digital Copies are meh to me. I don't like how much storage space they take up compared to the limited space I already have. Unless this has a RIDICULOUS hard drive space I won't get it. Even then I still play games that I have that are UMDs (GTAs, FFs, etc) and I have no intention of rebuying them for a digital copy. And we know damn well Sony won't release anything to turn existing UMDs into Digital Copies (probably because they legally can't). It seems like people just trying to get more of the very little money I have. Fuck that.

So I choose to not buy it. The Go was a flop cause people on average don't want to be limited to digital only with such limited space. This will flop too if they don't have a ridiculous amount of space and it still might flop if they expect people already owning a PSP to get this when it nullifies a few of their games already.

 

[Strid]

The "NGP" doesn't nullify games and it's not digital only.

 

[Kurgon]

Limited space? I store my psp games on my PS3 (250gb) and PC (several Tb) for quick and easy file transfers. The psp Go has 16gb built in and I added another 16gb card. I currently have 17 psp games, 6 ps1 games, and 2 demos on my Go, with over 10gb free for more content. I'm not saying it couldn't get filled up but as long as I don't erase my save files I can erase games and swap as I like. If I plan ahead I could have enough games without carrying any umd's to last longer than any vacation has the right to last.

The only argument against digital that matters to me are:

1) Prices stay higher for longer than physical copies. It forces me to have greater patience while waiting for sales.
2) If you are into reselling games, which I am not, it effectively kills that off.

I do have some UMD games that aren't even available in digital form which is slightly irksome. Even if I were willing to repurchase them I currently couldn't. Namely FFI, FFII, FFT War of the Lions, and Castlevania: The Dracula X Chronicles. We'll see what happens. I hear FFI and FFII are coming to PSN soon. Tactic Ogre remake is coming to PSN and Third Birthday seems to still be in the air. Overall I am satisfied. If I want to play those UMD titles I can still play them on my PSP2000.

 

[Bajaratt]

Fuck that, I'm not REBUYING games I still enjoy playing that are UMD. And I HATE digital copies. They take up so much space... unless they are going to release a terabyte with the NGP or whatever, I don't plan to ever go digital -_-

Do you only have an ancient computer with a whopping 5GB of storage space? Most PSP games are the size of a CD(~750MB), some of the bigger, newer games are 2 CD's (~1.5GB). That's not big at all. You can buy a 16GB MSPD for about $50, which will hold at least ten games for you to just carry around, not including the ones that can sit on your hard drive if you don't want to play them right now. They're taking up very small amounts of space in today's computing world. UMD's are dead, get over it already.

If you don't want to buy them, just download them, you already have a legitimate copy of the game, so you're not stealing in any sense. Legally, you are obtaining a backup of your purchased product, it's why ROM's are legal; so do that for the games you can/will not legitimately buy a digital copy of.

Honestly, I wouldn't buy the NGP if they were still going to mainly rely on proprietary physical media; period. Digital Downloads make infinitely more sense for a portable hand held, where there's no way I'm going to be walking around with 10 jewel cases in my pockets to hold the games I feel like playing today. Do you listen to 8-tracks in your car too?

 

[Bajaratt]

So I choose to not buy it. The Go was a flop cause people on average don't want to be limited to digital only with such limited space. This will flop too if they don't have a ridiculous amount of space and it still might flop if they expect people already owning a PSP to get this when it nullifies a few of their games already.

The Go was largely a flop because it was crazy expensive, wasn't any better than the previous PSP's, and partially because of no UMD support, but that was mainly because there was almost no support from Sony to get downloadable versions of UMD's out there.

There doesn't need to be crazy amounts of disk space, enough for 5-10 games on the go, with the ability to download them while traveling or to "dock" it with a PS3/PC to transfer the games around, and that's all the space they'll need.

 

[Strid]

Honestly, I wouldn't buy the NGP if they were still going to mainly rely on proprietary physical media; period. Digital Downloads make infinitely more sense for a portable hand held, where there's no way I'm going to be walking around with 10 jewel cases in my pockets to hold the games I feel like playing today.

