Why hate the new gil helper ppl thing...~

But in that effect, bread and gasoline would be currency, cuz I trade a lot of real money for bread and gasoline every month. What's the difference?

This would be a very good discussion for a college business law class. :lol:
 
What are you talking about? It's not like your trading thousands of dollars here. The government has no interest in small currency transfers. You can go to any world bank and say,"hey give me $100 in euros, or rupies." Or whatever the fuck you want to change it too and it's just like buying cigarettes at the local 7-11. You pay a small amout during the transfer, but it's all about exchange rates. The worst thing that selling gil will do to this game, which it already has done drastically, is lower the worth of the gil. Now instead of silk thread costing 700 a spool it's what now 2k a spool? Because the gil is weak from so much of it being in circulation.


BTW,The papers that you have to fill out are probably insurance quotes and accounting more than anything that uncle sam has to do with.
 
Shaunessy said:
What are you talking about? It's not like your trading thousands of dollars here. The government has no interest in small currency transfers. You can go to any world bank and say,"hey give me $100 in euros, or rupies." Or whatever the fuck you want to change it too and it's just like buying cigarettes at the local 7-11. You pay a small amout during the transfer, but it's all about exchange rates. The worst thing that selling gil will do to this game, which it already has done drastically, is lower the worth of the gil. Now instead of silk thread costing 700 a spool it's what now 2k a spool? Because the gil is weak from so much of it being in circulation.


BTW,The papers that you have to fill out are probably insurance quotes and accounting more than anything that uncle sam has to do with.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if you're defending the practice as harmless . . . but this is EXACTLY the worst that can happen.

To me, the strongest argument against gilselling is that people who are willing to throw an extra $50 a month into the game to keep their pocketbooks lined weaken the gil's value so that those of us who do farm for our net worth have to work that much harder.

$13/month may not be much for a game, but $33 or $63 or $113 or whatever is.

Anyway, I spent months logging Ghelsba, Jugner, and Bubu to get a woodworking mule up to 87 so far, and I feel bad when I craft arrows or shihei for profit, or ESPECIALLY sell stacks of silk from Bubu cralwers, that I'm taking advantage of the inflation. But I guess that's the world that we play in.
 
Well yeah.


Gilsellers don't bother me. To me they camp monsters all day long, that I don't have the time to, and even craft the things into the items I need. Now, unless I'm mistaken, I'm fairly sure gilsellers don't drive up the price of items. It's players who want to squeeze that extra k into their wallet, by hoping the person over bids. Then the next bastard in line, sees it sold for that extra 4k, and either equals that, or tries to push it up again. It's all about making gil, anyway a person can

. From what I've seen, atleast gilsellers offer consistent pricing, consistent with what the current price is. So don't blame the gilsellers for the pour status of our economy. Blame them for making the gil, blame them for camping the monsters. But the inflation problem is the -players- fault. So no need in complaining about inflation and using them as your outlet.

Players need to stand up and take responsibility for the mistakes we make.

Just my opinion

- Mal
 
DarleneFFXI said:
That really is the point. Is it a service? Is it a money exchange?
Click to expand...
I don't think gil can be classified as a legal form of currency. It is data on a server, which is exchanged for other data on a server.

If what you said in your first post was applicable to MMOs, then we wouldn't see Sony opening their service where they sell in-game currency and items for RL money. I can't remember what that service was called, but it was announced just a couple months ago. Regardless, if gil was considered a legal form of currency then that would mean Sony just opened up as a bank, which is not exactly a hardware / software developer's forté.
 
[quote="pakomen"But in that effect, bread and gasoline would be currency, cuz I trade a lot of real money for bread and gasoline every month. What's the difference?

This would be a very good discussion for a college business law class. :lol:[/quote]

In sweden (I dunno about NA though) we call this kind of "cash" for Natura, and was used in the medieval times. They didn't use money in order to buy things/pay taxes, they gave the land lords what the got from their own farm. They gave them seed, meat etc. in order to pay their taxes. They also used it to trade for something they needed more. Eventually though, people started accepting money, and used that as trading instead. And even later, the bills came. This was because they ordered money from the local smith, and they got a bill in return, which they later traded in for money. But because people are lazy, they started tradign the bills with eachother too.

Either way, selling in-game currency is illegal, since it's SE's game, so everything in the game is property to them. Not you, not me, not anyone else but the company. And therefor, the gil sellers are stealing their stuff and selling it. How is this not illegal? They have no right, according to law, to sell their stuff.
 
ugh, I flai at teh intrnet ; ;
 
The intelligence stops NOW!! Direct your attention to me people, theres nothing to see here.


:D :) :( :o :lol: 8) :? :shock: :x :P :oops: :cry: :wink: :roll: :twisted: :evil: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow: :D :) :( :o :lol: 8) :? :shock: :x :P :oops: :cry: :wink: :roll: :twisted: :evil: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow: :D :) :( :o :lol: 8) :? :shock: :x :P :oops: :cry: :wink: :roll: :twisted: :evil: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow: :D :) :( :o :lol: 8) :? :shock: :x :P :oops: :cry: :wink: :roll: :twisted: :evil: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow: :D :) :( :o :lol: 8) :? :shock: :x :P :oops: :cry: :wink: :roll: :twisted: :evil: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow: :D :) :( :o :lol: 8) :? :shock: :x :P :oops: :cry: :wink: :roll: :twisted: :evil: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow: :D :) :( :o :lol: 8) :? :shock: :x :P :oops: :cry: :wink: :roll: :twisted: :evil: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow:


INT level down...
 
