WAR testing

[meeze]

just froze, I'm going to pull out...I really wanted some merits =/

 

[Lenneth]

what time is this going? 8/8 katana 4/4 crit, no pcc/hauby+1 though

 

[Mai Ikari]

I can fill in on NIN or MNK if you don't get any other offers.

 

[Nugotugo]

Pretty pumped about tonight. 10pm EST:
Me -- WAR/NIN (JUG/RID)
Meeze -- NIN/WAR
BDFakamistra -- WAR/??? (SAM or NIN, unsure)
Phraustytop -- SAM/??? (most likely war)
Baj (if possible) -- BRD
Nugs -- WHM

Results will be posted after, aiming to parse in Nyzul Isle again to remove any weapon advantages from any jobs.

I'll come /SAM

MP should be fun tonight.

 

[Lenneth]

actually im going to have to cancel, lol

 

[Mistra]

New parse is up. Post-update data.

The specs-

Phraust: SAM/WAR (Ushikirimaru)
Jamal: WAR/NIN (Jugg/Ridill)
Ikari: NIN/WAR (Senju/Unji)
Bigdumbface: WAR/SAM (Martial Bhuj)

Gear can be seen in previous posts.

Phraust died toward the end. I died at the beginning. Overall it evened things out a bit. Was a fun party.

*edit* Sizes are small, I know. Resized them poorly I guess. Y'all will live.

 

[jamal]

I thought I lost by 1.5%...but i misread and its only like .75%...so its really quite even. Had phraust not DA'd on like 18/20 ws's near the end the numbers would have been even closer lol...

 

[Crosis]

Too much MP sponge action going on there it looks like lol. 30k damage taken from Phraust and Mistra and in the end it was almost a tie. I wasn't there but I'll assume Haste dropped a bit because of the damage taken.

I'd probably give the edge to Ridill WARs still for top DD, at least for MP efficiency. Or MNK/WAR for total DD

 

[Zethren]

Also, Phraust and Bigdumbface were using meat(Good stuff too, not meatkabobs).
Jamar was using Sushi. So I think these tests are tainteddddddd
We need to do it again

 

[Zethren]

Too much MP sponge action going on there it looks like lol. 30k damage taken from Phraust and Mistra and in the end it was almost a tie. I wasn't there but I'll assume Haste dropped a bit because of the damage taken.

I'd probably give the edge to Ridill WARs still for top DD, at least for MP efficiency. Or MNK/WAR for total DD

Go to bed Croface D:

 

[Zethren]

Too much MP sponge action going on there it looks like lol. 30k damage taken from Phraust and Mistra and in the end it was almost a tie. I wasn't there but I'll assume Haste dropped a bit because of the damage taken.

I'd probably give the edge to Ridill WARs still for top DD, at least for MP efficiency. Or MNK/WAR for total DD

Yeah Curing was a big thing. Brd mage sub really helped out in some spots. I think someone may have died once or twice if the brd was hehninsj

 

[Phraust]

lolushikirimaru

As for the Dmg taken. Was still trying to figure out how much I could sway in the party, I actually wasn't pulling hate in the beginning half, so I started to use Hasso instead of Seigan and then started using Berserk later. As compared to last time, I was using Hedgehog Pies this time, in contrast to the Red Curry of last time. I'm still getting use to the idea of using Sam as a merit job, it's tough.

Gripes:
1) Can't time WS properly, Every fight I gained about 250 TP, and It was dumb. I'd either nail a WS to start, or I'd be holding an enormous amout of TP til the end. The problem was, that aside from the weaponskills, I was hitting for 140 a swing. Even if I didn't WS, on the mobs that no voke was up, I'd pull hate on a Double attack (Mistra Too).

2) Subbing ninja on sam is not an option. Whn you use either Hasso or Seigan, you double the recast timers on any and all spells. so I could forgo the use of them, but then I would be gimping my damage so badly, I would have no need for them in the first place. As using them makes it akward having to cancel Hasso, to cast utsusemi. The 60 second recast on hasso makes it nearly impossible to keep up for any reasonable amount of time, leaving the only other option, using it strictly for weaponskills. I have tried /nin, and even at my best. I lose about 20% of my damage.

Changes/Experiments:
1) I would like to try a run as-is, but using Soborro Sukehiro rather than the AF1 weapon I was using. Kinda curious as to how it performs. I presume the lower damage, with higher frequency should make my Spike damage and hate gathering smooth out.

2) I would like to try to do a /Drg sub, just to see how it is on hate ballance/damage/accuracy. I pretty much used that as my main sub for the majority of my Sam career.

3) REALLY curious as to what /Mnk would be like. Maybe Counter and dodge, Boost for WS, and Chakra for some quick HP, would be worth their merits in a merit pt.

4) I am going to Merit my Great Katana merits soon. Yes, that's right... My GK is STILL unmerited... So that along with Mnk sub are my next two tasks to take care of.

Anyways I had fun. Really happy to do these testing parties, as I hate meriting. Somehow meriting for a reason seems a lot better.

You guys wann atry again next week?

