Seawolf said:
if prices drop, no one will make it anymore since it will no longer be profitable. i feel sorry for all the alchemists who used to make a killing on bullets.
now... why would anyone want to play rng anymore?
if prices drop, no one will make it anymore since it will no longer be profitable. i feel sorry for all the alchemists who used to make a killing on bullets.
now... why would anyone want to play rng anymore?
I've been away from the game for about a month (credit card screw ups...) and ive been keeping upto date with the update info. When i can finaly play agian i wont give a crap about the RNG nerf, im only lvl 60 so im not at the end-game stuff but ill just be happy to play again 
.
the facted is that i dont care (and i dont think alot of RNGs care) if i gotta step back a bit to do max damage, even if its true that ill miss more because of this thats my problem... i chosen to play RNG and i knew when i pick the job that ive gotta use my own gil to buy ammo.
RNGs are a great choose for any sort of party, so i dont see what everyones problem is.
. the facted is that i dont care (and i dont think alot of RNGs care) if i gotta step back a bit to do max damage, even if its true that ill miss more because of this thats my problem... i chosen to play RNG and i knew when i pick the job that ive gotta use my own gil to buy ammo.
RNGs are a great choose for any sort of party, so i dont see what everyones problem is.
Damn you Taurothar
Damn you for always saying what I want to before I can respond, lol. These are gods people, you would think with that type of title they would be around the same if not more difficult than Vyrtra/ Tiamat, however it would appear they aren't up to the challenge level of nastier HNM's as I see countless people strolling around with Kirin's Osode(almost always RNG's) and Byakko's Haidate(RNG's again). According to the opening post, these mobs are impossible without the god like power of the amazing RNG job. Well, SE decided that maybe it was time to even the playing field a bit. Maybe RNG shouldn't be the only job necessary for a God fight. I honestly don't think any one job should be necessary for success in any fight. This game is about bloody team work, not the superstar RNG. People are making a mountain into a mole hill, RNG is now restricted by the same damage physics on IT+ mobs that most other jobs have faced for a while and all they can do is scream bloody murder.
I don't agree with the weapon skill gimp if that indeed does turn out to be the case(somehow I think there is a solution to get to 700+ damage back Sidewinder used to do, if not SE needs to unfuck it). On a side note I Ballista'd with RNG last night in level 30 cap, and I have started to appreciate the specific "sweet spot" for each type of weapon. However I did notice Barrage was considerabley more difficult to use properly, which I actually enjoyed. Going to try it again tonight with a gun and see how it varies from Crossbow/Bow. upclose damage is crap but in all reality a RNG should never want to be close to a mob anyways. Advice for soloing, I think crossbow just became the weapon of choice, sleep bolts + shadowbind , will be an optimum strategy in the future IMO. and you may have to kite mobs to maintain sweet spot distance.
I love RNG's but they were incredibly over powered, that point really isn't up for debate. They had all the advantages and really no draw backs(cost maybe but I'm not convinced on how considerably more expensive RNG is from alot of other jobs) and SE tried to make the job require ability. Alot of things never get tried in this game because of preconcieved notions, best exemplified in the conglomeration in certain spots for exp, cookie cutter gear set-ups and worst of all, exclusion of certain jobs from certain events. When I first tackled the promyvions I was under the impression only RNG/NIN, WAR/NIN, SMN, and WHM were the only jobs capable of completing the boss fights, what horse shit. In the end, this game should boil down to 2 factors, teamwork and ability. I'll always pick a well balanced party over a shit kicker party.
Taurothar said:
Damn you for always saying what I want to before I can respond, lol. These are gods people, you would think with that type of title they would be around the same if not more difficult than Vyrtra/ Tiamat, however it would appear they aren't up to the challenge level of nastier HNM's as I see countless people strolling around with Kirin's Osode(almost always RNG's) and Byakko's Haidate(RNG's again). According to the opening post, these mobs are impossible without the god like power of the amazing RNG job. Well, SE decided that maybe it was time to even the playing field a bit. Maybe RNG shouldn't be the only job necessary for a God fight. I honestly don't think any one job should be necessary for success in any fight. This game is about bloody team work, not the superstar RNG. People are making a mountain into a mole hill, RNG is now restricted by the same damage physics on IT+ mobs that most other jobs have faced for a while and all they can do is scream bloody murder.
