Kaizen "leadership"

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You guys are hardly being silent

And ramp i already conceded that point about you being in AP when the first person said u were in prowess.

None of the Kaizen leadership has said a word.

And I won't stand for any insinuations that myself or the NBs know nothing about leading.
 
Didn't mean to say it was you guys, but it was part of it I was told. I wasn't told anything about being abrasive but there wouldnt be any reason for you to lie. Wouldn't doubt it though my social LS leader said the same thing not long ago. D=

I'd like to take this time to thank all of the Kaizen members who are reading this post and not saying a word. I see we even have Meast out in the crowd! This is the most you've been associated with the shell since what, last January? Good to see you back!

We'll have a brief intermission, followed by dead silence from the guys who are accountable for this whole mess.

Lol
 
hi

i don't know who you are lyall but i bet i'm better than you

^-^/

on a serious note, i believe the aforementioned actions are necessary for the shell and that the remaining and future members of kaizen prosper in their ambitious endeavors. :)
 
Sorry, what? Make up your mind, you're either saying it's their fault or ours. I'm not saying we're innocent, but it's on the leaders who were apparently aware there was a problem and chose to do nothing to combat it until it got so fucked up the only option was to force us out.

im not even going to begin to say that it is only you which was the point of my first post but i am saying that you guys are not the victims that you are attempting to make yourselves out to be.

None of the Kaizen leadership has said a word.

And I won't stand for any insinuations that myself or the NBs know nothing about leading.

I actually think my point was quite the opposite the NBs know very little about following, putting in your time, and being part of a team... well a larger team than their group of 7 people.
 
hi

i don't know who you are lyall but i bet i'm better than you

^-^/

on a serious note, i believe the aforementioned actions are necessary for the shell and that the remaining and future members of kaizen prosper in their ambitious endeavors. :)

Well, you don't play anymore so you've got me there.

On a serious note, the day of the Big Shell is over once the level cap raises. The aforementioned actions will allow Kaizen to retain numbers until the smart people there realize they can just lowman whatever they want. Good luck with everything, though. I actually LIKE most of the people there.
 
Big Shell.
Big Corporation.
Big Government.
lol
 
im not even going to begin to say that it is only you which was the point of my first post but i am saying that you guys are not the victims that you are attempting to make yourselves out to be.



I actually think my point was quite the opposite the NBs know very little about following, putting in your time, and being part of a team... well a larger team than their group of 7 people.

Well, when leadership is corrupt and/or stupid, am I supposed to sit by a twiddle my thumbs? How about when Ardenbruk leads a Soboro run, and wants to come SAM and use his own Soboro, feeding the mob far more TP than he should? Am I just supposed to let him endanger us all?
 
im not even going to begin to say that it is only you which was the point of my first post but i am saying that you guys are not the victims that you are attempting to make yourselves out to be.



I actually think my point was quite the opposite the NBs know very little about following, putting in your time, and being part of a team... well a larger team than their group of 7 people.

See, I'm not too sure about that first part. We played ball with Kaizen. Hell, to an extent, we saved them. That's not the point. Gains, the current leader, passed some bullshit policy to drive those of us who remained from their shell instead of trying to correct the problem. We never had problems at events, we've long since gotten used to being the fat kids to their sports team. The problem was that we didn't fulltime a pearl to an event linkshell.

That's the issue here. Rather than fix a problem, or address it diplomatically, it became being bullied out so that there could be a semblance of control. If they refuse to admit there are problems, or potential problems, or ACTUAL problems (since it sounded like everyone there hated us from day 1) the way to fix these things like a GOOD leader is to face them head-on, not broker deals in a backroom or admin forum on how to get rid of people. This flame is about Gains being weak and incapable, not necessarily about a year's worth of drama that apparently only got talked about in gossip circles.
 
I don't know, why spend time and effort to gab and gossip about some linkshell's internal trouble? Seems like 14 year old high school girl stuff to me, yack yack yack. I never understood this obsession people have with getting in each others' business and airing personal shit publicly. Watching a giant fall is like the superbowl for FFXI players. Honestly if it's such a big surprise, that just means you had a massive inferiority complex before.

There's no big fucking secret to getting a powerful shell, by the way. Kaizen members aren't and never were super human players with fathomless skill. It's all a matter of having enough members while minimizing idiots who fuck up everything. By getting started early and having their lines shorter and constantly moving in a lot of areas, they were able to maintain enough members without recruiting too many fuck ups that would jam up the machinery.

