bushido cape

craftaholic said:
You don't seem to understand what stats are important for a melee. So how can you claim to be as well or better equiped than most WARs your level?
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Psychic powers, of course.
 
Mai Ikari said:
Ok, let's refresh our memory.

SAM accuracy, assuming intelligent gear and sushi: 95%

Zanshin proc rate from cape (generous estimate): 5%

Chances for zanshin to proc with 95% accuracy: 5%

Times it does proc: 5% of 5%

Accuracy bonus: .25%

Amemet damage bonus: more than .25%


Or does the whole concept of damage elude you?
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When you are SAM/THF +10 or +15 ATK isn't going to matter when your main goal is to get 100TP for WS asap. So what is better +5-7 DMG every hit or a better chance of Zanshin kicking in for those times that you do miss. Besides even then you can macro the other mantle in for the WS.

Or does the whole concept of TP elude you.
 
Shaunessy said:
When you are SAM/THF +10 or +15 ATK isn't going to matter when your main goal is to get 100TP for WS asap. So what is better +5-7 DMG every hit or a better chance of Zanshin kicking in for those times that you do miss. Besides even then you can macro the other mantle in for the WS.

Or does the whole concept of TP elude you.
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The 1 extra attack every 100-200 swings is just about irrelevant. Yeah, it's "better" for TP gain, but the difference is so insignificant almsot no one bothers. The Amemet mantle will lead to more damage done over time, since that attack boosts every hit you do.
 
Shaunessy said:
Has anyone saying it's worthless ever actually used it?
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No, I haven't, because I never needed it. At the very most it'd add 1 attack every 100 swings, and there's barely any chance it's even that good. Unless you suck enough that your accuracy is so bad that you have to depend on zanshin, amemet is better. My accuracy didn't suck, so zanshin was a non-issue to me.

I'd even make it more required for /thf than for /war or /drg, because war and drg give an attack bonus that thf does not.
 
News Flash: TP Gain isn't all that meleeing is about. Especially as a Samurai, the damage on the road to 100%(sans meditate assist) is most likely more than what you'll get out of weaponskilling, even with THF sub. Unless you're busting balls and doing 2000+ damage skills every time you weaponskill, which is highly doubtful. Or using Soboro, which from an efficiency view, I'm not entirely fond of seeing at 75.

Thats actually pretty true for every job now that I think about it, unless you're gimping your melee damage or a THF. Now, don't take that as THFs = gimp damage, it's just how the job works that I'm pointing out. The majority, or atleast more than half, will be from weaponskills.

Maximizing Damage without hurting TP Gain, and vice versa, is how to do it correctly. If you aren't, you fail. Play a mage job.

I know I don't depend on my weaponskills as a Monk to be the greater of the scale, because the "best" one peaks at 1400 on neutral enemies, where as on the climb to use it, I'm doing more than twice the minimal Asuran damage, and a good bit more than your average.

Speaking of Soboro, I'm sure that kills the effect of Bushido cape even further. Since I'm sure Zanshin, like Double Attack, cannot kick in when the weapon multihits on its own.
 
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Well there you have it people. The know-it-alls speaking about stuff they never used again and telling everyone why it's gimp without a leg to stand on.

Skaw, what is TP gain about then if it's not from melee? Meditate is only once every 3 mins. Guess what, the rest is from melee, and as SAM/THF against IT IT+ and IT++ mobs you are going to miss. Amemet mantle is great, I love it for the +STR and ATK it gives me when I'm weapon skilling. When I'm at less than 100 TP though I have Bushido on because you can see the differance it provides. Plus, unless you are going for over all damage so that you can stroke your e-puss at the end of a 4 hour session, the 5-7 damage that Amenet provides per hit doesn't matter. You want to get TP as fast as you can so you can WS the current mob and kill it. Then the counter starts over and you try to get 100 TP again for this new mob. The damage you did last fight doesn't matter anymore, and when you kill this one the damage done to that one won't matter either.

And I don't care how non-gimp everyone says they are, you still miss. It's impossible not to miss. So get off your high horses and try stuff out. You might be surprised how good some of the gear is that you'll never use because you are nothing but a parrot.
 
Shaunessy said:
Well there you have it people. The know-it-alls speaking about stuff they never used again and telling everyone why it's gimp without a leg to stand on.