I don't agree with the weapon skill gimp if that indeed does turn out to be the case(somehow I think there is a solution to get to 700+ damage back Sidewinder used to do, if not SE needs to unfuck it). On a side note I Ballista'd with RNG last night in level 30 cap, and I have started to appreciate the specific "sweet spot" for each type of weapon. However I did notice Barrage was considerabley more difficult to use properly, which I actually enjoyed. Going to try it again tonight with a gun and see how it varies from Crossbow/Bow. upclose damage is crap but in all reality a RNG should never want to be close to a mob anyways. Advice for soloing, I think crossbow just became the weapon of choice, sleep bolts + shadowbind , will be an optimum strategy in the future IMO. and you may have to kite mobs to maintain sweet spot distance.
I love RNG's but they were incredibly over powered, that point really isn't up for debate. They had all the advantages and really no draw backs(cost maybe but I'm not convinced on how considerably more expensive RNG is from alot of other jobs) and SE tried to make the job require ability. Alot of things never get tried in this game because of preconcieved notions, best exemplified in the conglomeration in certain spots for exp, cookie cutter gear set-ups and worst of all, exclusion of certain jobs from certain events. When I first tackled the promyvions I was under the impression only RNG/NIN, WAR/NIN, SMN, and WHM were the only jobs capable of completing the boss fights, what horse shit. In the end, this game should boil down to 2 factors, teamwork and ability. I'll always pick a well balanced party over a shit kicker party.
Stouter said:
You know what? There's a difference between "balance" and "equal".
Equal is every job doing the exact same thing, and having no merits above the other jobs. That's what you're describing.
Balanced is each job being different, BUT each job has opportunities where it shines. Balance isn't saying every job is equally able to do anything, balance is saying that each job is equally able to do something.
Ithenas said it best: "As for the leeching thing, i'll say this. Of all the gods i've faught you only need 5 jobs to take any one of them down. RNG BLM PLD WHM and RDM, no more no less, granted you need those in masse but still an alliance filled w/ those jobs and only those jobs (not saying others cant, but these are the minimum requirements) can drop any god you will encounter in sky."
Know what makes RNG and BLM different from PLD, WHM, and RDM? The first two are damage dealing jobs. The other three don't deal damage.
Now, BLM's a little different, since they rely on having MP to deal damage, and I think that if you ran a parser and recorded everyone's damage during a god fight under the old system, the BLM's damage wouldn't be as high as the RNG's damage, and probably be closer to the other melee (assuming there are other melee), since they have to rest after casting a few nukes. Well, at least they'd be closer to other melee's damage if melee were allowed to fight (from what I've read, most melee just sit on the sidelines, chug sleep potions, then use a WS and go back to sleeping).
(Also, go ahead and correct me if I'm wrong, I've never fought Kirin or the other gods - don't even have a sky pass yet - so I don't have any idea how those fights unfold aside from what I read on the forums)
But RNG have no need to stop fighting, and can constantly fire arrows/bolts/bullets. I think that if there wasn't a need for BLM's non-damage spells (Stun, backup cures, etc), you could just drop the BLMs and use only RNGs for DD.
And you could do this on any god. ANY god. THAT is imbalance. THAT is one job being clearly better than the others.
Now, if SE wants to re-work God fights, here's an idea: have each of the four mini-gods weak to a different form of attack. One should be weak to magic, one to piercing damage (bow/guns, polearms, daggers), one to blunt damage (clubs, fists, staves), and one to slashing (just about everything else). Make it highly resistant to all other forms of damage. Then lower its attacking power so you don't have to constantly kite it. That would be balanced - each fight needs different DD jobs to kill it, BUT each job gets its time to shine in one of the fights. BLMs and RDM/BLMs can nuke the magic-weak one, DRKs, SAMs, WARs, etc can kill the slashing-weak one, MNKs can demolish the blunt-weak one, and RNGs, DRGs, and THFs get to have fun with the piercing-weak one.
As for Kirin, tone down his attacking power so you can stop kiting him, and just make all forms of damage equally strong on him.