You could cannibalize 4 bad linkshells and create 2 kaizens by discarding all the fuck ups, but that never happened, cause it's not like 2 established linkshells are going to get together and decide to merge and drop half their members, and when linkshells get started their available pool is members not already in a linkshell which usually includes a lot of fuck ups. Then the people who join are just the people available. You get as far as you can until the original members get what they want and get bored, at which point the new people who join after they leave, are paying someone else's debts and are never going to get what they want.

Hopefully this level 99 stuff will help out. If 12 people could get everything they need together, linkshells could form with specific agendas, everyone could get what they want, and then the linkshell could disband amicably. Like a static party to farm gear instead of exp.
 
blah blah blah

Sorry to officers for posting in this thread but I can't stand for this hypocritical bullshit.

I took a break from this game for roughly 8 months so I barely know any of the NB people that well but christ. I've been back for less than 3 weeks now and I've never seen a bigger group of whiners, bitches and pessimistic people in my entire 7 years of playing this game. This is mostly directed towards Lyall, Ramp and Alberic (Ikari was quite nice and the rest I never met).

I do love the fact Lyall that you leave out the part where we spent a good portion of our time in sky last weekend and the only people to walk away with any items were you, Ramp and Ikari. I mean its lolfuckingsky but you knew you were planning to leave so you made sure to get anything you could before doing so and Wlegs was good enough. So I'm glad I wasted my time in helping you, you're welcome. I'm not sure why Ramp was even allowed to bid an Osode, that should have just been sold, since he has no jobs that can even use it. Planning to level a job that will use it is garbage and I wouldn't be surprised if he's already tried to sell/sold it.

Why was attending the KS99 such a problem for you all? Alberic brought up how her "friends" never were able to use an orb and thus why they were not coming to the last run we did because they felt they had no chance to use it. Later when she tried to backtrack the statement Courtney called her out on it multiple times and it made her look foolish and probably led to her leaving. I mean did Ramp not get a speed belt that funded Alberic's relic in a previous run? Seriously your friends were bitching they would never get a turn to use an orb but one of you got a speed belt? That's a laugh. It's a fucking /RANDOM roll for the love of jebus, equal opportunity for all! Granted people who had already went a previous run shouldn't have been allowed to go again before someone who hadn't gone initially, I will agree with you there, but Gains made note of that and implemented that rule of having to wait until everyone has gone.

So Lyall and Ikari leave this week but Ramp did not. Yes Ramp was kicked but he pretty much begged to be kicked after all his friends were gone. If I didn't play this game on xbox I'd have screencaped every whiney thing you said in my short time back. Most negative person I've ever seen in this game "Why camp anything we won't claim it?" Theres always a chance dude, you acted like bots haven't existed for the last 5 years. Multiple KBs have popped with hardly any competition over the last few weeks but because we either didn't have the man power or know the TOD they went eventually to LS's who got people there. Maybe if we didn't have such resistance in camping or have to do a search on our members we could have been there faster when it popped unclaimed. I'm straying from my point but anything in this game can happen when dealing with mediocre LS's (which most if not all are on Quetz) fighting HNMs. So to just throw a fit about having to camp a few times a week, if that, is ridiculous. It's not 24/7, it's not a job and you're helping people you're supposed to "like". But seems to me NB only cared about NB after all.

Speaking of that, all of you would constantly refer to yourselves as a group and "us" but anytime anyone else would use that same description for you, you'd act like we were grouping you together. You were fucking doing it yourselves! Jeezus. Not to mention anytime there was an arguement going on in the LS with one of you, the rest of you would quickly change from your NB LS to ours to chime in. And that is the only time you would all ever even be in the LS at the same time. I've been back 3 weeks on nearly every day and I think I saw Lyall 3 times, Ramp 5, and Ikari twice with half of those times only being to jump in during debates and arguements.

In the end this thread will soon die because nobody will care and all will be well in the world. I await the nitpicking of this post from NB members that really don't have an effect on the actual message but go for it if it makes you feel better. I'm doubting I'll respond again. See ya around!

