Next update on EXP

I am a player who plays a character named Firestreak. If Firestreak was suddenly reset to level 1 in all jobs, crafts skills and lost all gil it would not diminish my player skill.but you can't argue that my character itself would have less worth. Hence a player and character are different. While skill usually increases with level, sometimes they change independantly of each other. Not all PLD the same level and same gear hold hate as well. While at the same time all paladins that hold hate well aren't the same level.

And just another side point... Genkai doesn't really stop crappy players from advancing, not until level 70 at least. People just get hold-held through it. I've seen some extremely horrid players while helping with G2, but I never had to heart to just say "Kick these people,. they don't deserve to pass g2." It appears to me that for the most part the better players slow their own leveling based on gil requirements. If this is so than the worse players are going to get to 75 much faster while the better players won't feel as much benefit by far.
 
Firestreak said:
I am a player who plays a character named Firestreak. If Firestreak was suddenly reset to level 1 in all jobs, crafts skills and lost all gil it would not diminish my player skill.but you can't argue that my character itself would have less worth. Hence a player and character are different. While skill usually increases with level, sometimes they change independantly of each other. Not all PLD the same level and same gear hold hate as well. While at the same time all paladins that hold hate well aren't the same level.
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Ok, so if all PLD 75s are not created equal already, and Sometimes skill of PLD 50 > skill of PLD 75, what does the sudden change in amount of XP have to do with a sudden influx of n00bs at higher levels?

Ok, your character would have less worth in the game, because it would be level 1. But you already have the skill behind that character. So what does it matter if a person, who already has that skill, gets to 75 a bit faster than someone who already is at 75 with equal or less skill, but hit that point already due to the amount of time the player who is already at 75 had to put into leveling?

My whole point, to all of you, is that the n00bs are going to get to that level no matter what. This change in XP is only going to cut hours off of that amount of time. However, it is going to make it easier for people who have skill to get to 75 as well.

Therefore the ratio of n00bs:skilled is going to continue to be the same. The people at higher levels who are complaining about this are failing to see the point.

As far as your worth argument is concerned, though I still don't see how any of that matters, my character is still going to be of the same worth to me no matter how much time I put into leveling, because I still put the same amount of time into actually playing the game, though that time is not all spent leveling. I bet you that if we had spent the same amount of time playing the game, most of mine would be spent doing other things, while yours would be spent leveling. Therefore, no matter what, our characters would still posses the same worth.

Again, if your argument is that people can breeze to 75 faster and aren't going to take the time to farm for gear, my argument remains the same, that the people who spend their time leveling and not getting good gear are going to be at the same amount as the people who do spend that extra time farming and have good gear - they will both get to level 75 in the end, and the ratio will continue to be equal.
 
Firestreak said:
I'm going ot call you out on this. You can't possibly not feel like those accomplishments are more meaningful because of the difficulty. What of your lu shang rod if suddenly they cut down the required fish by a huge amount?
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Just as an aside here, S-E has actually made it easier to get Lu Shangs. You can turn in two types of fish now instead of just one, and it is by far easier to fish them up post-patch then pre-patch (for me, anyways).

I guess really the way I look at it is this. Let's just say for example that they cut a straight 5000 xp out of each level (that seems high to me personally). Let's say that even in a total crap pt you can crank out 2500 xp per hour. That only cuts out 2 hours of levelling per level. You can look at this the pessimist way. 75-51*2 = 48 hours. Okay, that's 2 game days less that a lvl 51 now has to spend levelling. That again might seem high, but to most people if you do a /playtime you'll see that 2 days is hardly a big chunk of your time.

Now you can also look at this in an optimistic way. I have a static that meets once a week for 3 hours at a time. We always make more than 2500 xp per hour. We're just burdened down by the fact that we can only meet 6 hours a week due to our jobs and two members having a child to raise. For us, being able to level 1 or 2 hours quicker than before is amazing. Now we can actually try to gain a level a week rather than having to leave people hanging. You can /check any of us and see that we have great gear and everything, but we just can't soar through the levels.

