Bible Thumpers

I dont feel like reading every reply to this post because Im just going to say what I think based on your initial post:

I agree with you 100%. God is forgiving and gave everybody free will to choose as they please. Sure the bible may suggest that being with the same sex is wrong, but times do change, and I think that god understands this (him being the master of time and whatnot).

If you choose to be with another woman, and can truly feel the love, then excellent. Im glad to hear you are happy.

On judgment day, god isnt going to ask you why you were with a woman, but rather if you loved that woman the same way as if you would have loved a man had you been strait.

On judgment day, that guy is going to be standing before god and god is going to ask him why he didnt support you in your decision.

It all boils down to your opinion of how god is. Is he cruel? I dont think so at all. Will he stick to the bible like a fly on flypaper? I dont think so either.

Will he look at you and declare wheter or not you have truly been a good human being, supportive to your partner, and kind to others? Yes, and I feel you handeled this situation very good.

And Im sure god does too.
 
Reauland said:
(Whether you believe the following text to be literal truth or the plot of a really long story is entirely up to you)

The Cliff's Notes Version of Christianity

Old Testament
The establishment of Judaism
The old Judaic law.
Old Judaic songs of praise.
Various tales of kings and the prophets that told em how full of shit they were.
Prophetic writings concerning the coming of the Messiah

New Testament
The life of Jesus
The teachings of Jesus
The death of Jesus
The resurrection of Jesus
The letters that a bunch of early Christians sent to various regional churches about certain practices(mostly attributed to the Apostle Paul)
Prophetic writings concerning the return of the Messiah

I wanted to get that outta the way first, because most of what I have to say comes back to it.

First off: Any one of you assclowns still running around talking about how wrong this or that lifestyle is need to take a look at your own hearts; your own beliefs. That was all Old Testament stuff, and the only true reason that the vast preponderance of the Old Testament was included in the Bible was for one simple reason: to provide context to Jesus and His message. What was that message you might ask?

Love one another as you love yourselves.
Be good to one another.
Stop judging one another.
Oh, and by the way - the Old Testament law is fulfilled; no more need to worry about it.
Believe this, believe in me, and you'll live forever by my side.

There it is in a nutshell.

So quite frankly, anyone who tries to base an argument off of Old Testament writings is already WAY off-base. To do so is effectively denying the very sacrifice that Jesus came to make.

Now true, the Apostle Paul writes a lot of stuff in his letters about "acceptable" behavior, but let me be totally honest with you - I think that Paul was a little too "old school" to wrap his mind around all of Jesus's message and put it into practice. Paul was the guy that was the Jewish ex-Christian-hunter that was converted due to having a religious experience on the road to Damascus, and for all he did to help keep the church going in that time, I really don't think he ever let go of a lot of his old Judaic beliefs. Anything at all in the New Testament that has anything whatsoever to say about sexual orientation, gluttony(read alcohol/drugs/overindulgence), or form of dress all comes from the writings of Paul, and, at least in my estimation, should be viewed as nothing more than mere editorial.

Jesus never talked about it; not even once. If it wasn't important enough for Him to address, why should we be troubling ourSELVEs with it?
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Just felt I should repost this because it is the best explanation I have seen.

The old testemant is just that, the OLD testemant. Is it any less important? Of course not. Like he said, its about the teachings, message, and life of Jesus. That is extremely relevant.

Paul indeed wrote many things. He tried to follow strictly the teachings of Jesus, but there is ALWAYS self added bias in every piece of written work.

And one more thing I must add:

I highly doubt that the bible we read these days is in its origonal form. I think that because of translation, bias, personal beliefs, etc. that the bible has been altered many times. I believe the origonal copy is out there somewhere, but what it holds, I do not know.
 
Songi_ said:
The Judeo-Christian god frowns upon you all.
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So YOU say. Until God either:

A) Comes to me, sends an angel or some other message

or

B) Tells me on Judgment Day

that I was wrong, I will interpert it as I will.

I doubt you personally speak to god, and I think it is wrong for anyone to say "God Feels this way about you". God is what he is. You can speculate all you want. I do my own share of speculation. I think he is kind and forgiving. You obviously do not. One of us is going to be wrong, and we will find out eventually.
 
My dad gives money to Pat Robbertson... I'm secretly ashamed... >_>
 
Agnostic/Humanist is the way to go, IMO.

There is no proof of a god, yet there is no way to disprove a god. Live life being a fair and rational person instead of judging other solely because of what an ancient book says. You are no better then anybody else in this world dispite what you may think, stop acting like it.
 
Christians = Catholics = Jewish = Atheist


Everyone is equal. Even the Atheists are loved in the view of god. We are all gods children and if we ask for forgivness or others ask our forgivness, we will all be united in the kingdom of heaven.

My friend is an atheist and I pray for her every time I pray. She is a very good person, and I feel god understands this.

Like I said, it all boils down to opinion.
 