Forgive me for using only one currency symbol, but it's more to strate a point.

gil = electronic
$ = physical
credit = electronic equivilent of ($)
creadit/$ = service (modern method)
service = gil
service = service (other method practiced)
credit/$ = service = gil


essentially, no matter how you look at it, $ = gil. A good example, go try winning a car or some other item more than $20-50. If you're in the USA the IRS will want taxes from it. They are able to tax any currency or service exchanged. Obviously when you're looking at mowing your neighbor's yard so she will bake you up some of her cookies or give you $5, no government should waste the effort. But with how big of a business gil selling must be to give Gil Sellers initiative to risk getting characters of sufficient level to camp big ticket items should get the notice of any country, especially in the taxes area.
 
ugh... typos. it's State not Strate. Any others I hope will be easily figured out. <.<
 
Currency (money) is any medium of exchange for goods and services. Whether its cash, credit, gems, gil or gold bullion, its all currency. (and in IRS 's point of view.. taxable.
 
what ive seen saluteII seem to be a pretty liget shell even though half of them are gilseller. redsky on the other hand which is prob the bigest seller signicate this server camping every mob from bune to cassie and even mobs like loo and sozu. they have now problem with botting and even some cases of mpking.
 
I'm not arguing that gil isn't some form of currency, I'm arguing that it isn't a legal form of currency and as such doesn't abide by the same laws and regulations that our colourful bills and shiny coins do.

We as people are paying money for the service provided by SE. That is the highest, broadest, and most generalized visage of this pyramid. Gil is a portion of the service provided by SE. They are allowing us to trade portions of their service (gil) for other portions of their service (items), as part of the overall service to which we are subscribed.

Thus, SE is basically the 'bank'. They own everything. They can give and they can take at will, because everything belongs to them. Not that this has anything to do with the OP, but I'm a man and damnit when someone tells me I'm wrong I have to do anything in my power (up to and including complete failure and embarassment) to argue my point. Particularly on the flameboard.

Ultimately, from what limited economical knowledge I possess, the government should have no right or interest in fake currency. It is not something they can tax, exploit, or create - it is a subset of another company's service that applies to that service alone.
 
>_<... "money is the mother's milk of politics&qu

I'm not sure if people realize this, but according to IRS rules, if you make any sort of trade for goods/services in exchange for goods/services you are required to pay taxes on the value of the exchange ( http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc420.html ). You are required to report ANY income made in any way.

It's like Tip O'Neill said, "money is the mother's milk of politics." Money is being exchanged, the government wants to know about it. The fact that it's being exchanged for a non-tangible resource like "virtual money," makes it evern more worriesome to these people. I know it's a difficult concept, but there have been legal decisions made against investment firms that had *virtual* money based upon *real* stocks. When money is involved, and lets face it...there is a reason these gilsellers are in China and other such places...Governments will take an interest.
 
A little off topic, but there's one thing I've never quite understood. Why is it that the whole FFXI community and SE itself seems to be so against gil selling, but most of the major websites with info about FFXI are advertising for the companies selling gil. I don't get it. They make it far too easy to buy gil, and an ffxi beginner probably wouldn't see the harm in just clicking the link, buying a few million, and being on his merry way.

Examples:
http://mysterytour.web.infoseek.co.jp/ffxi/us/
http://www.killingifrit.com/

Is Allakhazam the only major one NOT linking to gilseller sites?
 
why should i care how they choose to make their gil? one imagines all it means is less gil per actual seller. less gil = less rice... less rice = more gilsellers quitting... doesn't it?

we flamed colbwa cause he was colbwa and he was rejected from every NA HNM shell...

Honestly, look at what most of the gilsellers do... roc >>> serket >>> cassie >>> simmy >>> lumberjack >>> bune... or whatever... that's what i imagined an end game hnm ls would do a lot of... back to back HNM... yeah behemoth or adamantoise tossed in but i mean.. honestly, i thought there were normal NA LS's who do that... guess again, there aren't
 
Business of Banner Adds

Banner Adds are more or less the only way most web gateways make any money. But they are paid more ..or in some cases ONLY...if you click on the link and go someplace. So the best way to list only the adds you are gonna click on...is to sort through the web page and figure out the words in the web page that there are adds listed. Look at my yahoo web page http://www.geocities.com/darleneffxi. The main page has the words "Final Fantasy" so...they obviously have lots of those adds. But the page with "keys" (for key mobs) or "mines" (gusgen mines) the adds change.

Annoying...but some has to pay for it. You gotta love QCDN....no banner adds...thanks to who ever is paying for it.
 
Web hosting is cheap, and phpbb is free :lol: Gotta love phpBB. Can run a badass forum for next to nothing aside from time involved to keep things running smoothly.
 
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