That works both ways though, so they're better covering both bases, which they are. I wouldn't buy a product that primarily focuses on digital distribution (like the Go). I like to know that what I'm buying will last me for as long as I take care of it, not just until a corporation decides storing the games on their servers are no longer worthwhile. I also don't trust the internet to always have my games available, never know when something will go down, even your net.

That being said the Go had an alternative that didn't rely on digital distribution. So if the "NGP" was DD only, which it wont be, I'd probably buy it (when it got hacked) but I'd never buy games.

 

[Elemmire]

The "NGP" doesn't nullify games and it's not digital only.

What's the non-digital then?

Limited space? I store my psp games on my PS3 (250gb) and PC (several Tb) for quick and easy file transfers. The psp Go has 16gb built in and I added another 16gb card. I currently have 17 psp games, 6 ps1 games, and 2 demos on my Go, with over 10gb free for more content. I'm not saying it couldn't get filled up but as long as I don't erase my save files I can erase games and swap as I like. If I plan ahead I could have enough games without carrying any umd's to last longer than any vacation has the right to last.

The only argument against digital that matters to me are:

1) Prices stay higher for longer than physical copies. It forces me to have greater patience while waiting for sales.
2) If you are into reselling games, which I am not, it effectively kills that off.

I do have some UMD games that aren't even available in digital form which is slightly irksome. Even if I were willing to repurchase them I currently couldn't. Namely FFI, FFII, FFT War of the Lions, and Castlevania: The Dracula X Chronicles. We'll see what happens. I hear FFI and FFII are coming to PSN soon. Tactic Ogre remake is coming to PSN and Third Birthday seems to still be in the air. Overall I am satisfied. If I want to play those UMD titles I can still play them on my PSP2000.

Believe it or not, that's not for me I hate moving stuff from one medium to another. I prefer to keep certain things on one medium and the only reason it's on another HD or Disk or whatnot is to back it up. Which means, for me, with the amount of games I'd end up having for it, it better have enough space for ALL of them. It's kinda an OCD thing of mine, but so be it.

Do you only have an ancient computer with a whopping 5GB of storage space? Most PSP games are the size of a CD(~750MB), some of the bigger, newer games are 2 CD's (~1.5GB). That's not big at all. You can buy a 16GB MSPD for about $50, which will hold at least ten games for you to just carry around, not including the ones that can sit on your hard drive if you don't want to play them right now. They're taking up very small amounts of space in today's computing world. UMD's are dead, get over it already.

If you don't want to buy them, just download them, you already have a legitimate copy of the game, so you're not stealing in any sense. Legally, you are obtaining a backup of your purchased product, it's why ROM's are legal; so do that for the games you can/will not legitimately buy a digital copy of.

Honestly, I wouldn't buy the NGP if they were still going to mainly rely on proprietary physical media; period. Digital Downloads make infinitely more sense for a portable hand held, where there's no way I'm going to be walking around with 10 jewel cases in my pockets to hold the games I feel like playing today. Do you listen to 8-tracks in your car too?

See above, I don't like the idea of digital downloads unless it has enough space to store ALL my games. And, believe it or not, I do have more than 10 games for the PSP and I'd likely have those + the ones for NGP. I don't care to rebuy the UMDs into digital format (which I'd have to) and I'm damn sure they won't release a legal option to change the UMDs into digital. So even if there was enough space, I'd have to carry my PSP if I wanted to play older PSP games. And,yes, there are still some I enjoy playing.

So the only reason I'll get an NGP is if there's 1) enough space for ALL my games and 2) if they offer a solution that doesn't make me pay more for making my UMDs become a digital format. Until I know more about the NGP, it's unappealing for me to get yet.

And I've never had a problem carrying the UMDs around with me. I don't keep them in the case, I have them in a special storage thing my art friend made for me to hold em but hold many of them at once. And I keep it in my bag. It's worked out fine and I haven't minded the UMDs. Still, I agree, it would be nice if it was all digital, but that would mean it'd have to have enough to hold like 50 games >.> sure that's a lot, but I'm like that.