Alerith said:
So YOU say. Until God either:

A) Comes to me, sends an angel or some other message

or

B) Tells me on Judgment Day

that I was wrong, I will interpert it as I will.

I doubt you personally speak to god, and I think it is wrong for anyone to say "God Feels this way about you". God is what he is. You can speculate all you want. I do my own share of speculation. I think he is kind and forgiving. You obviously do not. One of us is going to be wrong, and we will find out eventually.
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I'm so sorry! That was 100% sarcasm and a joke before. It wasn't directed at you either, just some *certain* people in the previous posts who have been attempting to speak for God (read my previous post to see how I seriously feel). It was just my jab at people who say things are morally wrong for religious reasons, and how they have an idea of god which conflics with mine.

Thank you for adding some logic to this thread, on the contrary, and I seriously did not mean that in that way. I really should post a *sarcasm* disclaimer...
 
burger-king-2.jpg


Where's your God now?!
 
Alerith said:
So YOU say. Until God either:

A) Comes to me, sends an angel or some other message

or

B) Tells me on Judgment Day

that I was wrong, I will interpert it as I will.

I doubt you personally speak to god, and I think it is wrong for anyone to say "God Feels this way about you". God is what he is. You can speculate all you want. I do my own share of speculation. I think he is kind and forgiving. You obviously do not. One of us is going to be wrong, and we will find out eventually.
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That was worded very well I must say.
 
I feel I need to post in this. I really dislike that people have strong feelings against the faith in God because how most people who claim "Christianity" or anything of that sort do not really resemble their faith very much. I haven't read every single post, that's just too much, but I did read the first few pages, and skimmed through the rest.

There are a lot of believers who try to interpret things in ways that aren't entirely correct, or correct in God's perspective. The Bible itself says that no human could ever completely understand him, and that includes those who follow him.

I am familiar with the paragraph in the Bible that believers often refer to when it comes to homosexuality. Paraphrased, it mentions a group of men that burned with so much lust that they had sex with each other. I know I don't have the exact location of it in the Bible with me right now, so if you want to claim "lack of credibility", ok then, I'm just saying what's in there. I remember content more clearly than verse number,etc. Anyways, the key to that small section is that the men burned with lust. This is where the sin comes in. It was not about them having sex with each other because they are men, but the intensity of sexual desire that they had. I read a post by Elemmire saying her Bible doesn't mention stuff about homosexuality. Well here it is, or at least it is what people think they interpret correctly.

And, just because a priest or pastor, someone revered by the people, says something, doesn't mean I'm always going to agree. That is foolishness. The ultimate teacher is God himself.

I have nothing personal against people of sexual preference besides heterosexuality. I don't care if a person is homosexual, bisexual, heterosexual, whatever, what I like to see is that if a couple is actually in it for each other and care about each other deeply. The core issue at hand is the actual love for one another. Is it really just sex? Or is it more than that? Is there an actual bond, connection, compassion and affection in that relationship? That's what I look at, and I don't doubt that's what God looks at also. The very core of all teachings is to love one another. And that's not just having sex. Sex alone is not love, even if people say it's "making love". Toss your technicalities out; that brings up sociological matters.

Also, people need to "get off the bandwagon", as you people like to say, of saying that the Bible has been rewritten and therefore a lot of it is false. That's not entirely true. If you would actually take some time to read the Bible for yourself, you would see that not everything in there is what you think it is (e.g. "YOU SINNER, REPENT YE" lol). Undoubtedly, there are parts of the Bible that have been rewritten and don't make sense; I've seen one of those parts myself. That doesn't make the entire rest of the Book wrong.

And about proving God "scientifically", think about it. Before, people discovered electrons, protons, and neutrons. Now we have more subdivisions called quarks and leptons. Positrons, neutrinos, tau, gluons, muons, etc, etc. Scientists try to find the most fundamental thing of all life. Just imagine, humans can already see things so small, but how much smaller do you think you can get? Is it possible that nothing has a finite size the smaller and smaller you go? And we live in a 4-dimensional world, but physicists have theories about several more dimensions, even up to 11!, all trying to make sense of how things come together.

God has always been the greatest mind. Who else could initiate the Big Bang? The Big Bang could be considered a reaction, who initiated the action? "A single superforce" as scientists call it. Throughout the ages, man has been proud, even arrogant, for being "intelligent" and having such extensive knowledge. But as things are progressing, it's being even harder. They can't isolate an electron and look at it, it's too difficult.

This is where faith comes in. Can you believe in Him, without being given so much human reasoning?
 
Xean said:
God has always been the greatest mind. Who else could initiate the Big Bang? The Big Bang could be considered a reaction, who initiated the action? "A single superforce" as scientists call it.
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That's one thing I could never understand. If you follow the chain of cause and effect all the way back, you would have God. Okay, what was before God? "He was always there."

