Derail from the SE's Good/Bad thread

Bajaratt said:
With who?
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Can't remember what the names were, I do know it was a 75 NIN 75 NIN 75 WAR 70 WHM 67 WHM<me> 75 BRD 69? SMN there were more on the way but hate got fucked at the start and we wiped. Then after we raised we got agro and more deaths. Then I had to go due to something coming up in real life. We did get it to 90% though before the first wipe.
 
dbuman said:
Catch me in game and ill give ya 2 gil lol. U pted with my blu a few times if u can remember back to your 40s. remember gustav?
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I do remember and I was using my thief at that time. I had to go one step further to make money then some since using a mage for farming is just ridiculously slow and not a lot of drops. Even if i went blm/thf the drop rate was shit. So I leveled thief to 40, couldn't go farther cause of SJ's not high enough.I level'd nin to 25 for utsusemi, and to make a very good farming machine out of my thief which i took to 51. Yeah it took me 2 weeks to make the 1 mil but it took me at least a month to level the jobs to make that money, and that doesn't count the time crafting.

Really, all I'm trying to say is you get out of the game what you put into it. If you wanna play with sub-par gear, then it's what you wanna do. If you complain about how expensive gear is, tough shit cause it's expensive for everyone. Being a mage I have been fortunate not to have to buy a lot of gear, but I have had to buy at least one scroll every level. AM scrolls at the time I was leveling were around 150-300k each. I even got booted from a party because i didn't have escape(I was level 33 and the spell is 29)...

Yeah having a Brown Belt or the spell Escape doesn't instantly make you an uber player, but it shows the rest of the people you are serious about the job you are doing and every stat point or haste point makes a difference. 1 INT point for me adds about 6 pts dmg on spells... It all adds up to better performance, which leads to faster kills, which leads to better exp.
 
You know, all in all it could be worse.... in my experience its not so much ending up in a party with people who are too lazy to go farm gil to obtain decent gear that will contribute to their performance, but people that gil buy the +1 of all their gear and suck horribly at their role in the party.

I've seen way too many people that have been brand new to the game and i've partied with in the dunes, and then a few weeks later I see them all the way at lvl 60 with a SH, or Hauby and whatever other HQ items they can get their hands on.... leading me to believe that there is no way they could of found the time to farm the gil to come up with those items on their first job, while seeking/partying throughout their entire time spent in the game. Then when I end up in a party with them again, I can really notice the lack of player skill because they have no clue how to skillchain, control their hate output etc.

So while the gear itself will be a factor in the numbers they're dealing (whether in damage or curing) its not always just about the gear. I'd prefer someone to know how to play their job as opposed to having someone with "good gear". I find it more frustrating venting about how horrible the party is because no one knows how to do their job (which typically results in accidental deaths etc), than venting about how slow the xp is because the numbers aren't there.

But back on topic, its true that a lot of new players now go and level and spend almost no time farming. Whatever drops they get in xp parties, is pretty much considered their farming. Those are the types of players that just suck at video games because they take the easy way out and like someone else said, to them its just a race to get lvl 75 and typically they have no consideration for how they will be hindering their performance, which in turn hinders the entire party's potential.

About the brown belt, I wouldn't boot a MNK for not having one. I might look down at them and think they're lazy after lvl 60 if they haven't been able to farm/quest one. As long as they can do their job, and make the xp run smoothly that's all i'm concerned with.
 
Shaunessy said:
If you are 75 and a MNK without a Black Belt you are gimp and deserve to be kicked from every party you get into.

It's not hard

It's not rare, you just don't want to take the time and farm it. That's all it is.

it's not as hard as what everyone is making it out to be.
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Shaunessy said:
I know more than you think, and watch endgame all the time.
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so you're telling us you are a commendable authority on the subject matter because you don't participate, and watch end game all the time?


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lawl.
 
Shaunessy said:
So, please tell me, what is so special about end game besides needing to be higher level to do it?
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neophytal said:
so you're telling us you are a commendable authority on the subject matter because you don't participate, and watch end game all the time?
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Answer the question above your quote with some profound statement, and I'll except it. I know you can't though.
 
Shaunessy said:
Answer the question above your quote with some profound statement, and I'll except it. I know you can't though.
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There's nothing particularly "special" about it. However...

