"unofficial" talk of the legit ffxi windower mode.

Firestreak said:
I'd love to see a source on that.
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Is it a violation of the Final Fantasy XI terms of service? Yes it is.
Have people been banned for it? No, not except in cases where they are extremely overt about it, and even then not always.
Is it cheating? No, and we've been through this part repeatedly. I'd say my statement is fairly accurate. The only source needed is the results, frankly.
 
Firestreak said:
I can make an identical argument as to why using packet sniffers to find out when a NM is about to pop is perfectly legit. They work exactly the same was as TP Party does.

As for the keyboard macro thing....

If a keyboard came out that could effectively "bot" for you, I don't think that would mean we'd all think botting is alright now. Luckily we don't have to squabble over that's cheating and what isn't, Square-Enix tells us... windower is cheating.
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except for the part where packets are encoded and would require advance knowledge and software to read. When you break encryption, you are breaking the agreement of no reverse engineering... reading an integer stored in your memory is not reverse engineering. It's like saying opening the chat log text files and reading them with your eyes is against the rules.

And can you show me one legitimate ban for the use of Windower? Someone who never botted before or anything, didn't do anything retarded in game (i.e. advertise windower in shout) that has gotten banned? Now take at the user base who uses windower and tell me what percentage of them get banned? Sure you can say just cause people don't get caught doesn't make it any less of a cheat, but in reality if SE thought windower was that big of deal, they would have banned people a lot earlier. I mean windower has been widely popular for years?
 
I honestly don't think Windower is detectable, which is why it's not enforced. When you want to say it's not cheating to use the windower function because it's just running FFXI in a windowed mode, that's one thing. But when the exact same people who say they ONLY use it for windowed mode come back and say they'll continue to use it for TP Party and windower macroers, they're just in denial.
 
Firestreak said:
I honestly don't think Windower is detectable, which is why it's not enforced. When you want to say it's not cheating to use the windower function because it's just running FFXI in a windowed mode, that's one thing. But when the exact same people who say they ONLY use it for windowed mode come back and say they'll continue to use it for TP Party and windower macroers, they're just in denial.
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Yes it is. SE has been detacting since last update.

PoL.exe will scan memory for launcher.exe immediatly on hook and hash it to check it's azaril's.

Personally I don't care for the TP thing, but I do care about the extra macro line space. I do not like clicking 5-6 macros every time I ws.
 
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Artem said:
Yes it is. SE has been detacting since last update.

PoL.exe will scan memory for launcher.exe immediatly on hook and hash it to check it's azaril's.

Personally I don't care for the TP thing, but I do care about the extra macro line space. I do not like clicking 5-6 macros every time I ws.
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6 macros for one ws? wtf?
12 spaces to change max.
Capes never change so 11.
you can fit in all the gear changes +WS into two macros.
Select warcry from the menu preferably just before you get tp since I'll assume zerk and aggressor ect are already up
then change it back in 2 macros max.

Assuming you are a war and you have the gear on your sig or standard war gear then thats -2 more lines for ws where you can input warcry or some /recast stuff. If you use brutal or rajas during both tp and ws then thats another 2 spaces saved.

changing between begressor and non begressor can take up 3 macros easily max if you have one macro with the common gear between the seteups in the middle and on each side the gear that is different when the ja are active or inactive meaning you only have to press 2 macros for your different tp setups.
 
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Artem said:
Yes it is. SE has been detacting since last update.

PoL.exe will scan memory for launcher.exe immediatly on hook and hash it to check it's azaril's.
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Yep, but thats ilegal, so I highly doubt they're using the information.
 
Programmable keyboards / controllers are not cheating.

Going AFK with a programmable keyboard / controller or with a turbo controller left turned on is cheating.

I really don't mind not using windower, I've adapted to it quite well. Sure, TP party helped a lot, but I never used the macro feature. Hitting two macros to swap my gear in doesn't bother me at all.

I can't wait for them to come out with this. I'm using an EVGA nVidia 8800 series which SE hasn't really made compatible with. Haven't upgraded my drivers for a few weeks, but it seems there might be a fix.

With this new card, the graphics are sure amazing and I have absolutly no lag in Dynamis anymore. I thought my 360 was powerfull...lol. However, it won't let me use any versions of Windower and quite frankly I don't care enough to setup the JP version.