Oh wow I'll also add that Firestreak is here, it wouldn't be a flame without him! <3
 
I don't know, why spend time and effort to gab and gossip about some linkshell's internal trouble? Seems like 14 year old high school girl stuff to me, yack yack yack.
14 year old high school gossip is the purest, concentrated form of the flameboard.
You are bitching why?
 
I was gonna pretty this up with quote windows and all for you, Cro, but I figured you'd forgive me since you said you were done with this flame. Shame, I was glad someone from that shell had the balls to at least try to defend themselves. I'll miss you.

Re: Sky and gear

First of all, I didn't plan on leaving. I was forced out, hence my offense. I didn't want to go, I said before in this thread a couple times that I liked running with Kaizen. Even then, would it matter? You're implying because I allegedly knew I was leaving, I somehow made Kirin drop W. Legs so I could get them and then quit? You do realize that by my winning W. Legs, I had more points than anyone else bidding W.Legs, with the right jobs to use W.Legs. If I somehow gamed the system by showing up to events purely so I could quit, I'm doing it wrong. Don't be upset that shit hit the fan and I happened to get W. Legs right before, but making it out like I intentionally (somehow) got them SPECIFICALLY so I could quit, you're making things up.

Regarding Ramp's Osode? He didn't sell it, he still has it. He's leveling Samurai. You do realize you agreed with me on something though, right? Ramp shouldn't have been allowed to lot the Osode since he has no jobs for it. But he could anyway. Who was leading that night? Gains. Gains allowed Ramp to lot gear he had no business getting. This circles back to Gains being a shitty leader, so thank you.

Re: KS99

The run you're talking about took place on Valentine's Day. As per tradition, I got fucked up and played video games that day. Following the then-current decree by Gains, if you weren't attending an event you shouldn't have been online. I wasn't. I can't speak for Alberic's statements that night since I only vaguely recall it, having been pretty sauced before logging on to try and sort things out. I was one of the people who was frustrated with Ks99s. Way back during your absence, an officer wanted to do KS runs for an event and we needed people to get orbs, otherwise the event would be canceled. Three people turned up (I think, was a while ago) and I lost both lots to pop. The next time we did KS99s, I lost all the lots to pop. The time after that, Ramp got his Belt, Rone ragequit and took a tank with him (Classy act, there) and I didn't get to pop. I think my frustrations were sufficient to vent a bit to my friends; the orb has been sitting in my inventory for six~ months now. It wasn't that I didn't get to pop it, it's that I only grabbed it because the shell needed orbs in the first place, and then I was consistently, through bad luck, left in the dirt with inventory -1.

I know Gains made policy THAT NIGHT about older orbs getting first shot on the next runs, but I'm not exactly around for them anymore. Credit to Gains in this one instance.

Re: HNMs and botting
We all know bots have been around for a long time. We should all agree, however, that they have significantly improved in recent years. A machine to detect and /ja Provoke a mob isn't nearly as advanced as a packet-sniffing, CODE detecting machine that knows before the server does something is going to pop. The time you're referencing about having to /sea for us, the only remaining Nightblades were myself, Ikari and Ramp. Treg sent me and me alone tells to get to Fafnir. I didn't even get them until a few hours later, I was AFK in a party during the time.

Actually, I'll concede a point. If anyone had mentioned that we almost had KB, or that KB wasn't camped I probably would have been less resistant to going out to contested, botted camps. I will point out, however, that it WAS 24/7. You saw the same post I did, it's on page one under a spoiler tag if you wanted to go double-check it. Fulltime the pearl, and be reachable for HNMs and camps, or get out. It's pretty clear.

Re: You NB people
Dubbed thusly by I don't even remember, this was the working moniker for everyone in my shell for a long, long time. We tried really, really hard to downplay the fact we were a tightly knit social shell, but after being reminded over and over that no matter what, I was an NB People the urge to appease people who had already judged me was very, very small.

I'll remind you that every single time we were needed for anything, Rhad or Zeth would send Alberic and only Alberic a tell, asking where "your people" are. The rest of us were online, the rest of us were also accessible, but we were always handled through a third party. If that's not clearly being handled, I don't know how else to make that clear. From the starting days, the line between "us" and "them" was crystal clear. It took maybe a week for Kaizen to be disappointed we weren't immediately a part of their happy bubbly family.