Does this somehow make us worse players that we got this rather small advantage (1 or 2 hours xp advantage per week)? I think people like us are what this patch is being designed for. I think if you look at the numbers, you'll see that this isn't really bad. Hell, even if they cut out 10000 xp per level (which I highly doubt), that's 4 days of playtime for a 51 to hit 75. I can see where the 75s are coming from, but I just don't see how this is really going to hurt the servers in the long run.
 
Rappa said:
Just as an aside here, S-E has actually made it easier to get Lu Shangs. You can turn in two types of fish now instead of just one, and it is by far easier to fish them up post-patch then pre-patch (for me, anyways).
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Until you consider the fact that a turned-in carp is worth 10 gil and that each carp caught isn't worth the bait you used to fish it up. Plus, with the hard cap of 200 fish/day before fatigue cuts you off, it still takes nearly 2 months of fishing if you want to catch them all yourself.
 
Cubs, that only really affects the people who are buying their carp for getting it. I was referring to the people who actually fish them all up. To me, it isn't an accomplishment if you're just buying the rod but pretending you did something by buying the fish instead of the rod. 10 gil / carp is still more than enough to pay for your bait.
 
If you buy your paste from the AH, that's 400-500 a stack. 400 for paste - 120 for carp = loss.

If you synth it yourself, worms + corn + water is about 85 for a synth, not counting crystals. If you can get your earth crystals for 400/stack nowadays (I sure can't) then yes, you break even.
 
I make it when I have stacks of earth crystals I got while xping most of the time. You can also grow the millioncorn if you really want to save money, but that's neither here nor there. I can go craft a single stack of arrowwood lumber to pay for all my supplies. The cost of the bait for moats isn't that big a deal. The 200 fish per limit cap hurts a bit but it's not gonna kill ya. I guess it's easier for the "casual" fisherman and harder for the "hardcore" fisherman. For me, it's a much more obtainable goal now though. :)
 
CubsWoo said:
Rappa said:
Just as an aside here, S-E has actually made it easier to get Lu Shangs. You can turn in two types of fish now instead of just one, and it is by far easier to fish them up post-patch then pre-patch (for me, anyways).
Click to expand...

Until you consider the fact that a turned-in carp is worth 10 gil and that each carp caught isn't worth the bait you used to fish it up. Plus, with the hard cap of 200 fish/day before fatigue cuts you off, it still takes nearly 2 months of fishing if you want to catch them all yourself.
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Of course, people trading in fish for Lu Shang's have -always- been getting a smaller ammount of money per fish than they could be getting. Under the old system (4k/stack of carp, 1.2k for turning in a stack to the NPC), each fish was 333.3~ gil to the AH and 100 to the NPC. No matter how you slice it, you're paying 233.3~ gil per carp you turn in to the NPC.

Back to the main topic...

Fire, it seems to me (and to others) that you've been contradicting yourself. So tell me, exactly, why is lowering the tnl for 51-75 a bad thing?
 
Fire, it seems to me (and to others) that you've been contradicting yourself. So tell me, exactly, why is lowering the tnl for 51-75 a bad thing?
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Depends on who's post he's replying to at the time.
 
And Mistaya, if you believe 72 DRK is worth more than 75 blm and 73 PLD combined, you would be right in your assumption. I personally disagree, but I would say it's an important fact that you can't level up as one job and switch your job and have that be high level two. Many would sure love to level BRD up and switch the levels onto THF I bet.
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I said any not all. But my 54 ninja got to 54(About half-way to 75 in pure EXP) in less than one month. My 72 drk is still 72 after a year and a half. My brd went from 0-42 in less than 2 weeks. If investing the same hours, certain jobs are easier than others to level. This is unarguable. I don't want to sound cocky like drk is the hardest job to level (I'll let the DRG's talk to you about that.) but if time invested in leveling is all your basing it on, then the healing tanking and support classes are the easiest jobs in the game. (Not talking about player skill, just exp-hour) And it shows because of the unusually high number of total retards especially in the healing/support classes at 75. I'm not trying to call anyone names because none of you reading this are those people from my experience but there ARE a lot of horrible RDM/WHM/BLM/NIN/PLD at 75. You don't see horrible meelee at 75 because they just dont get invited past 65 or so. (I've also never seen a horrible BRD personally. I don't know why.)