You seem to have little grasp of either drop rates, participation/mindsets, time required, potential competition, some combination of the above, or a problem combining all of the above for a realistic outlook on what actually happens, works, or is viable. This much is obvious from your posts regarding Black Belt, even if they were merely sarcastic comparisons to Brown Belt.
 
alanon said:
It's a little tougher than that. The thing hits hard and fast, builds a resistance to gravity rather quickly, and isn't sleepable(I dont think).

Besides, it's fun to bring a full party and kite it around and watch the one melee that can't get the timing down, die from the breath attack multiple times. Cracks me up every time, that shit never gets old!
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Bind sticks, and Thunder IV takes off a huge chunk of his health. An initial gravity, and an ES gravity when that one wears should be enough to last the entire fight.
 
Garvin said:
There's nothing particularly "special" about it. However...

You seem to have little grasp of either drop rates, participation/mindsets, time required, potential competition, some combination of the above, or a problem combining all of the above for a realistic outlook on what actually happens, works, or is viable. This much is obvious from your posts regarding Black Belt, even if they were merely sarcastic comparisons to Brown Belt.
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I know it takes time, but it is not impossible to get 99KS if you go strictly farming for them. Participation? Maybe because our server is "me first", or it's bitching about how RMTs controls the spawns. People were talking about farming for a piece of gear. Well there is no difference in the Black Belt. Farm the seals, then sponser a run. Sure it's work but worth it in my opinion.
 
Shaunessy said:
I know it takes time, but it is not impossible to get 99KS if you go strictly farming for them. Participation? Maybe because our server is "me first", or it's bitching about how RMTs controls the spawns. People were talking about farming for a piece of gear. Well there is no difference in the Black Belt. Farm the seals, then sponser a run. Sure it's work but worth it in my opinion.
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but seeing as how ive done EVERY ks99 successfully, i will say that ive only seen the black belt item drop in 1, which is the KB ks99. the turtle and dragon droprates are horrible, i havent seen them drop once.

so please, stop saying to farm it, thats getting old as you have no idea about those ks99 fights or what they even require.

oh, and yes, i have a black belt.
 
He's also ignoring the part where I said that no one even does the turtle KS99, because it sucks to make money off of; so it's even harder to get people to KS99 all of the black belt items.
 
Monks should have brown belts just like Black Mages should have moldavite earrings. I didn't ding 47 until I convinced the high levels in my ls to help me kill Mysticmaker, and like the saints they are, I got one in 2 claims. Then I dinged 47 and put it on. Every job has rite of passage items they should get, not necessarily to perfom better, though you invariably will, but just out of job pride. Get your Brown Belts, your Moldavites, your full AF even if it sucks for your job. You'll feel better at 75 if you've endured all your job's hardships as they happenned, instead of racing to 75 and playing catchup. Have your cool gear the level you can use it. That way, even if you're not the best player at your job, people will notice and respect your effort.

RE Blackbelts: If Baj is gimp for not having a Black Belt, than I'm gimp for not having a Novio earring, and since I don't think I'm gimp, I don't think Baj is gimp either. I don't always agree with all of Bajaratt's points, but I agree with him here.
 
Pompidou said:
Monks should have brown belts just like Black Mages should have moldavite earrings.
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I went 1/26 or so on Moldavite earring. I quit blm for 6 months or so and leveled bst partially out of frustration from that earring. My LS wasn't helpful at all in getting that earring until the 26th or so run. I finally got that earring as a 75blm. (I didn't even get my stupid ass AF hat till 73 due to lack of help from LS and playing on JP time) Gimp as hell without it, but I did my job well. I didn't miss MBs. I pulled good numbers. I have tarutaru MP so that wasn't an issue. And yet, in my mind, from lvl50 or so when I first heard of that earring all the way to 75 I felt like a total gimp. The effort was positively put into that earring, but that fuckface of a goblin just didn't like me.

Now, if a party invited me, ran me 30 minutes across vanadiel to find a pt spot and then kicked me because I didn't have that earring, I would have been pissed.

And if you invite a mnk into your party, run him 30 minutes across vanadiel and then kick him out of your party because he doesn't have BB, he should be pissed too. Because you'd be an ass for wasting his time. Who knows. Maybe he doesn't have a solid LS. Or maybe his LS is comprised of selfish people unwilling to help him in any way.