Like, with my computer, I have old games I haven't played in a long time and not into yet, but I leave them installed (and if I ever reformat my computer I reinstall them all) in case I want to and whatnot. My nearly 2 TB of HD are filled with like 500 gigs of games, 200 gigs of work programs (things I use for school or job) and then the rest are downloads (I never delete downloads too ). I'm weird like that >.>

 

[Strid]

What's the non-digital then?

Sony has stated that games will be released on some sort of flash memory stick. The game cartridges look like an SD card, but they are bein' rather cheeky with what it actually is, just calling it a "new game media" format. Also, the thing has another slot for a storage card.

 

[Skaw]

See above, I don't like the idea of digital downloads unless it has enough space to store ALL my games. And, believe it or not, I do have more than 10 games for the PSP and I'd likely have those + the ones for NGP. I don't care to rebuy the UMDs into digital format (which I'd have to) and I'm damn sure they won't release a legal option to change the UMDs into digital. So even if there was enough space, I'd have to carry my PSP if I wanted to play older PSP games. And,yes, there are still some I enjoy playing.

I'd hate to carry around 10+ UMDs. That's a lot of bulk when you're already going to be carrying a wallet, keys, the PSP itself, cell phone, and other odds and ends. Carrying roughly another PSP-sized or larger carrying case or whatever is a hassle in my opinion. With Digital, at worst, you carry a USB cable a long or more memory sticks with games loaded on them already. Either download games directly from the PSN on your PSP, which admittedly takes forever and requires you to delete games to make room, or install Media Go on your PC and transfer them willy nilly(and back up your saves.)

Why do you feel the need to carry around so many UMDs in the first place? I understand the need for variety, but it's rather unnecessary and counterintuitive to carry around everything. Even with digital versions, I often only switch around 3 to 4 games a week. And I play the hell out of my PSP at work since a cloud in the sky means it's going to be rather dead for the day. PSP games are rather lightweight, usually ranging 300 to 800 mb. Peace Walker is the largest I've noticed at 1.4 gigs. And with Digital Versions, you don't need to do any installations to help reduce load times, saving you even more in space on your memory sticks. Infact, theres no benefit at all performance-wise to do a data installation on a digital copy. They also save on battery life by not requiring the UMD laser to operate everytime it needs to load new information.

It's silly, you're silly, stop being silly.

 

[Elemmire]

Cause I do have the space in my bag and I like having the variety. Still, I hate changing the flash drives out. It's a fickle thing about me. But I'm allowed to be fickle! :| And no, most of them are in the gig range for the full game. Installing them partially on the hard drive is just that, partially. Hell, PS1 games are 300mb to 1.5 gigs. PSP games tend to be in the later half of that.

Still, there's the problem of my UMDs become obsolete which means I just got screwed outta games and I have NO interest in rebuying games on the same kinda gaming system (handheld) when I already own it :\

 

[Skaw]

And no, most of them are in the gig range for the full game.

Browse around on the PSN, you're pretty wrong there. Only a few games weigh in over a gig.

Installing them partially on the hard drive is just that, partially.

Uh, no shit? I didn't say otherwise. With the digital copy, you don't need to install the data install. It does nothing. Which means you don't need to permanently have around hundreds of megabytes of data installs just in case you want to play a game.

 

[Strid]

Still, there's the problem of my UMDs become obsolete which means I just got screwed outta games

You're only gettin' screwed out of games if you can no longer play those UMDs because of something outside of your control. That's not the case as your PSP will continue to play those games perfectly fine. This is the "NGP" not the PSP, PSP Lite, PSPi, or PSPiXL, God forbid they upgrade, after over seven years, to a hell of a lot better (faster and less power consuming) media format, and not want to waste the space on a UMD slot in addition to the already added media slot for new games and a memory slot. It's just not practical to add bulk to a hand-held, not only that, but the added cost of the technology that goes with putting in the drive.

 

[Elemmire]

Browse around on the PSN, you're pretty wrong there. Only a few games weigh in over a gig.