Skaw, what is TP gain about then if it's not from melee? Meditate is only once every 3 mins. Guess what, the rest is from melee, and as SAM/THF against IT IT+ and IT++ mobs you are going to miss. Amemet mantle is great, I love it for the +STR and ATK it gives me when I'm weapon skilling. When I'm at less than 100 TP though I have Bushido on because you can see the differance it provides. Plus, unless you are going for over all damage so that you can stroke your e-puss at the end of a 4 hour session, the 5-7 damage that Amenet provides per hit doesn't matter. You want to get TP as fast as you can so you can WS the current mob and kill it. Then the counter starts over and you try to get 100 TP again for this new mob. The damage you did last fight doesn't matter anymore, and when you kill this one the damage done to that one won't matter either.

And I don't care how non-gimp everyone says they are, you still miss. It's impossible not to miss. So get off your high horses and try stuff out. You might be surprised how good some of the gear is that you'll never use because you are nothing but a parrot.
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Sup sushi. Sup Haubergeon. Sup Peacock Charm. Sup Sniper/Woodsman Rings. Sup Life Belt. Get your gimp shit mantle out of here.
 
I love the ignorance and willingness to take advice some people have.
I also love how I by reading these boards find out who to not invite :)
 
Shaunessy said:
Well there you have it people. The know-it-alls speaking about stuff they never used again and telling everyone why it's gimp without a leg to stand on.

Skaw, what is TP gain about then if it's not from melee? Meditate is only once every 3 mins. Guess what, the rest is from melee, and as SAM/THF against IT IT+ and IT++ mobs you are going to miss. Amemet mantle is great, I love it for the +STR and ATK it gives me when I'm weapon skilling. When I'm at less than 100 TP though I have Bushido on because you can see the differance it provides. Plus, unless you are going for over all damage so that you can stroke your e-puss at the end of a 4 hour session, the 5-7 damage that Amenet provides per hit doesn't matter. You want to get TP as fast as you can so you can WS the current mob and kill it. Then the counter starts over and you try to get 100 TP again for this new mob. The damage you did last fight doesn't matter anymore, and when you kill this one the damage done to that one won't matter either.

And I don't care how non-gimp everyone says they are, you still miss. It's impossible not to miss. So get off your high horses and try stuff out. You might be surprised how good some of the gear is that you'll never use because you are nothing but a parrot.
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Unless your accuracy flat-out sucks, you won't miss enough for zanshin to kick in enough to be worth while. If your accuracy doesn't suck, you'll get 1 extra swing every 100 swings if you're lucky, that's hardly as good as you're making it out to be.

Of course you still miss, but even that 5-7 damage on every hit out damages that 1 extra hit. Hell, it'll out damage 3 normal hits in case you get lucky with zanshin. NOT going for higher total damage makes you an idiot damage dealer.
 
I needed a good laugh, thanks!
 
It was my understanding Zanshin kicks in quite frequently far more than most other job abilities. The idea that it only kicks in 10% makes it rather worthless compared to other job abilities. While 10% is a large number, it's 10% of the percent missed which should be a fairly small number, 1-2% at best (or worst depending on how you look at it). That's 1-2 attacks in a 100 versus other job traits which process anywhere from 5 to 10 hits per 100. Seems rather weak compared to a majority of other extra attack traits like double, triple and kick attacks.
 
10% is an estimate based on other job traits, but even if it was a 50% proc rate, the bushido cape wouldn't provide a big enough boost to your zanshin rate to make it worth while. You'd still only get one at the most extra hit from the cape, which would produce much less overall damage than an amemet mantle.
 
Overall damage in an exp party setting is pointless to even achieve. You have to think in terms of mobs, not hours. The damage provided by 1 Zanshin is going to out damage the total of the amenet on a single mob. Just because you do a few extra damage to this mob doesn't mean that it effects the next one. How hard is that to understand? Bushido Cape will help you get 100 TP faster than Amenet and I don't care what anyone says, that is where the damage and hate control of SAM/THF comes from. Now how about instead of all you people assuming that it sucks without tring it, use it then answer the OP.
 
Shaunessy said:
Now how about instead of all you people assuming that it sucks without tring it, use it then answer the OP.
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to be fair, have either sides used both and parsed it? that is really going to be the only way you know for sure.


[yes i am leaning to one side over the other but just saying, lol]

edit: the only bad thing about parsing this is results are going to vary based off of your other gear, so someone with sucky acc gear will show a better parse with bushido than someone with great acc gear.
 
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