POL: Current Known Issues (August 29th & August 30th)

[K. Ishitar]

Only on charmed mobs. Jug pets aren't supposed to lose their TP between fights. Do more homework, wannaBST.

messing with bst yesterday

found neither charmed or jug pets lost tp after update

pre update both did

 

[Nikky]

Yes, If you wanted to be the top WARs and top MNKs, you put in alot of effort for gear and merits. Sorry, but just lvling WAR doesnt make you a good DD.

exactly thats the point. if you go through all the work or meriting and equipping a job there should be a noticable difference in the amount of damage you deal (why go through all the gil and work just do raise your dmg by a small amount?). since the update it seems that people can reach the dmg cap regardless of wether they got good gear/merits or not, which is why SE should change WS dmg on 2h weapons in general imo.

 

[Cersil]

With the new changes added recently, drks are no longer just emo kids...
we're freaking _metal_!!!

 

[Skaw]

messing with bst yesterday

found neither charmed or jug pets lost tp after update

pre update both did

If they're missing HP, they'll lose TP as they regenerate.

 

[Zyndara]

exactly thats the point. if you go through all the work or meriting and equipping a job there should be a noticable difference in the amount of damage you deal (why go through all the gil and work just do raise your dmg by a small amount?). since the update it seems that people can reach the dmg cap regardless of wether they got good gear/merits or not, which is why SE should change WS dmg on 2h weapons in general imo.

Someone should not insta-have the same damage capacity of a fully merited, well-geared job, no. But if anyone's read the SE interviews, it was clear they weren't digging on what was happening as far as the "cannon onry" trend. They made it clear that they intended to even the playing field a bit for jobs that were getting the proverbial shaft. I was in a party that involved only 1 war and no nin or /nin whatsoever in the mire and we got chain 218 with no problems, only stopping because people had to go. That was unheard of not too long ago with jobs that have been overlooked for war nin mnk for a long time now.

I hear a lot of popular cannon jobs whining about this mostly because they don't like that other jobs can now do what seemed to be singular to them. And I say screw that. I can understand wanting SE to make it more competitive and less of a blowout, yes. But as for the people who just don't like that other jobs are being given more of a competitive shot, I say, simply, tough shit.

 

[Makelith]

The job in my sig, isn't even really *my* character. I solo blm on it for fun, and i rarely even do that anymore. I used to have a good geared drk with merits, and a near meriting level War. I also didn't know i needed your permission to say my opinions about a job.

And i've easily doubled over most crappy Wars and Mnks in damage too, but i used to still sit off in the corner of my MH seeking a party or trying to make one, with nothing but "war/nin/mnk burn onry" and the like. If so many of them are so bad, why are were they so much more saught after?

Its because they are already a *GOOD* DD, and had to put in a hell of a lot less work to become a *GREAT* DD, then your drk/drg/sam.

 

[meeze]

Too bad no one thought of buffing all the other jobs, oh like 2 years when RNG was top DD...ohwait

 

[Bajaratt]

People keep saying there's a ton of cannoners bitching about the update, but I don't think I've actually seen one complain at all. Maybe it's because I stay off retarded boards like lolalla or killing ifrit; but the response has been more "OMG SAM IS AWESOME," than "they completely fucked mnk/war/nin."

The only people who would view this change as anything other than a much needed and awesome improvement are the retards who bandwagoned the cannons and can't play for shit anyways. They should be ignored anyways for the dumbasses they really are.

 

[Blancho]

People keep saying there's a ton of cannoners bitching about the update, but I don't think I've actually seen one complain at all. Maybe it's because I stay off retarded boards like lolalla or killing ifrit; but the response has been more "OMG SAM IS AWESOME," than "they completely fucked mnk/war/nin."

The only people who would view this change as anything other than a much needed and awesome improvement are the retards who bandwagoned the cannons and can't play for shit anyways. They should be ignored anyways for the dumbasses they really are.

I agree except it seems like they keep making the game easier more jobs more gear more power but nothing in the game is harder and merit mobs aren't poping any faster. Maybe they just want us to be able to beat AV on a regular basis but even then what else is there that is much of a challenge any more? Nothing Are we turning into WoW?

But ya I agree. People will whine no matter what happens though. That's just a fact.