Alchemy huh?
it's a capitalist market, if price drops and supply lingers with a demand(and believe me there are alot of RNG's out there still) price will increase again. There will probably be massive AH fluctuations at first but it will stabalize. Your still going to have demand on the product, and any alchemist who realies soley on one crafting item is a damn fool anyways. With alchemy there are hundreds of items you can make money on and there will always be a demand for the products(silent oil, prism powder, ether, potions, bolt heads), to say you would feel sorry for alchemist cause they can't make one item is absurd. Alchemy is the ultimate trade IMO cause unlike gear crafting where you are tailoring to specific jobs you are constanly manufacturing something all jobs can use. and my answer to you on why would anyone want to play RNG anymore? For the same reason people play DRG, MNK, WAR, SAM, etc..... cause it's the job they find to be fun and enjoy playing. If you were just playing the job to be the superstar... good luck to you in this game.
Thefonz
level 60 alchemy
yanzi said:
it's a capitalist market, if price drops and supply lingers with a demand(and believe me there are alot of RNG's out there still) price will increase again. There will probably be massive AH fluctuations at first but it will stabalize. Your still going to have demand on the product, and any alchemist who realies soley on one crafting item is a damn fool anyways. With alchemy there are hundreds of items you can make money on and there will always be a demand for the products(silent oil, prism powder, ether, potions, bolt heads), to say you would feel sorry for alchemist cause they can't make one item is absurd. Alchemy is the ultimate trade IMO cause unlike gear crafting where you are tailoring to specific jobs you are constanly manufacturing something all jobs can use. and my answer to you on why would anyone want to play RNG anymore? For the same reason people play DRG, MNK, WAR, SAM, etc..... cause it's the job they find to be fun and enjoy playing. If you were just playing the job to be the superstar... good luck to you in this game.
Thefonz
level 60 alchemy
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Seawolf said:
Maybe the sore RNGs out there can go out on contracts since they might not want to piggy back other lame-o, poopy melee jobs.
"Will work for arrows"
"100k for God services"
:roll: :lol:
This game has always been about community and cooperation. Each job brings something unique and special to the game. Different strategies can be implemented to keep the game fresh. SE has forced that issue in regards to many situations.
I don't see this as anything that will keep me from leveling RNG. Mine is only level 28 at the moment. I loved playing RNG before and I will love it when I pick it back up. I have jobs that I like more than others, but I have enjoyed every job I have tried so far (all but 2). I understand things are different, and "not as good as before", but things aren't bad. RNG should still be fun. If it's not, you can always try to make it fun, or try playing something else.
This is, after all, a game, and not meant to be so serious. The disclaimer most of us skip over mentions not to neglect the world outside of Vana'diel. I am certain more adjustments will be made in time. How many times has the dynamic of this game changed? Plenty, and it will continue to do so. That is what separates it from the offline FF series.
Through all the successes, hardships, friendships, adjustments, bullshit, time spent, money spent, new areas discovered, enemies bested...If the game isn't somehow fun, you shouldn't waste your precious time playing it.
If the game was awesome one day and then sucked ass the next, for me, I'd try to find fun once again...If I was unable to do so, I'd quit.
It's understood that the change bothers people to the point that they are angry and spiteful, but keep playing and trying to find fun with your RNG, crafting, questing, other job, etc. If you cannot, and the best solution for you is to leave, we would all wish you the best of luck in the real world...You know, where changes can mean something to you, rather than your computerized image.
Good luck to you all in game, or outside of the game.
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Cant really replace, blms with rngs... especially on kirin. hard to land nukes, unresisted. ONLY with that ENM Lamp can you landa ll yoaur nukes 100%. (btw, that thing owns, i got off 8 nukes on Kirin unresisted 20/20, non rechargeable, ENM takes 5 days after you lost/win. ENM is dead easy, i owned him meleeing him, this was 3months back)
Spriggan said:I've been away from the game for about a month (credit card screw ups...) and ive been keeping upto date with the update info. When i can finaly play agian i wont give a crap about the RNG nerf, im only lvl 60 so im not at the end-game stuff but ill just be happy to play again
the facted is that i dont care (and i dont think alot of RNGs care) if i gotta step back a bit to do max damage, even if its true that ill miss more because of this thats my problem... i chosen to play RNG and i knew when i pick the job that ive gotta use my own gil to buy ammo.