As for my phrasing now, yes, it is "us" and "them." I'm doing it now because, well, I AM a Nightblade. I'm a part of the shell, always have been, and the fact that I wouldn't drop that title to conform to Kaizen's shell always seemed to be an issue. Every time this was brought up in the past, every single solitary leader said "Well, you should drop that shell anyway and always wear Kaizen." I guess it's hard to understand if you're not in the situation, but having someone tell you to drop your pearl and family so you can be forced to get along with everyone else in a shell is a rough transition not helped at all by the general low-population and lingering feeling of never really being accepted.

Re: Shell changing for arguments
I wasn't only much in the past two weeks. I'd been leveling a lot, I had things happening in real life, I was taking a bit of a break. Every single time I was online in the week leading up to my exit, there was some drama about something. I happened to log on in the middle of an argument? Well shucks, I have a bad luck of timing. Kinda like how W. Legs knew I was quitting so they dropped for me, I guess. I was even in your party the day of that Kirin when we argued at-length on shell about it. I even apologized for being such a cock, mentioned I had a long, hard week and you seemed amiable about it. I guess now that I'm gone and calling the problems into light though, that camaraderie is gone. Shame.

Re: Your statement
In the end, this post will die because Kaizen has an incredibly strict, no-flameboard rule. They won't defend themselves, they won't come forward to talk or point out any fault in my logic. Dejavu posted on their behalf and probably got asked by TG who was asked by Treg/Ilana/Gains to stop having things posted. You apologized to officers, and for what? You came here bringing a fight to try and make me look bad, or maybe to point out the ugly truth I was hiding? Kaizen won't do that, though. Kaizen would rather be defamed publicly and pray and hope that it all blows over rather than face a problem. Meast broke it when he went ape-shit after getting banned for being a duping cheater and that was basically the last time any kind of passion came forward from Kaizen, save for tonight when you showed up.

You had to apologize for defending your linkshell and your family and friends, and YOU'VE only been back for a couple weeks. What the fuck? Don't apologize. I'm sorry if I got you in trouble, but fuck, man, at least you have a spine. I saw basically every single current Kaizmonaut on QCDN reading this shell, and no one has the courage or wherewithal to say anything?

You're too cool to respond to this, but you'll probably at least read it. I'll respect you for having balls, at least, even if we don't like each other.

This thread might fade and die. It probably will, but Kaizen's going to do the same. Good luck with the shell for the next sixth months before they become (go back to being) irrelevant.
 
In the end, this post will die because Kaizen has an incredibly strict, no-flameboard rule. They won't defend themselves, they won't come forward to talk or point out any fault in my logic. Dejavu posted on their behalf and probably got asked by TG who was asked by Treg/Ilana/Gains to stop having things posted. You apologized to officers, and for what? You came here bringing a fight to try and make me look bad, or maybe to point out the ugly truth I was hiding? Kaizen won't do that, though. Kaizen would rather be defamed publicly and pray and hope that it all blows over rather than face a problem. Meast broke it when he went ape-shit after getting banned for being a duping cheater and that was basically the last time any kind of passion came forward from Kaizen, save for tonight when you showed up.

I was not actually asked to stop posting or to post by Truegrave� I was just watching the Rocker for the last like 2 hrs� Funny movie by the way >.>.
 
I was not actually asked to stop posting or to post by Truegrave� I was just watching the Rocker for the last like 2 hrs� Funny movie by the way >.>.

That's the dude from the Office as a drummer, right? Seemed decent, the song they promo'd in Rock Band was fun, too. Also, don't mind the tinfoil. Kaizen is pretty anal about never wanting to discuss things in public.
 
wow my post got screwed up badly... i am posting behind a proxy because for some reason my computer wont load up this site straight. Sorry for the strange symbols.
 
@ Limitlesss: he got the burden of leadership lifted off of him and vanished) what the hell do you expect us to do? Also, at having ~24 people on mondays? http://forum.ascension-kaizen.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=4361 What is this? That is 13, not even close to 24.

I will post due to this. Ramp, just because we had low attendence for one week does not mean that I do not a solid group of players every Monday. The actually weird thing about that run was we won Glacier with that many people. If you would like I can post the attendence for the last month. We have had a strong turn out of people. I had 24 people on Monday for Jeuno, we killed DL without a merge, the shadow ring and shadow mantle that currently reside on Ilana and Apoc were acquired last week.