Genkai may be a joke now but it wasn't when I did it. Bringing 18 lvl 48ish to beat the shizz out of exoreys, and dying more often than not due to total lack of player skill, and staying till ALL 18 got the mold... Thats how I did my genkai one. Running around Eldieme looking for lichs since we didnt know where they were! Getting wtfpwned by undead in garlaige cuz sneak wore and only half the whm's even bought it... We had no high level help back in january. You could say my genaki one is worth more since I did it the hard way without cheating and calling in high lvl help. You could say my alliance of 18 lvl 30's (our highest was 35) beating the rank5 missions was worth more than a run through by the local 70+. But i dont think any of the people who do it the easy way now are worth less. I don't think anyones accomplishmensts are worth less even if it was easier. You know why? I was one of the first rank5 on the server. I was damn proud and still am. No matter how many rank 5's there are and no matter how easy it gets to be rank 5 I know I did it the hard way. Don't grudge the people who are up-and-coming. Everything in this game has gotten easier over time. /shrug

(If i can find it I might post a couple pics of doing rank4 in the tower. We didn't know dolls dont aggro anything but magic. We were just killing every mob on the way. Got to experience Meltdown for the first time as a lvl 25. There were 18 dead bodies. Lucklily a JP taru farming lightning crystals came by and raised us XD Thank you syrup wherever you are!)
 
Tyrath said:
Im just gonna comment on that. People are missing a whole new bunch of end game content waiting for people in Al'teiau. Sure its hard as hell to get there, but its still waiting. Eventually people will start working on them and get the end game content thats there(or will be there after a few updates) ^^
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I'd have to agree with Tyrath on this one, there are a ton of end-game players that haven't even touched some of the expansion areas, and if they complain about lack of content and things to do, then they do it out of their own ignorance. Just because the CoP missions are mid level caps does not mean they are meant to be taken on my people with their first level 40 job or new players. They take immense organization, talent, and preparation. Things that come naturally in the end-game.

To comment on another point brought up in this thread, the level-cap. People go back and forth on this all the time, but the level cap is already pushing the limits as far as "uber combos" go. 80/40 would cause too many jobs to become obsolete, and that's the last thing that anyone wants, especially SE.
 
I'm trying to understand why anyone would so adamantly oppose something that would make life easier. I was reading the things that was being written and came to a conclusion that it is this viewpoint that I think is the problem.

Firestreak said:
This game is unfortunately driven by jealousy.
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I just wanna know how many others feel this way? Because I do not.
 
We don't know the specific mechanics, so talk of how it will affect the game or atmosphere is pretty pointless. You can talk about intent all you want though, since they've already commented on that. As was mentioned pretty early in the thread, *most* of the game isn't about being high level any longer. High level is what's emphasized on boards, but the entire expansion pack fleshed out middle adventuring pretty nicely.

As for Square Enix alienating the high level community--no offense, but the high level community has caused more balance issues with the game than any other user base, and I think Square finally realizes that. The "hardcore" players squat the drops, the guilds, and the features with unrelenting obsession. One guild isn't enough--get a mule. 40 million gil isn't enough. Got to make my 5 prism gear a day and dominate the auction house. And it's not via harder work mind you--they simply started earlier and unintentionally make getting to where they are more than twice as difficult as they had it.

In short, high levelers have gotten their reward. They're there. They're connected. They're comfortably set. Their actual level has little to do with what assets they have. You can be 73, but if you're not plugged into a L73 community you've got nothing. You can be 80 cloth, but if you don't have the capital to bust skulls with the highest, you're nothing...you're just sitting there like a chump making textiles for them. * aka me*

Anyway, look at it as a reward. That's healthier. If you're up there, you should have expected company sooner or later. This is a reward to the general pick-up partier. This is a reward to the 2nd tier meleers. Content will always match the characteristics of the fanbase. I would worry more about people abusing the markets--for doing things that are considered felonies in real life economics--than what this xp reduction will do.