RNGs are a great choose for any sort of party, so i dont see what everyones problem is.
you will miss more and do less damage while paying more for it. why you would want to continue is beyond me.
Uhm, no job is cheap
Even now, if a melee is out DOT'ing a RNG with a basic accuracy/ranged attack + setup the melee has blown substantially more money on gear. Remember for all those bitches about ammo and Hawkers +1 most melees that are owning with high DD have 3-5 million dollar body pieces .5 million dollar weapons, Sniper rings(climbing to 1 million each very quickly as of yesterday) so on and so forth. For a standard melee DD to out DD a RNG even with the change will cost just as much if not more than a RNG. Being a primo Damage dealer isn't cheap no matter what job you pick. I am still convinced RNG is the best DOT melee in a standard exp party setup.
yanzi said:
Even now, if a melee is out DOT'ing a RNG with a basic accuracy/ranged attack + setup the melee has blown substantially more money on gear. Remember for all those bitches about ammo and Hawkers +1 most melees that are owning with high DD have 3-5 million dollar body pieces .5 million dollar weapons, Sniper rings(climbing to 1 million each very quickly as of yesterday) so on and so forth. For a standard melee DD to out DD a RNG even with the change will cost just as much if not more than a RNG. Being a primo Damage dealer isn't cheap no matter what job you pick. I am still convinced RNG is the best DOT melee in a standard exp party setup.
yanzi said:
what would you want me to do? take up another job and waste all the time ive put in RNG? no thanks i'd rather continue with RNG even if it will cost more gil per lvl.
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Kirin last night -
5 Rangers
2 BLM
We do Kirin with 20-25 tops and usuall kill him within 45 minutes.
9 deaths for me, 3 stacks of silvers, 2 stacks of darksteel bolts, 1 stack of squid sushi, and 1 stack of Shihe and Kirin was still at 3/4 health 3 hours into this fight and we decided to call it a night. My ranged attack with Hellfire+1 was hitting on average 35-50 with many misses. Preupdate I would hit Kirin for 110-130 and not miss.
Any good melee DD can keep up with Ranger in an exp. party and some can even do more damage than Ranger - i.e. Olsmugla (most of you know this badass Galka). DRK, SAM, THF, and DRG all have abilities that help a party more than just damage - sata, absorbs, stun, meditate for ws with multiple party members, etc. All a Ranger could do was deal damage and we were good at it.
The reason why SE really fucked up with this update is that they took away a job that was a very useful endgame job and made it almost useless now. What they should have done was make some of the other jobs more useful. DRG is no more useful, SAM is no more useful except for WS whore, DRK is still just a sub to RDM for stun.
What this boils down to is that the Rangers will be replaced by BLM and everyone else will still sit on the sideline. Hooray for SE for fucking up a perfectly good job instead of fixing the useless ones. Also, thank you SE for changing the dynamics of a job that I have been playing for over a year. Not really fun when everything you know about a job changes. If I continue to play this game it will just be to level SAM and WAR for the fun of it. Not much endgame stuff I can do now considering my next level of jobs are in the 30's.
Fuck everybody who thinks this is a good thing. 25 people in my LS were in shock lastnight from whm, bards,and blm to thf, drk, and drg and none were happy about this update because if affected them also. All the people who have been helping to get God endgame items (ie like the mages that were gonna lot on Kirin's pole) had the realization that our shell is probably gonna need an overhaul or die because we were Ranger strong and blm weak.
I am rambling but basically my point is this:
Make other jobs useful, dont fuck up the ones that are.
Foofighter
5 Rangers
2 BLM
We do Kirin with 20-25 tops and usuall kill him within 45 minutes.
9 deaths for me, 3 stacks of silvers, 2 stacks of darksteel bolts, 1 stack of squid sushi, and 1 stack of Shihe and Kirin was still at 3/4 health 3 hours into this fight and we decided to call it a night. My ranged attack with Hellfire+1 was hitting on average 35-50 with many misses. Preupdate I would hit Kirin for 110-130 and not miss.