 

[Marajade]

People keep saying there's a ton of cannoners bitching about the update, but I don't think I've actually seen one complain at all. Maybe it's because I stay off retarded boards like lolalla or killing ifrit; but the response has been more "OMG SAM IS AWESOME," than "they completely fucked mnk/war/nin."

Much needed update, but as it's been said before, it's just way too much. But the pDIF adjust will probably fix the balance issue again, keeping 2handers at a better position than they were before, but lower than they are right now.

 

[jamal]

Much needed update, but as it's been said before, it's just way too much. But the pDIF adjust will probably fix the balance issue again, keeping 2handers at a better position than they were before, but lower than they are right now.

Much agreed...there was quite a bit that needed to be done to equalize the scale; but when this was supposed to equalize and instead destroys other jobs, you know they've gone too far. A good example of this I tested last night...my PLD/WHM (Staff skill 269) geared for attack with a stave has more base attack than my WAR/NIN (284 Axe skill)...including the +30 attack from jug and +15 on e.body.
Equalizing the damaging jobs is one thing, but when the update is so intense it makes piss poor attack jobs have more base attack than a decked out damage dealer, the push definately went too far.

Edit: Like Baja stated, no ones bitching and moaning, rather pointing at the numbers that are injust. No one leveled DRG to be the top damage dealing job...When I started leveling a DD job, I looked at the top-tiered damage capabilities and began building what I thought could stand a chance to outperform a RNG (Top-tiered at the time). Sadly, I wasn't able to complete my optimal gear set until after the nerf.
Now after having been at the pinnacle basically since the RNG-nerf, this one update allows someone who has just reached 75 and has mediocre gear be able to outperform DD's that have been striving for years to get to where they are.

Too bad no one thought of buffing all the other jobs, oh like 2 years when RNG was top DD...ohwait

What's a RNG?

 

[Lavi]

Someone should not insta-have the same damage capacity of a fully merited, well-geared job, no. But if anyone's read the SE interviews, it was clear they weren't digging on what was happening as far as the "cannon onry" trend. They made it clear that they intended to even the playing field a bit for jobs that were getting the proverbial shaft. I was in a party that involved only 1 war and no nin or /nin whatsoever in the mire and we got chain 218 with no problems, only stopping because people had to go. That was unheard of not too long ago with jobs that have been overlooked for war nin mnk for a long time now.

I hear a lot of popular cannon jobs whining about this mostly because they don't like that other jobs can now do what seemed to be singular to them. And I say screw that. I can understand wanting SE to make it more competitive and less of a blowout, yes. But as for the people who just don't like that other jobs are being given more of a competitive shot, I say, simply, tough shit.

See, that's where you were right and wrong. They intended to do that, but they failed miserably in implementing that (not a surprise though). When anyone with no amount of effort placed into gear or merits can pop off 1-2k WS like nothing while a fully meritted, elite geared player can is barely breaking a constant 1k, it's not even. Not by a long shot.

 

[Zyndara]

See, that's where you were right and wrong. They intended to do that, but they failed miserably in implementing that (not a surprise though). When anyone with no amount of effort placed into gear or merits can pop off 1-2k WS like nothing while a fully meritted, elite geared player can is barely breaking a constant 1k, it's not even. Not by a long shot.

I didn't say they were even, I siad that was their intent. I also said:

Someone should not insta-have the same damage capacity of a fully merited, well-geared job, no (...) I can understand wanting SE to make it more competitive and less of a blowout, yes.

I'm not saying the update was right on. I agree it needs to be tweaked. I'm saying that there are people grumbling simply because it means cannons won't be the primary be-all-end-all focus anymore, and that it's too damned bad.

 

[Lavi]

I didn't say they were even, I siad that was their intent. I also said:



I'm not saying the update was right on. I agree it needs to be tweaked. I'm saying that there are people grumbling simply because it means cannons won't be the primary be-all-end-all focus anymore, and that it's too damned bad.

You then followed that statement with a "But..." and an argument as to why it's improved, implying that you agreed with the update. And no one really cares that cannons are the only choice or not, it's that the people who spent a lot of time improving themselves are losing out to someone who does not. Again, why should a NIN, THF, MNK or any other non-2handed job lose out simply because they have a smaller weapon?

 

[Zyndara]

You then followed that statement with a "But..." and an argument as to why it's improved, implying that you agreed with the update. And no one really cares that cannons are the only choice or not, it's that the people who spent a lot of time improving themselves are losing out to someone who does not. Again, why should a NIN, THF, MNK or any other non-2handed job lose out simply because they have a smaller weapon?