This game would do well to drop the players who think domination and asset concentration is entertainment. If you look at this from a negative aspect, you're setting yourself up as an antagonist to the rest of your peers. I would go so far as to say if SE had to choose between the dominant players and the general players, the dominant players would be on their way out. It's the whole it's-mine-get-back mentality that screws this game out of so much potential.

Anyway, pet peeve of mine. Just the ramblings of a blue-collar quetza citizen.
 
My sentiments exactly

{Word}

Liefe said:
I think this is really a horrible change. I realize it makes the game easier for some people out there, and no offense, but I could really care less. This change (I'm guessing they are gonna knock 10-15% of the total exp needed to reach 75) really destroys the accomplishment of being level 75, not to mention opens up a whole new portal for gilsellers, and worst of all, crowds the already grossly overcrowded endgame content available (3 kings, sky, etc ).

So instead of making levelling as much of an accomplishment, what?

-Dynamis is cockblocked to 2 times a week still with its shitty af2 droprates and ridiculous amounts of currency needed for relics. Can't progress there anymore.

-HNM boss types (the stronger ones, not the ones that can be duoed-one partied 70+) still have the same spawn time and LS that dominate them.

-Sky pop NMs still have the same respawn time, etc.

So..how are they actually helping the endgame by flooding it with more players? OH I GET IT, so people can start farming the CoP dragons! HEHAheahaheahEAHea
Oh wait, their loot is ass compared to a giant turtle in Tu'Lia that you can fight without taking a hit from that takes 10 people and about 20 minutes to beat.

Lots of high level players & not enough endgame content = bad.
I know enough high level players who sit around doing NOTHING because there isn't anything to do at 75 except farm or go help low levels and despite what anyone says, when those are really your only options for high level gameplay it's not very fun. Having an aging population (levelwise, because the angry 5 year old in people will rage on forever) in an MMOPG and nothing for them to do is just really fucking stupid. Fix the content, then fix the grind. Making a change like this is really quite pointless.
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Peregrine said:
In short, high levelers have gotten their reward. They're there. They're connected. They're comfortably set.
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I want to know where my "hey you've reached 75" gil is that Peregrine thinks that I should have gotten. Maybe it's in my delivery box now and I just keep missing it.

Peregrine said:
no offense, but the high level community has caused more balance issues with the game than any other user base, and I think Square finally realizes that
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I fail to see how high levels have caused a balance issue, you make this claim and say that all high levels are uber rich, when most of them aren't.

Peregrine seems to think that the people against this are solely against it for financial reasons, when I don't really recall anyone saying that. Comparisons have been made to crafting, but no one said that they didn't want more 75's because then they'd be out of money.

One of the main reasons I don't like this change is because doing end game stuff (dynamis/gods) is already over-crowded as it is. This patch is just going to make things worse sooner. Unless SE is going to add a bunch of end game material in the same patch, they're going to find a lot of 75's quitting of boredom. The odds of them adding enough stuff to do before we're overrun with 75's is slim at best.

Stop thinking that all 75's a rich as hell elitists, because most aren't.
 
Bajaratt said:
One of the main reasons I don't like this change is because doing end game stuff (dynamis/gods) is already over-crowded as it is. This patch is just going to make things worse sooner.
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So for clarity the main reason that your against this is for purely selfish reasons?

Or not?
 
[ALL RIGHT!]

100 NA HNM/GOD Linkshells overnight...

[Hmm...]

super -_-;;

imagine the shells that do Gods on a regular basis and already sked their times around the few shells that do Gods... now add the new 50 or so more God shells...

sounds like... super fantastic fun...

bred for the skills in magic...

[ALL RIGHT!]
 
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