Looks like Peregrine was right. Blm nerf.

Marajade said:
Oh, and to dispell it, BLMs cannot Burn Kirin. Odon was refering that its BLMs that do the damage to him in the traditional setup, not that he could burn it.
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how about all the mages just pack up there shit and leave sky? Then you fucking bitch melee can whine that you can't do it all alone. Its still a cooperative effort with each other. Were there helping you and you guys rip us apart and tear us down because of a few things we can do alone.


Think about this, even if we are "manaburning" kirin. There is only ONE THING that a blm would generally want of him and thats a kirin pole (which isn't even the best the ra/ex one off of taxium is better as far as a weapon goes). BLM nuking kirin makes him die faster, along with smn bloodpacts. Faster god kills = more pops = more gear out to members of the ls(melee jobs mostly) there are 3 items in sky for mages zennith slacks crown and mitts. There is a shit load of melee items yet were still going up there were still helping out were still doing our part while you guys huff it with your treasure hunter 2/3/4, your extream ws damage, your massive deffence and hps all to help you make gill.

We show up and help with things to help (at least i do) and you guys are knocking on the whole job because we go for a few things on our own. Instead of getting pissed at the blms for meleee wanting to leech a blm onry run why not bitch at that melee that wants to leech the blm onry run?
 
Sirelrohir said:
Other then the snoll tsar, i have never heard or seen anyone manaburn any of the CoP missions. Astral burn, yes, but mana burn no. If this is true, keep in mind that blm arent the only ones that can do it.

As for your ZM examples, Alot of those missions are much easier in a traditional pt set up. Again, i'd like to know who has burned all the zm missions.
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Numerous people. Actualy, our server is quite behind in manaburn progression, probably due to lower population.
But if you need examples, look at TarutaruLS. They've all done it already. Just BLMs and a smattering of other jobs like BRD and PLD.
 
Passions said:
how about all the mages just pack up there shit and leave sky? Then you fucking bitch melee can whine that you can't do it all alone. Its still a cooperative effort with each other. Were there helping you and you guys rip us apart and tear us down because of a few things we can do alone.
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And therin lies the problem. Melees need BLM to get the stuff done. Does the BLM need the meele's?
 
oh, and btw. On the issue of "make magic do less damage unless you SC!" thingy for end-game.

Unless a BLM use Elemental Seal on things like Wyrms, they will get resisted a lot. In almost all end-game fights (with some exceptions) the main damage comes from SC + MB.

Besides, BLM isn't extremely overpowered like RNG was, BLM is still limited by their ammount of MP. RNGs were limited in nothing but the size of their wallet.
 
Marajade said:
Snol Tzar
Oruyu
Mithra tracker batle
Mammet battle (with one paladin)
Promyvion (again with paladin)
Moblin battle (paladin need arguable)
Phomia Aquaducts Minotaur (with 18 )
Diabolos (arguable)
Ultima/Omega (mr paladin again)
Tenzen (paladin ahoy!)

Now, on to RoZ:
ZM4, no PLD needed, just good stun work.
ZM5, with 18 (they could even do Ash dragon on the way down.)
ZM6
ZM8 (maybe a paladin)
ZM12
Skip ZM14 and do DM (we already know)

K, off to Endgame
Any lesser HNM, but then issue of claiming so i'll leave it out
wouldnt do Kings because BLMs want nothing
KS99s already confirmed they can burn Behe and turtle
Dynamis, with a few scattered other jobs
And lets not forget that lovely KS30 they seem to think is gods gift to them.

Oh, and to dispell it, BLMs cannot Burn Kirin. Odon was refering that its BLMs that do the damage to him in the traditional setup, not that he could burn it.
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Most of those, you are either dead wrong about or just about any job combination could beat it.
 
Marajade said:
And therin lies the problem. Melees need BLM to get the stuff done. Does the BLM need the meele's?
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mages can't get there sky items without melee. magic pots lol yeah right. and honestly if your just manaburning everything fast fast fast whats the point of playing? if everything can be won with just blms whats the thril to keep you going?
 