 

[jamal]

2) Subbing ninja on sam is not an option. Whn you use either Hasso or Seigan, you double the recast timers on any and all spells. so I could forgo the use of them, but then I would be gimping my damage so badly, I would have no need for them in the first place. As using them makes it akward having to cancel Hasso, to cast utsusemi. The 60 second recast on hasso makes it nearly impossible to keep up for any reasonable amount of time, leaving the only other option, using it strictly for weaponskills. I have tried /nin, and even at my best. I lose about 20% of my damage.

Because of this SAM isn't a prime option for meriting. I compare it to MNK/WAR...yes they can do incredible damage, but the mp sponge effect negates any positives to the party. Phraust, you mention that subbing NIN lessens your dmg by 20%, but the entire party's damage potential was lowered by 15% for most of the night due to lack of haste because of your and mistra's subs. This isn't acceptable by any means. I'm not saying it to be mean, but its a reality.
A MNK/WAR could claim the same, that they would gain 20% more dmg by subbing war, but they don't because they realize the negatives outweigh the positives in a party setting. The same is true with pulling dmg via DoT damage, thats why the shadows are there.
My recasts were all thrown out of wack because of the lack of haste, all caused by the constant Cure IV and V spams. Even with non-hasted recasts, my dmg was .75% less than Phraust and Mistra's...yet my dmg taken was 30% (approximate) less than each of them.
Frankly I'm happy with the results, as them using a prime damage sub is only a .75% difference in total damage. Party efficiency wise, hands down there's no question what is more effective. I've harped to MNKs before, and looks like I'll have to harp to SAMs too...if you want to maximize experience, the ability to minimize damage taken while still doing optimum damage is vitally important.

 

[CmdrFly]

3) REALLY curious as to what /Mnk would be like. Maybe Counter and dodge, Boost for WS, and Chakra for some quick HP, would be worth their merits in a merit pt.

I've been thinking about this myself. Was contemplating bringing a WAR/MNK into the next sub parse, but just doesn't seem at all worth it compared to /DRG or /SAM (/WAR in your case).

 

[Tagrineth]

Looks like SE fixed the imbalance, at least for merits. Amazing. They actually did it.

 

[jamal]

Also, Phraust and Bigdumbface were using meat(Good stuff too, not meatkabobs).
Jamar was using Sushi. So I think these tests are tainteddddddd
We need to do it again

Just saw this. Normally you would try to use similar foods, but for these tests with the vast differences between Dual-Weilding and 2-handed weapons, using similar foods would skew results as follows:

If all used sushi: Two-handers would have vastly less damage, as accuracy is never an issue with them, and therefore would wasted. My dmg percentage would vastly increase if all using sushi.

If all used meat: Dual-weilding jobs would have vastly less damage, as accuracy would be a huge issue. My dmg percentage would vastly decrease if all used meat.

So really, this is the closest you can get to viable results due to the accuracy boost obtained from DEX=ACC on Two-handed weapons.

 

[Mistra]

Just saw this. Normally you would try to use similar foods, but for these tests with the vast differences between Dual-Weilding and 2-handed weapons, using similar foods would skew results as follows:

If all used sushi: Two-handers would have vastly less damage, as accuracy is never an issue with them, and therefore would wasted. My dmg percentage would vastly increase if all using sushi.

If all used meat: Dual-weilding jobs would have vastly less damage, as accuracy would be a huge issue. My dmg percentage would vastly decrease if all used meat.

So really, this is the closest you can get to viable results due to the accuracy boost obtained from DEX=ACC on Two-handed weapons.

Aye, I believe we've tested pretty appropriately in this respect. When it comes to food, each individiual needs to be using what suits them the most.

 

[Zethren]

Just saw this. Normally you would try to use similar foods, but for these tests with the vast differences between Dual-Weilding and 2-handed weapons, using similar foods would skew results as follows:

If all used sushi: Two-handers would have vastly less damage, as accuracy is never an issue with them, and therefore would wasted. My dmg percentage would vastly increase if all using sushi.

If all used meat: Dual-weilding jobs would have vastly less damage, as accuracy would be a huge issue. My dmg percentage would vastly decrease if all used meat.

So really, this is the closest you can get to viable results due to the accuracy boost obtained from DEX=ACC on Two-handed weapons.

I really just said that so we could PT again, haha. And for that camp where we were I think it would have been good to decrease some damage. There is no point in killing so fast that we're just standing around waiting for mobs to pop and losing chain.

 

[jamal]

I really just said that so we could PT again, haha

lol...well that went right over my head. My bad.

TBH, I'm VERY suprised MNKs haven't joined for the most part in this debate. If I were a MNK and seeing MP-Spongebob Phraustpants doing l33t damage while subbing WAR, I'd be poking and prodding to get into the party while subbing WAR.

North Thix is a great camp for experience, but not good for parsing damage. There's too many puks scattered in where people can purposely go after them for higher damage while the party is fighting a tougher mob. With the camp we've been at, the only lesser mobs you really encounter are the occasional wyvern from the DRGs

 

[Bajaratt]

I could try joining in on my monk, although I'm still missing a piece of gear or two and some merits. Sorry I couldn't hang around for the parse on saturday, my internet has been shitting itself at night lately. Glad to see you guys got some good results though.