Uh, no shit? I didn't say otherwise. With the digital copy, you don't need to install the data install. It does nothing. Which means you don't need to permanently have around hundreds of megabytes of data installs just in case you want to play a game.

All of the games I have when I had an option to install the install size was fairly large for the biggest install. Closer to a gig than not. So ya, it would bother me.

You're only gettin' screwed out of games if you can no longer play those UMDs because of something outside of your control. That's not the case as your PSP will continue to play those games perfectly fine. This is the "NGP" not the PSP, PSP Lite, PSPi, or PSPiXL, God forbid they upgrade, after over seven years, to a hell of a lot better (faster and less power consuming) media format, and not want to waste the space on a UMD slot in addition to the already added media slot for new games and a memory slot. It's just not practical to add bulk to a hand-held, not only that, but the added cost of the technology that goes with putting in the drive.

Do you think of how annoying it is to carry around both an NGP and a PSP? And NGP IS their next PSP basically. It's like Nintendo going from gameboy to gameboy advance or ds or whatever. It basically is their next playstation portable. Just cause it's not called "PSP 2" or something doesn't mean it isn't basically the next incarnation of the playstation portable. I don't mind carrying around UMDs in my bag, but carrying around too many devices is annoying to me. If they aren't going to support an option to freely move my UMDs to digital format, they can go fuck themselves. This is my fucking preference, not yours. Stop trying to think I'm wrong cause I get frustrated with this stuff >.>

 

[Skaw]

All of the games I have when I had an option to install the install size was fairly large for the biggest install. Closer to a gig than not. So ya, it would bother me.

With the digital copy, you wouldn't need to permanently have a 900 meg data install for Peace Walker just incase you want to pop Peace Walker in your PSP and not deal with long load times AND have voice acting. A digital version is equivalent to a data install, and a USB transfer of a digital copy takes a fraction of the time it takes to install data from a UMD disk.

 

[Strid]

Stop trying to think I'm wrong cause I get frustrated with this stuff >.>

Don't get me wrong. I don't think you're wrong, I think you're being irrational. I respect your opinion but the way you rationalize it is very bothering. Your idea that Sony should do it because Nintendo did it, thus making it seem like it's standard or you are entitled to it is, well, out there. Sony doesn't owe you anything. Anyway, I'm just tryin' to explain to you how irrational you're being, that technically isn't me thinking you're wrong. You kind of have to forgive them for being gun shy about this too. Swapping from the PS2 directly to the PS3 didn't exactly go well for them, they were better with a system of coexistence between the two.

Also there is this. You don't own a hacked PSP. Why would you not want more options out of your PSP? You don't even have to pirate to get massive benefits and you do not lose any functionality, unlike hacking a home console often loses you access to online services (you don't even void your warranty). I don't and have never carried around UMDs, I bought a 32gb Pro-duo for $40 and it has 12 games on it and isn't even half full. With the way this hack works, if the "NGP" allows for the device to play PSP games then the same process will work on the "NGP", simply put, you can already "digitize" your games. The "NGP" will get hacked, it will, Sony has screwed the pooch, and my "PSP stick" will work with the "NGP", why not put yourself in the same boat?

 

[Elemmire]

I like backwards compatibility really :\ it's something that means more to me than graphics or load times and it'll also frustrate me if I have to rebuy my games. If they do offer a free solution for my UMDs to become digital (purely), then I'll be fine and likely get one. But that is a huge problem for me. And Sony did seem, at first, to try and go with the "backwards compatibility" thing considering PS2 and first PS3 were (and PS3 still could be if they reactivate it). Not sure why they wouldn't :\ really helps the system more imo. I guess I can see at the start, but if it means it'll be later, I'd just wait then.

And I did have my PSP hacked at one point, but I like to support developers who make good games so I can't play those games (well couldn't back with the old method of hacking it) legit while having the NES -> n64/PS1 era games to play too. And they have 32 gigs for $40? last I checked it was like as much as a PSP for that. Hmmm, maybe I should get that then :O that'd prolly actually be enough for me for a long while. Still, I do actually like supporting the people who make good games. So that tends to negate hacking (or did, I haven't kept up on it).