You are complaining about how leadership was passed to your group in limitless? I was given one run to know how everything works, and then the shell was turned over to me. Dealing with hardships is what makes you a good leader, understand where and what people would like. You learn new tatics, you modify your exisiting strategies that is what a leader does. Complaining only shows a weakness and transmits a lack of confidence to your dedicated players. I am happy that everyone that runs on Mondays comes out to acquire gear, I love to try new things in dynamis, we pull the smn house in windy and we push deep into hydras in Glacier. When you highlight one post, it just shows that you take the worst scenario and do not look at things in a whole. We have very little bickering and I will say that when things do arise I make sure all parties have a satisfactory answer.

@Lyall: Dejavu has and will never post for me. He simply called my cell to tell me of this flame. I do not need to address anything with his posts as those of his own opinions that he was willing to post. I will address that no leader has asked me to post. I am doing this of my own will, I just do not see the point in addressing your posts as there was a disagreement and this is a sad result that has come of it. As for the Livvy comment, I will not play the friend card, but I will say the comment was beyond the line of good taste.

I apologize for the wall of text
 
Ladies and Gentlemen, Kaizen's response to criticism. Thanks for coming, I don't expect an encore.
 
I do not say anywhere in my response that I am representing Kaizen. I am representing myself, so please do not use general terms for one person.
 
I do not say anywhere in my response that I am representing Kaizen. I am representing myself, so please do not use general terms for one person.

You're proving the point, though. You're a part of the same shell I used to be in, you were a part of the same policies I was, you were at the same events I was, yet you won't say anything in one direction or the other. Your silence is exactly what is expected whenever Kaizen gets mentioned in anything dramatic. The fact you HAVE been posting in this thread without commenting on the original topic is testament to Kaizen's refusal to do anything for their public image.

You could represent Kaizen but you have a standing gag order to never comment on anything that might make the shell look bad (worse). Inaction is still an action, every single officer has viewed this thread today, current and pre-existing, and every one of them bit their tongues. If I'm wrong, why didn't anyone come forward to plead their case?

There's a reason most people thought Kaizen didn't exist anymore. Outside of the shell, you don't.
 
You could represent Kaizen but you have a standing gag order to never comment on anything that might make the shell look bad (worse). Inaction is still an action, every single officer has viewed this thread today, current and pre-existing, and every one of them bit their tongues. If I'm wrong, why didn't anyone come forward to plead their case?

One man representing an organization makes for large assumpations(pretty sure I spelled that wrong)... I do not want that responsibility, that is why I declined the leadership that Kaizen asked me. (I try to stay out of the lime light as much as possible)

Now, for my personal incite into this entire matter, I will say that a huge weight has been lifted from Kaizen's chest. When Rone and I incorporated you into our smn burns, how was that favor repaid? It was not, I made the effort, you had taken the xp and continued to smn burn and did not bother to return the favor. I will agree that your application as a whole was at a moment of weakness in Kaizen's history. Honestly, what does it matter that some of the gear was uncontested? You got the gear, does it make any less useful? You put the work in and were rewarded for that work. Honestly, I am surprised since you being a sponsor of limitless would not want to venture into HNM of Sandworm or DI. They can make money and they are open air claims not a dungeon.

How hard is it to wear a pearl that could do event potentially do an event at the drop of a hat (Not HNM) we used to do random sea and sky farming. The fact that we did them and do not do them at the moment should make no difference, the movement will wane like everything else. Like most shells there are ups and downs, if there is no drive we do not do it. Even when I first joined the shell we were doing Fafnir and Tiamat, that is not as time consuming. Fafnir you sit in the Aery for a little while go afk, and earn points. All I ever did was watch movies and play my ps3. Tiamat, leave a mule and if it is up see who is on and try to claim.

The policy should not have been even created. If you did not like the way the shell is going there is the way of quitting. Your list of problems: Gains did not take up leadership "willingly", she was trying her best preserve the shell, but there was no good ultimatum to be had. Did she have make a few bad decisions? Yes, but those were old tatics that we have used time and time again, they have proven true to us. Did we JoL with the 3 tanks stacked next to each other? Yes, we did and we had some bumps (no tank wiped), but it worked.

Bottom line Kaizen will go it's own and you will go yours. I look forward to the next week to see how your reactions will play out in a shell you could not get along and want to do Einherjar with these same group of people.
 
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