As far as blackbelt is concerned. Yes, the items are damn rare. And it would take a ton of kindred seals to probably just get one item. I agree with this. But for myself personally, as a bst and blm (two damn good solo jobs), if I focus I can easily farm up a stack of kindred seals in little over a week if that's the only thing I do. Next time I do a ks99 if someone wanted their chance to buy my BB item if it dropped, I'd be more than happy. Hell, I'd probably just give it away to the first person who asked if it was somebody I respected.

Anyway, just my 2c.
 
pakomen said:
Now, if a party invited me, ran me 30 minutes across vanadiel to find a pt spot and then kicked me because I didn't have that earring, I would have been pissed.

And if you invite a mnk into your party, run him 30 minutes across vanadiel and then kick him out of your party because he doesn't have BB, he should be pissed too. Because you'd be an ass for wasting his time. Who knows. Maybe he doesn't have a solid LS. Or maybe his LS is comprised of selfish people unwilling to help him in any way.
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I mainly meant building a party in town, where I could see their gear before I invited them or inconvenienced them by inviting/booting them. If they're coming out as a replacement, I'd say something about it, but probably leave them in the party; I'm not evil enough to completely waste someone's time and money like that. I will, however, try to remember them so that I don't invite them again until they get better gear.
 
Bajaratt said:
I mainly meant building a party in town, where I could see their gear before I invited them or inconvenienced them by inviting/booting them. If they're coming out as a replacement, I'd say something about it, but probably leave them in the party; I'm not evil enough to completely waste someone's time and money like that. I will, however, try to remember them so that I don't invite them again until they get better gear.
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Which is good enough for me.

Everybody has their own way of doing things. Brown Belt isn't the easiest quest to complete, and it takes a lot of time, but if you're building the party and you're building it for success, then it's basically up to you whether or not you want to allow someone in who is missing a very solid piece of gear.

If I got kicked from parties inside of Jeuno because I was missing my moldavite earring, I'd probably have been pissed. But I would damn sure have been a little more aggressive about getting one just to make sure it didn't happen again in the future.
 
Shaunessy said:
I don't think it's hard to get KSs. I have 99 and I don't even try to get them. Hell half the time I can't even get them because my invo is full when I'm out in a party. 99 isn't really that hard to get, and at higher levels EP drop them. Normally, if I try I can farm about 10 beastmen seals in an hour in the promies, and 5 Kindred/hour fighting EP solo as a 66 SAM. It's not hard, just too hard for you to be bothered with it. So next time you see a MNK without a brown belt, don't say shit until you have a black belt.
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There are three black belt items 99 seals to attempt one, an alliance is required, and it's about a 20% drop rate? How many KS have you managed to collect now?
 
Bajaratt said:
I could accept a monk not having it at 40, especially if they hit 40 in the party; so I'm willing to give a little leeway for them to farm/quest one. My problem is, that I've seen 3 monks in the mid-50's without brown belts, and that's just inexcusable. They've had more than enough time to farm/quest it and chose to level instead. Also, they all had frickin' horrible gear, like the level 32 impact knuckles at 53 or shinobi gear.
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ah then yes that is gimp; not because they don't have brown belt but because it show they put no effort in upgrading their gear what so ever. I can sympathize that brown belt is not easy as you make it seem though. went 1/12 on nue and 1/21 on dodo. Got the vine way back when the rmt ran Odelle's cave. As for black belt that got be one the hardest quest of all. First off there only handful of shells that actually kill the kings. As for ks99 the drop rate is frightful. No matter how you look at even to do the black belt quest you must first do brown belt. So why even compare the two?
 
Courtney said:
There are three black belt items 99 seals to attempt one, an alliance is required, and it's about a 20% drop rate? How many KS have you managed to collect now?
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You left out that they're very time limited and pretty difficult. I'd say more losses are probably to expiration than wiping. They really should bump those up to an hour, 30 minute just really isn't enough.
 
Skaw said:
You left out that they're very time limited and pretty difficult. I'd say more losses are to expiration than wiping. They really should bump those up to an hour, 30 minute just really isn't enough.
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yet people have won them all at 30 minute time limit :P so it does work out well enough.. the behemoth one is actually pretty easy and the wyrm one seems easy enough with intelligent people. The turtle one is the only one I might suggest a time increase to 45 or 60 minutes since it has insane defense and regen as a turtle does. The fact you had to have pretty much manaburn alliance to kill it is kinda stupid.. but that's the last I heard from a few months ago >.> things change about that?
 
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