 

[Strid]

And I did have my PSP hacked at one point, but I like to support developers who make good games so I can't play those games (well couldn't back with the old method of hacking it) legit while having the NES -> n64/PS1 era games to play too. And they have 32 gigs for $40? last I checked it was like as much as a PSP for that. Hmmm, maybe I should get that then :O that'd prolly actually be enough for me for a long while. Still, I do actually like supporting the people who make good games. So that tends to negate hacking (or did, I haven't kept up on it).

So do I, every game I have on the PSP I own, except for a few Japanese only games, which they don't want me to own anyway (no localizations), their loss there. Yeah, there are times when the OFW linked to a game's UMD requires an upgraded CFW but that's usually patched up well before the game's release. There is also a patcher now that even nulls the requirement to upgrade for most games, you just absolutely can not run the game from the UMD. That's not an issue for me though, running a UMD is a lot slower and consumes more battery than running the game off a memory card.

As for my memory card, Amazon had it on sell when I bought it, it is back up to $80 now, but I have seen them on sale quite a bit. Still, it's worth $80 even in my opinion, or you could just go with 16GB in the mid $40 range, that's still a good bit of space.

I like BC too, but honestly I don't expect it, it's just bad business, especially on Sony's part. The PS2 and PSP are so popular they can still make a ton of money off them to support their newer products, which is important for them now more than ever given the initial hit, the hit they still haven't recovered from, on the PS3. If you end up rebuyin' games though it'll be your own fault, there really are quite a few ways around that. I wouldn't be surprised at all, given the "NGP" will have a game loader that reads a memory stick and it has PSP emulation, if I can't just plug in my stick and play my games. Worst case scenario it takes the livid hacking community a week or two to patch it up to work.

 

[Elemmire]

Hmm, I should prolly get a nice larger memory stick. I only have an 8 gig one I believe >.> it's full. I also have a 1 gig one that's got my music and videos on it Be nice to combine all that into one stick and then have more space for more games.

And I didn't know about the patcher thing that nullifies the requirements of upgrades and stuff. I'll have to look it up. I worry about bricking my old PSP though, it's already got problems :\ and I kinda wanna see if it still has warranty (since I think it got renewed when I last sent it in) to fix the physical parts that are a little "eh." Works, but my UMD tray is kinda.. screwed a bit.

 

[Bajaratt]

I like backwards compatibility really :\ it's something that means more to me than graphics or load times and it'll also frustrate me if I have to rebuy my games.

I'm with Strid, you wanting the backwards compatibility is fine and all, but you're being incredibly irrational about it.

Once again, it is completely legal for you to just download copies of the games you own on UMD. There's your legal, free, and easy way to keep using all of your UMD games with the new hand held. If you're not willing to take the simple and effective step to overcome your problem, then that's on you, but you can not seriously expect Sony to hold on to a dead format just because you won't move on.

You will still have your PSP to play the UMD's if you don't obtain digital copies of them; just pick which one you want to play that day before you leave the house and take that with you if you don't have enough space in your bag. Also, the bag thing isn't as relevant for resolving the problem of carrying all the UMD's around; men don't typically walk around with a bag to hold their stuff, so half the players would run into space issues real quick.

And Strid, I do share some of your fears about digital-only distributions; but if they just make it so you can "dock" the NGP with your computer, and load/unload games/saves onto your computer, then that would solve that issue. It'd be the same thing I do with my iPhone, I download an app/song, plug it into my computer, and now I have a permanent backup on my hard drive, so I don't care if the internet goes down. I'm also not opposed to them distributing physical media for the games, but not if that's going to be the primary vehicle for distribution.

They also have Micro SD->MSPD adapters, and since you can get 256GB micro SD cards(with 2TB cards being an eventual maximum), space on a card is a complete non-issue. Even if you had to carry around a few of them, they're small enough that they fit in any pocket without problems.