Firestreak said:
Most of those, you are either dead wrong about or just about any job combination could beat it.
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Which are wrong? Because from what i've seen, its been done.
Sure other PT setups can beat the missions, we've seen it. But when a BLM has a choice of "hard, with moderate chance of sucess" to "easy, with 90% sucess", which would you pick?
 
Marajade said:
Numerous people. Actualy, our server is quite behind in manaburn progression, probably due to lower population.
But if you need examples, look at TarutaruLS. They've all done it already. Just BLMs and a smattering of other jobs like BRD and PLD.
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Well, more power to them, they found a way to make it work.

however, my point still is, how is nerfing blm going to affect you? At the moment, you have to do these missions the way se intended, right? You are still going to have to set up a pt w/ melee, rdm, whm, blm, w/e?

When blm gets nerfed, how is this going to change the fact that as a melee, you are still going to have to set up your pt the same way.

This is what i dont understand. Why are all of you so pro nerf, when it is going to change absolutlely nothing for your situation?
 
Marajade said:
Snol Tzar
Oruyu
Mithra tracker batle
Mammet battle (with one paladin)
Promyvion (again with paladin)
Moblin battle (paladin need arguable)
Phomia Aquaducts Minotaur (with 18 )
Diabolos (arguable)
Ultima/Omega (mr paladin again)
Tenzen (paladin ahoy!)
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Even in burn form, blm isn't ideal for any of those fights, they won't be the biggiest DD for any of those fights, with the exception of Ouryu.

Snoll - Rdm/blm, mnk/war, sam/rng, then a distant 4th, barely above thf/drk is blm.
Mithra trackers - Rdm/blm >>>>>>>> other jobs.
Mammets - Hasted Nin/rdm >>>>>>>> other jobs, and yes as DD.
Promys - Blm not that great, each boss is weak to one element, and you have one spell of that element.
Moblins - This fight is a joke, never heard of anyone losing it. But again, mnk and rdm/blm are better DD's.
Minotaur - 2 nin and a whm can trio this, can't think of any setup where a small group of blms could win it.
Diabolos - Hasted Nin/rdm >>>>>>> other jobs.
Ultima/Omega - Skill > job, you can't manaburn this fight.
Tenzen - 2 SC's with big MB > any manaburn setup for this fight. Pld? He hits like a pussy, and if the fight lasts over 30 seconds you lose.
 
Marajade said:
Which are wrong? Because from what i've seen, its been done.
Sure other PT setups can beat the missions, we've seen it. But when a BLM has a choice of "hard, with moderate chance of sucess" to "easy, with 90% sucess", which would you pick?
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Why do u care if they can do it hard or easy? Why arent u just worried about how you can do it?
 
Passions said:
mages can't get there sky items without melee. magic pots lol yeah right.
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You just said you didnt need anything from sky. Maybe just A.hands? Just gather up 14 of your BLM friends with a couple Pld and BRD friends, and i'm sure you could manaburn the items to pop genbu. And we already know Genbu is a pansy pushover.
Passions said:
and honestly if your just manaburning everything fast fast fast whats the point of playing? if everything can be won with just blms whats the thril to keep you going?
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Exactly. However, many players cant seem to understand that fact, and just go for fast fast fast. And when players make mistakes and abuse somthing, the developer needs to come in and fix it.
 
Marajade said:
And therin lies the problem. Melees need BLM to get the stuff done. Does the BLM need the meele's?
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Then why don't you argue that there should be more endgame gear geared towards BLM? When you see a BLM in incredible gear, they will mostly be in synthed gear. For melees, it is all ex/rare gear or gear that drops off of NM/HNM.

For example I have 2 pieces on my BLM I got from endgame. A hand and rostrum pumps. The rest I got on my own.

My ninja on the other hand? Osode, Haidates, Kotes, Shiranui, some people will collect as much of the Dryadic set as they can afford to uncurse.(I don't for space reasons).