If you can believe that, why not just believe the universe has always been there?
 
Halifirien said:
That's one thing I could never understand. If you follow the chain of cause and effect all the way back, you would have God. Okay, what was before God? "He was always there."

If you can believe that, why not just believe the universe has always been there?
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No I like the "dinosaurs and cavemen wherent actually there" explanation of things.
 
Halifirien said:
That's one thing I could never understand. If you follow the chain of cause and effect all the way back, you would have God. Okay, what was before God? "He was always there."

If you can believe that, why not just believe the universe has always been there?
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Well, how about this alternative - the universe is a manifestation of God. In other words, what of us that hold to the notion that God is all things, ergo God is you, me, the air we're breathing . . . etc., etc.?

For those of us who believe that, such distinctions become irrelavent.

Science already sets a moment for the beginning of the universe in its current form, and can accurately track the events back along their model(thank you Mr. Hawking) to an amazing millionth of a nothingth of a second(not literally, but you get the idea), and I'm sure that they will continue to improve their model, but then everything falls apart, because if you track far enough back, all of a sudden time itself is even different.

When we get to that point, we might as well just say, "Well, on the first day, anti-matter dropped out of the vacuum disproportionately smaller than the matter, and moved across the formless void; On the second day . . ."

Why? We'll never know. Not in this life, anyway, I firmly believe.
 
Halifirien said:
That's one thing I could never understand. If you follow the chain of cause and effect all the way back, you would have God. Okay, what was before God? "He was always there."

If you can believe that, why not just believe the universe has always been there?
Click to expand...

It's belief in a being that can transcend space and time. Because we cannot understand time not existing, the argument is that a supreme being (or beings) able to understand that concept and go beyond it explains God.

At least to me. But what do I know, I'm just a silly deist. Most people haven't even heard of my religion.

Oh and hi Hal, haven't seen you around in a while, drop me a line in-game sometime :).
 
Songi_ said:
I'm so sorry! That was 100% sarcasm and a joke before. It wasn't directed at you either, just some *certain* people in the previous posts who have been attempting to speak for God (read my previous post to see how I seriously feel). It was just my jab at people who say things are morally wrong for religious reasons, and how they have an idea of god which conflics with mine.

Thank you for adding some logic to this thread, on the contrary, and I seriously did not mean that in that way. I really should post a *sarcasm* disclaimer...
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LMFAO, its ok. I know how hard it is to relate sarcasm via message boards sometimes. Its all cool.
 
I'm new to this. I just joined today, and I have a friend of mine playing on Quez. I just want to say, not every Christian who believes in the Bible as a end-all-be-all standard for life is a "Bible-Thumper". Some of us are okay with homosexuality, not because it's "right" (I do think it's wrong, but stay with me) but because I have just as many faults. I'm not perfect, so I have absolutely no right to judge someone else. My girlfriend (I'm a guy, btw) has a male gay best friend that I'm completely okay with.

Too many people judge devout Christians. I believe homosexuality is wrong. I believe the Bible is right, even though I can't explain many of the things in it. Do I love homosexuals any less? No. Some of the nicest, most accepting people I know are gay.

Jesus once said that "he who is without sin, cast the first stone" when talking about if we should judge an adulterous person. I have my own personal adultery problems. Jesus still loves me, though He will punish me as any loving father would. I'm trying to change. Many people brought up free-will, too.

God gave us free will because he wanted us to choose Him, not for Him to choose for us. It's not a mistake, saying it's a mistake goes against the way I believe God to be (though I'm not saying you can't believe God or not believe God in your own way).

I have not read any of the 22 pages of this discussion. We're not going to change anybody, I promise. If I've said something someone else has, so be it. I do know that nobody who reads this will care. Every time I pour my heart out in these dumb forums, I'm ignored. Just know that Jesus loves you, whether you're homosexual, a crook, a believer, or an athiest (or anything else at all).
 
I just noticed a guy on this very page posted something similar to mine... oh well. Anyway, just thought I'd like to put my own personal thoughts down. Life goes on.
 
hehe

Now this post caught my eye here is my opinion and from what i learned i believe it to be the single truth
1: No one has the right to judge another person as GOD says in the bible only he and yourself can judge you so in the end only you can judge yourself and you are forbidden from lying to yourself

2: No homosexuality is naturaly not right but who are we to judge other ppl based on our experiences, the world is full of corruption and due to experiences in this life people change for better or for worse, no somtimes we dont like these chages, like what some homosexuals go though when they discover themselves, remember lying to yourself is nearly impossible so eventually you except change

3: Before you begin to understand judge or blame homosexuals for anything, understand judge and blame yourself, for you are the reason that title exist, love comes in many forms as GOD once said and you puny pethetic human mind couldn't begin to understand it

Last i believe my words are truth because i strive to find worldly wisdom, not put my wisdom into GODs mouth and judge other people by it, (I fear being struck down)
 
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