Vang the liar

[Pascal]

Shia how many languages do you speak?

 

[Pascal]

Here is the thing that doesn't make sense to me: If Vang was just doing this to "trap" shil, what would be the purpose of sending /tells as both parties agree happened? Why not just come here and flame the guy? The other thing that doesn't add up is the reps. I mean Vang isn't exactly well liked, but it's often because he is brutily honest. Shil seems to have the rep of being a rather shady player.

What I am gather from the translations, is he thinks Vang was trying to frame him ("trap), by saying he sent the boots, but they never showed up in his Dilv Box.

 

[Mai Ikari]

Holy crap... I post on the first page in first period, get home and this thing's up to 7 pages... And after a half-hour of sorting through all this, here's post #2.

If I was reading Shia's post correctly, seems that their stories are almost complete opposites. I don't really feel either way on this, same as I usually do in heated debates.
(On a side note, vote Yes in the Ban Roofie thread.)

For starters, Shel her/himself doesn't understand english. This is what we must understand before anything.

We got to talking (and some arguing) about how he said NA players are "not skilled" etc. and I in turn said they have had the game for much longer and had many advantages as to why they dominate most of the game. (Established crafts, slight ping advantage etc.") so this goes on for about 20 minutes.

I should say that this started with a conversation with Horihori who I might add is also very wealthy judging by his items, craft levels, and names on big ticket items in price history. I had noticed he was on his THF job and decided to shoot a /tell his way "(Please forgive me) (Strider Boots) (Do you need it?) (buy?) to which he replied "How much" I had told him 10 million for starters in hopes of settling to around 8-8.5 million.

He replies with "(Country) (No thanks) (Leave) (Blacklist) (You can have this) www" So i called him a racist pig and went on my way. Shel then /tells me that I am "(Head) (Diseased)" and we start our conversation.

So anyways we Shel and I get to talking about "Jp party only" and "Fish bots" "Voke bots" etc and how it is more acceptable in JP players eyes to use these methods than with NA. Which finally leads to the "Deal".

He comments vang is a very self centered person (this is the closest meaning I could come up with). Not as a threat, but Tiamat full heartedly think so. According to Shel, vang and shel were talking with provocative topics. (I believe the fish bot and stuff vang stated)

I had told Shel a few time I wanted a Peacock Charm as I planned on leveling Ninja for a good while because I had absolutely enjoyed the job and he finally agreed to trading his PCC for my Strider Boots. I honestly thought that was a fair trade, maybe a bit lopsided in my favor but Shel was leveling RNG at the time and I had assumed the boots were more important for him.

So we I had Repeatedly told him "Please no (lie) ok?" and I even typed a /tell to myself for the GMs to read /tell Vang "Gm's if things go wrong i want to have proof typed out that the deal is Strider boots (Vang) for a Peacock Charm (Shel) He wanted to do a Deliverey box trade
which i know will catch me a lot of heat from the readers, but with all his gil and me trusting this individual i did not think it was going to go awry.

After a while, Vang changed his attitude and said:
[Thank you]^^[Trade][Tank you]^^ with tabbed translation, and he continued with "I have sended you the boots, so send the peakock charm". Those name came from the conversation which Shel at the moment had no idea, nor Shel agreed upon the trade arrangement. Just in case he checked the Delivery box, and obviously no boots were delivered. (this is a translation so don't flame me)

Without knowing what happend, Shel was continuously told a [Lie](Liar I guess), and he got fed up from spammage that he putted vang into black list. In the previous posts it was mentioned that Shel haven't used a blacklist but its certainly a lie. Vang was putted into Shel's Blacklist since yesterday. (when ever that yesterday was)

So I had asked him if he was in his MH and he told me yes. I sent them and told him that they were sent. Almost 30 seconds later he tells me he has a "(Party) (Boyada Tree) then (trade) ok?" (He did speak pretty good english btw) Immediatley my heat raced, I went to check my outbox and the boots were cleared. I told him that I sent them and he picked them up, and that I wanted my PCC now.

No (boots) no (lie)! Was all he would respond with, I was fucking furious. I kept sending him tells about no honor and him being a thief, but he just kept denying it. I finally was calmed down by a buddy who told me to call a GM.

Shel also called a GM. But Shel was told that the GMs will "Look into it" and nothing else happend. (I don't know to who this part belongs but...) He asked to call the GM again, and to check the chat log, and item delivery of this incident but Shel him/herself were tired about Vang that he declined.

Make what you will of it, two quite different stories, though personally I trust Vang more, and I think this was a case of jumping to conclusions and [Reward] = Pet Treat, aka miss-Autotranlations... Though a case of it that ate Vang's Striders.

He thinks he was able to write down half of the things he wanted to say. He won't reply on any english tell that he receives. This is a message board so he could be able to form sentences from what he heard, but you can't do that on a chat (I have no frigging idea what he is talking about in here... I bet he means he heard more, but was not able to write down?)

I'll agree there Shia, I think that means he would post the rest but he doesn't have the records because it was FFXI without a parser running and not a message board.