Being that endgame activities get done, I find it hard to believe BLM are so snobby as you claim them to be. But feel free to call any BLM snobby that nukes Kirin for your Osode.
 
Stouter said:
Even in burn form, blm isn't ideal for any of those fights, they won't be the biggiest DD for any of those fights, with the exception of Ouryu.

Snoll - Rdm/blm, mnk/war, sam/rng, then a distant 4th, barely above thf/drk is blm.
Mithra trackers - Rdm/blm >>>>>>>> other jobs.
Mammets - Hasted Nin/rdm >>>>>>>> other jobs, and yes as DD.
Promys - Blm not that great, each boss is weak to one element, and you have one spell of that element.
Moblins - This fight is a joke, never heard of anyone losing it. But again, mnk and rdm/blm are better DD's.
Minotaur - 2 nin and a whm can trio this, can't think of any setup where a small group of blms could win it.
Diabolos - Hasted Nin/rdm >>>>>>> other jobs.
Ultima/Omega - Skill > job, you can't manaburn this fight.
Tenzen - 2 SC's with big MB > any manaburn setup for this fight. Pld? He hits like a pussy, and if the fight lasts over 30 seconds you lose.
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But look at all how each one has a different job setup than the last misson.
Is BLM the best? no. Is it the one combination that can go though All of them with a single setup doing the same thing every time? Yes.

However, i would thank you for pointing out the Ultima/Omega one.
 
Meh, couldnt really manaburn water or olla for genbu pop. Manaburn isnt THAT great really, honestly it sounds like SE wants to balance things out, and my making BLMs need melee more, that creates balance. At least in theory.

CoP missions arent very manaburnable, in most of those cases it would be more risk to manaburn that it would to do it another way. Like stouter said, ouryu is really the only one.
 
Uzor said:
Besides, BLM isn't extremely overpowered like RNG was, BLM is still limited by their ammount of MP. RNGs were limited in nothing but the size of their wallet.
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Rng was limited by how much hate the tank could hold, because rng sure as hell can't straight tank anything for more than 5 seconds, even with nin sub. The one part of rng nerf that was justified was damage vs HNM's, the rest was overboard. Similar arguement for bst nerf, and drg nerf. I'm sure if blm gets nerfed, it will either be way too much, or barely noticeable (like nin nerfs)
 
Im gonna laugh my ass off if everyone is panicing now and the blm nerf doesnt affect it that much. Seriously, let it happen, and then whine :P
 
Firestreak said:
Then why don't you argue that there should be more endgame gear geared towards BLM? When you see a BLM in incredible gear, they will mostly be in synthed gear. For melees, it is all ex/rare gear or gear that drops off of NM/HNM.

For example I have 2 pieces on my BLM I got from endgame. A hand and rostrum pumps. The rest I got on my own.

My ninja on the other hand? Osode, Haidates, Kotes, Shiranui, some people will collect as much of the Dryadic set as they can afford to uncurse.(I don't for space reasons).

Being that endgame activities get done, I find it hard to believe BLM are so snobby as you claim them to be. But feel free to call any BLM snobby that nukes Kirin for your Osode.
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BLM does get fucked over for gear, most of theirs can be bought. Weskit should have been a rare/ex drop imo, its the best blm body and its synth ingredient drops so much its rediculous.

However, also read that they said they were going to balance blm, but add more spells, rare/ex drops, to compensate. Which really, is a great idea. Make more of a difference between the blms that work their asses off in HNM ls's for next to nothing and the blm who just buys some gear off the AH.
 
Marajade said:
Which are wrong? Because from what i've seen, its been done.
Sure other PT setups can beat the missions, we've seen it. But when a BLM has a choice of "hard, with moderate chance of sucess" to "easy, with 90% sucess", which would you pick?
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Make it easier for me, name one of that list you spat off that you feel strongly about. Name one ZM, or CoP or BC, or KS that you can't beat with MNKS as your only damage dealers.
 
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