Even if Square actually is monitering Windower users by scanning memory like Artem said, have they ever announced they would do that? Even if they have announced it, would they ban/suspend anyone for it? And lastly, why haven't there been masses of ban/suspension for abusers?

I don't understand why they would scan for something unless they would take action...Keeping record of "possible" offenders of the PlayOnline User Agreements and Services seems very strange.
 
Result of a recent KI Survey:

20% of KI users play on Consoles
20% of KI users play on PC without Windower
60% of KI users play on PC with Windower
 
Artem said:
Yes it is. SE has been detacting since last update.

PoL.exe will scan memory for launcher.exe immediatly on hook and hash it to check it's azaril's.

Personally I don't care for the TP thing, but I do care about the extra macro line space. I do not like clicking 5-6 macros every time I ws.
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http://www.windower.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9234

Say what now? lol.

Now would everyone please shut up about this?
 
I didn't say they were scanning to ban anyone. Check it yourself you'll see that pol tries to access launcher.exe. SE came out and said they aren't doing it. However, before update nothing was trying to access launcher.exe, now it does. I'll believe my findings over SE, sorry.

They can just be using it to check how many people actually do use windower. The check is done before you log in, it's just a boot to pol.
 
Ahhh, maybe just checking to see if making a windower would actually be worthwhile.
 
Dowzer said:
Ahhh, maybe just checking to see if making a windower would actually be worthwhile.
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hey they might not even be doing it at all and it's just a change in the way pol loads and it backfires, in the end it's all speculation unless they start doing anything with it

anyways this is rather off topic

back to multiple line macros and better graphics :( SE sucks
 
Artem said:
I didn't say they were scanning to ban anyone. Check it yourself you'll see that pol tries to access launcher.exe. SE came out and said they aren't doing it. However, before update nothing was trying to access launcher.exe, now it does. I'll believe my findings over SE, sorry.

They can just be using it to check how many people actually do use windower. The check is done before you log in, it's just a boot to pol.
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hmm so your saying they went and made it easier to detect now? im interested in checking this out, ill get my wife to DL windower on her laptop and check that out. No one in my group plays ffxi anymore so i havent heard anything about it actually attempting to access launcher.exe yet, would be the start of something if its true tho.
 
Courtney said:
Result of a recent KI Survey:

20% of KI users play on Consoles
20% of KI users play on PC without Windower
60% of KI users play on PC with Windower
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And what % of FFXI users use KI regularly enough to be statistically significant? It's like a poll of QCDN, would it represent all of Quetzelcoatl?

I think there's a huge mass of FFXI players that don't take the game very seriously that have no idea what windower is.
 
Artem said:
I didn't say they were scanning to ban anyone. Check it yourself you'll see that pol tries to access launcher.exe. SE came out and said they aren't doing it. However, before update nothing was trying to access launcher.exe, now it does. I'll believe my findings over SE, sorry.

They can just be using it to check how many people actually do use windower. The check is done before you log in, it's just a boot to pol.
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I just checked its file access use on my system from start, in to game, I let it sit there, then backed out of everything. I'm not seeing any kind of file access that is unusal and it made no attempt to scan my system.

I just tired the same thing with Windower and still no attempt to access luncher.exe from pol.exe. You do see pol.exe access hook.dll and the plugin stuff, but that is all normal from the hooking process.
 
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I don't know if it still does or does not. I tried when it happened during last major update. If it doesn't now, oh well than. Windower is still detectable without that.
 
Marajade said:
its less mage more melee for windower macros. You need to change out about 12 pieces of gear for each WS, and then put that gear back on after.
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Eh I dunno about that man. Windower macros helped me out a fucking lot with my Ninja and Monk, for Weapon Skill swaps, Chakra swaps, haste-spell swaps, attack sets, accuracy sets, evasion sets, the works. Then again I enjoyed soloing and just being the top of the line wherever I could, so not all peopl require that much gear dedication. Just something that was really useful.
 
Well all I have to say is... if they're making a windowed mode and changed FFXI to allow them to scan if you're launching with windower...

When they change to windowed mode, I really recommend you stop using windower cause they'll probably start enforcing.

That's an IF they can detect it, which seems to be in debate. Also if they changed it so they can detect it in the last update, they wouldn't be handing out temp-bans/perm bans until next update.
 
They can detect it, people already know how; it's just that they can't do anything about it under their current TOS. They'd have to update it to start enforcing bans for the windower.
 
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