 

[Veresko]

This whole thing is not right. I mean, those boxers were suppose to fit, but I feel so thight in them. Anyway...

On the matter at hand here, I doubt we will ever get the truth and there are just too many stuff that is not clear. From what I understand, both Vang and Shel were arguing, about god knows what. Then, depending on whose story, vang or shel suddenly started talking about a trade involving a 10 millions gils item..... I mean....

Vang claims he asked someone he thought had cash (Horihori) to buy his boots. That to me makes sense, direct marketing. find your custommer and address them directly. Then Horihori say no thanks, because Vang was NA. Again, that makes sense (some JP player DO hate us). Vang gave shit, now that definately makes sense! Shel then jumps in, yeah, I can see that. Now, where it gets foggy, is how does arguing with someone leads to a deal involving Strider Boots? That part I'm still not sure of.

Shel's side of the story is that Vang and himself/herself (I'll refer to Shel as masculine from now on) got into an argument. So that part is confirmed! Then all of sudden, Vang said the deal is done, send me your Peacock Charm. And of course the boots were not sent. Now, this does not make any sense. How would Vang even know Shel had a Peacock Charm if they did not talk about a deal first and what would be involved. And why would Vang claim he sent the boots, knowing very well that Shel would check his box first. Again, this does not make any sense to me.

The rest of the story is full of contradictions as well, about when was he blacklist, who said what, etc. But the first part is really what needs to be clarified.

Personnally (Yes, this is MY opinion, I don't claim to know better, but here it is, take it or leave it!) I think Horihori wanted the boots. He did ask how much, so there was at least some interest. Then said no on some racist basis (maybe he did not, who cares) At this point, Shel (who already have a shaddy reputation) comes in and start to argue with Vang. My guess is that Shel came with the intention of trying and steal the boots from Vang for Horihori. He started arguing (not to raise any suspiscions I guess) then slowly calmed down and started talking about the boots. Ultimately, a deal was agreed.

Again, this is what I think, I might be wrong. Shel's story just does not add up. I'm no racist and no Roofie, but there are some shitty JP players as well as excellent and nice ones!

It still does not change the fact tho that Vang, you got suckered into this like a damn n00b!!! Sheeesh!

 

[vang]

I can agree with most of what Shel said until the deal came up, that lying motherfucker. I will go in direct detail.


Shel said -> (Strider Boots) (trade?) (Peacock Charm) ?


at this point I remembered seeing Shel's name on the list of the PCC and knew he was wealthy and assumed he had a PCC. I immediatley let emotion take over and got excited. I cant go quote for quote but this is DEFINATELY a rough version of the dialogue.

Vang : (Really?) Shel have (Peacock Charm) ok?
Vang : Shel (Peacock Charm) (Trade) for Vang (Strider boots) (Yes Please)
Shel : Ok
Vang: Shel >> (Peacock Charm) no (Lie) (Please) : :
Shel: yes
Shel: (Strider boots) (Delivery Box)
Vang: Send to Shel (Delivery Box) Shel send (Peacock Charm) to Vang ok?
Shel: (Yes Please) ok
Vang: No (lie) : : ok?
Vang: No (lie) (Please) : :
Shel: ok no (lie)
Vang: (Trade) (Thank you) (Thank you) (Thank you) ^^

at this point I was in Port Jeuno Basement by the AH...for some reason I ran into the choco stable to think about it and decided I would write a tell to myself for INSURANCE purpose which proved to do nothing.

Vang: /tell Vang: If a GM reads this, there has been a problem. The deal is Shel trade Peacock charm for Vang's Strider Boots.

I sent it to myself, this was not word for word, but the deal was DEFINATELY telled to myself. Be advised about 2 minutes have gone by.

I proceeded to the Delivery guy by the AH and took my boots out of bazaar and placed them in the box. Reluctantly I hit send. Now after I hit send, I messaged Shel on my way to my MH to await my PCC.

Vang: (Boots) sent ok?
Vang: (Boots) (Delivery Box) ok?
Shel: Shel (Party) (Boyada Tree)--> then (trade) ok?

I immediately stopped dead in my tracks and knew I had been fucked. I ran to my outbox in Port and checked. The boots were gone BUT my other 2 items i had sent earlier to my mule were still in the outbox (Mules hadnt picked them up)

Vang: (Boots) (Do you have it?) no (lie) (please) no (lie) : :
Vang: (Trade) (Charm) (Seramongue Champaign)

I tracked her down and got on my bird to go get my charm, nervously.
I was out in Champaign and there Shel was NOT on a chocobo I immediatly thought she just ran out for an alibi to act like she wasnt in her MH at the time i sent.

I hop off my bird and she goes to trade, She never put up a PCC in the trade box didn't even show it to me. I stayed there for 20 seconds with the trade open waiting on her and finally:

Vang: ?
Shel: (boots)?
Vang: NO! Shel have (boots) (delivery box)!!!!!!
Vang: Shel (lie) : :
Shel: no (lie)

You get the point.

I check Shels gear in Saramongue and guess what? A level 63 RNG with no PCC equiped! He had a fucking Rangers necklace on, now I will ask any Ranger that has EVER played the game what they would rather be wearing and Im sure you can guess what they will say.