Any good melee DD can keep up with Ranger in an exp. party and some can even do more damage than Ranger - i.e. Olsmugla (most of you know this badass Galka). DRK, SAM, THF, and DRG all have abilities that help a party more than just damage - sata, absorbs, stun, meditate for ws with multiple party members, etc. All a Ranger could do was deal damage and we were good at it.
The reason why SE really fucked up with this update is that they took away a job that was a very useful endgame job and made it almost useless now. What they should have done was make some of the other jobs more useful. DRG is no more useful, SAM is no more useful except for WS whore, DRK is still just a sub to RDM for stun.
What this boils down to is that the Rangers will be replaced by BLM and everyone else will still sit on the sideline. Hooray for SE for fucking up a perfectly good job instead of fixing the useless ones. Also, thank you SE for changing the dynamics of a job that I have been playing for over a year. Not really fun when everything you know about a job changes. If I continue to play this game it will just be to level SAM and WAR for the fun of it. Not much endgame stuff I can do now considering my next level of jobs are in the 30's.
Fuck everybody who thinks this is a good thing. 25 people in my LS were in shock lastnight from whm, bards,and blm to thf, drk, and drg and none were happy about this update because if affected them also. All the people who have been helping to get God endgame items (ie like the mages that were gonna lot on Kirin's pole) had the realization that our shell is probably gonna need an overhaul or die because we were Ranger strong and blm weak.
I am rambling but basically my point is this:
Make other jobs useful, dont fuck up the ones that are.
Foofighter
amen
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/clap
Foofighter said:
well put :!:
sky roster pre update
whm:
rdm:
brd:
pld:
blm:
rng:
useless: (not an attack on melee, but every melee knows =/)
sky roster post update
whm:
rdm:
brd:
pld:
blm:
usesless: (added rng)
like i've said, this is going to affect everyone, the only dd left in sky/land gods is blm. they don't really get anything that is worth the hours it takes to farm.
the job that used to get the most is rng, they also did the most. we have cancelled gods due to lack of the jobs listed above. we never cancelled due to not having enought drks or drg. now rangers join the useless crowd. sitting around building tp while blms stun and damage.
they should have alotted for other non casting jobs to be usefull, not nerf the one that was. SE just added another useless end game job, i think everyone should be a little upset about that.
whm:
rdm:
brd:
pld:
blm:
rng:
useless: (not an attack on melee, but every melee knows =/)
sky roster post update
whm:
rdm:
brd:
pld:
blm:
usesless: (added rng)
like i've said, this is going to affect everyone, the only dd left in sky/land gods is blm. they don't really get anything that is worth the hours it takes to farm.
the job that used to get the most is rng, they also did the most. we have cancelled gods due to lack of the jobs listed above. we never cancelled due to not having enought drks or drg. now rangers join the useless crowd. sitting around building tp while blms stun and damage.
they should have alotted for other non casting jobs to be usefull, not nerf the one that was. SE just added another useless end game job, i think everyone should be a little upset about that.
Seawolf said:
O shut the fuck up
How are we gonna change our strategy on kirin? ranger are usueless... Kirin is stil a kited mob
sky LS have 2 option
1.) stack up on BLM
2.) stack up on MNK as well as BLM(MNk take place of rng)
the Kills are gonna be hella slower.... so LS will stack on these jobs more for faster kills.
and then.. more melee will bitch... BLM is nerfed... hell even MNKs will be nerfed
I can see a MNK nerf coming for chi blast
chi blast recast timer is 5 mins
SE will do this because people will stack MNKs... just like we stacked ranger. ONe ranger on Kirin is not much... same as one Monk on Kirin... but if you stack MNKs or RNG on kirin... other jobs sit out
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Can someone explain to me about why Kirin is so "godly" (pun intended) that he can't be just plain tanked that he needs to be kited? I'm asking out of request for knowledge on the subject. I'm only level 60 so I have yet to experience any of this.
Taurothar said:
overall melee don't do any damage to Gods. Ranged, magic, and chi blast are the main big damage. he needs to be kited because he summons the other gods, they are weaker forms of themselves, but still tough. so you kill the summons and kite kirin around. i missed out on kirins from vacation, to my break so i won't go iinto details i don't knoww.