So I say:

Vang: Shel no (Peacock Charm) wearing (Rangers necklace) why?
Shel: Characters X2
Vang: you (lie) : :
Shel : Defrect

I check Price history and Shel had sold his PCC, go ahead and check it he is still up there. He then told me Defrect had the "other" PCC and that

Shel: (Ranger) ->> (Rangers Necklace) (Ninja) --->(Peacock Charm)

at this point i knew i had been had.

You dirty fucking liar, give me my boots back, or your fucking PCC. Stop lying to the JP community you piece of shit.

 

[vang]

and btw Shel spoke pretty decent english that night, yet now he claims not to be able to.

 

[Shia]

Its really in some extent what I expected. When bad thing happens amoung two people, the first thing they will state is their innocense. Wich I believe is the nature of a human being of avoiding being Hurt (in a different sence of course).

I am not trying to betray Tiamat but Shel does have in a sort a pretty bad rep amoung the JP boards. But then again, the whole JP Quetz board is a giant flame thread. If svina knows JP well enough he could see that there is nothing more than cursing eachother, the report of bad players, report of players who suck and so on. Randomly some stupid comments kicks in but really that is all about the Quetz msg board. Well 2CH boards were always like that anyways.

JP community usually lies on LS home pages, information sites such as allakhazam, FFXIonline.com and such. The server boards are usually to rant. Many information has come from the Quetz server, and I know some things are to be true. Shel's name, well I have seen countless times. Horihori for controling the leather crafting market long before NA players came in is nothing new. His reputation aswell is pretty bad. At the very least amoung the "Normal players".

I don't know what will be the solution. Wether make the GM solve (yeah maybe...) the case, or one of them get banned one way or the other. It is a piece of item of loads of cash which it is really hard to tell someone, IT is a hard lesson you must learn.

 

[Mr.Wonko]

its not being a racist or a biggot if u hate every1 equally

It's a sad day when someone plagiarizes a keychain.

 

[Mr.Wonko]

say it in english or dont fucking bother, i dont read squigly lines

What the hell do you think English is, then?

 

[Phraust]

say it in english or dont fucking bother, i dont read squigly lines

What the hell do you think English is, then?

English is Greek Ebonics....

 

[Svina]

I don't suppose horihori has leathercrafting mules then does he? I always thought he was clothcraft? He wouldn't happen to be this Zcbm/Azcbm/Junkim fella would he?

 

[Shia]

I am pretty sure in JP boards it stated Horihori is controling leather craft market. Trying to dig out but it was an old topic.

 

[Svina]

I am pretty sure in JP boards it stated Horihori is controling leather craft market. Trying to dig out but it was an old topic.

Hm... doesn't seem like it... but if those are his mules then I could see it. He certainly has a grip on archer rings... but I've managed to beat him in that game otherwise... <_<

 

[Falsey]

A. Why would Vang lie?

B. Why would he single out Shel even if he did lie?

C. As he said, he thought Shel could be trusted, and when offered a very rare item like the PCC Vang did not think clearly. If someone came up to you on the street and said that they will trade you their Ferrari for your Mercedes(i feel the comparrison is just :lol: ) would you not get all gitty? I sure as hell would.

D. Shel had the upper hand, and thus it would be 100 times easier to lie, since Vang put so much trust into him.

E. Vang I wish you had fraps running thrugh all this, and could prove your innocence to both JP and NA.

F. How does Svina get involved in said "Conspiracy"? He came in waaaaay after the fact, and mearly questioned Shel.

 

[Shia]

Sorry about offtopic. @svina.

It is not a surprising sight that high end crafters has mules with high craft. In fact, one of the web pages which I visit who writes a diary about dayly(well almost) event in FFXI, this is in Gilgamesh and not here, has 5 mules with each one of them having 90+ skills on different trade skills. And all have airpass (bought) at lvl 1~5 so go figure... not surprising high end JP crafters has 90+ crafting skill mules at their disposal.

 

[Davio]

I dont think vang lied about this story.

Ive had experience with this Player SHEL.
She attempted to MPK my PT in Beaduex on a Coffer hunt :/.

Either she was farming the scrolls on the Saphire, or the key itself.
I just dont like this player and she has been on my B-list for quite a long time...

 

[decidence]

Why does Shel's gear not reflect how rich he is... gil seller?

 

[Davio]

Just tell Shel to trade back the boots and everything is setteled.

Shel does indeed have the boots on her right now no?
If she keeps them, then YES she is a dirty whore.
Tiamat just tell Shel to give them back. :/

 

[Svina]

Why does Shel's gear not reflect how rich he is... gil seller?

Apparently it isn't uncommon for JP who pull in so much money they can literally make a living IRL off it. I think Lucifar is one such person :|...

 

[Sparky]

i read an ad in the newspaper, this guy wanted 800 bucks for an antique watch. I called him up and told him i would buy the watch. Then i sent 800 bucks to his house, i mean, we COULD have met up and did the deal... but NAH! He never sent the watch to me!?! omg!