You need to go back and read what I said again. You're trying to take pieces out of context to fit your point and you're not getting it. I didn't "imply" anything; it's right there in black and white text, I'm not going to cut and paste it again. The "but" I said was in reference to the cannon only folks who were, as I said, pissed because the world suddenly didn't revolve around them. Nin, mnk and many others hardly lose out, and you're kidding yourself if you think that. Those are jobs that have dominated the player landscape for a long time. They can cope with a competitive market. Not over-dominating, but competitive. Again, no one's saying changs don't need to be made. I never said that, in fact, I said twice the opposite.

 

[K. Ishitar]

If they're missing HP, they'll lose TP as they regenerate.

this would explain a few things i guess, i tried /nin on bst for the first time in korroloka for the past 2 days fighting/tanking ep-dc mobs.

Not much damage was taken generally from my bst or my pets(charmed-used slimes, spiders, and leeches or jug-used tiger)

all of them seemed to have an auto regen rate when charmed or summoned there were times when they took large amounts of damage(sickle slash, fluid toss/spread), but still kept tp when I stayed them. But then again when I stayed them they all had high emounts of tp over 100 usually 170-220ish. Did yours have tp under 100% when you stayed them? I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just really interested in how it works.

the tp before using stay may affect whether tp is lost or not(if they take damage and it is regened), I'll look at it again though, it could easily be that i'm missing something. i posted some stuff in the stay regeneration topic as well.

pre update- my pets(both kind) lost tp as they simply roamed with me from one mob to the next and me resting.

 

[Lavi]

Someone should not insta-have the same damage capacity of a fully merited, well-geared job, no. But if anyone's read the SE interviews, it was clear they weren't digging on what was happening as far as the "cannon onry" trend. They made it clear that they intended to even the playing field a bit for jobs that were getting the proverbial shaft. I was in a party that involved only 1 war and no nin or /nin whatsoever in the mire and we got chain 218 with no problems, only stopping because people had to go. That was unheard of not too long ago with jobs that have been overlooked for war nin mnk for a long time now.

I hear a lot of popular cannon jobs whining about this mostly because they don't like that other jobs can now do what seemed to be singular to them. And I say screw that. I can understand wanting SE to make it more competitive and less of a blowout, yes. But as for the people who just don't like that other jobs are being given more of a competitive shot, I say, simply, tough shit.

I hate to do this, but I will. The bolded "but" refers to the previous italics sentence where you state no one should have comparable damage to a meritted and properly geared player and the "but" implies however or contrary to that. I don't need to go back and read it, I read it multiple times. I didn't take it out of context, you did and you wrote it. Then you go on to give an example of how this update has improved the jobs who don't get an invite thus adding to the fact that you implied agreeing with the overzealous nature of it. Perhaps you didn't mean to write it like that or that wasn't how you meant it, but I didn't interpret it wrong. It's in black and white like you said and as clear as day.

There is no coping with a 2k WS while you are doing a piddly 1k and expending an exuberant amount of time, gil and merits into the job. It went from one side to another but this is extremely beyond limits. When a ridill WAR is outparsed by a great margin, it isn't hard to realize it's thorougly broken and that one handed wielders are fucked. Jamal was right, when a job that isn't even a DD can compete in terms of attack with a dual wielder decked out in full attack just because they use a two handed weapon, something is not right. As it stands, my WHM isn't far behind in attack compared to my WAR and that's just not right.

 

[Zyndara]

I hate to do this, but I will. The bolded "but" refers to the previous italics sentence where you state no one should have comparable damage to a meritted and properly geared player and the "but" implies however or contrary to that. I don't need to go back and read it, I read it multiple times. I didn't take it out of context, you did and you wrote it. Then you go on to give an example of how this update has improved the jobs who don't get an invite thus adding to the fact that you implied agreeing with the overzealous nature of it. Perhaps you didn't mean to write it like that or that wasn't how you meant it, but I didn't interpret it wrong. It's in black and white like you said and as clear as day.

There is no coping with a 2k WS while you are doing a piddly 1k and expending an exuberant amount of time, gil and merits into the job. It went from one side to another but this is extremely beyond limits. When a ridill WAR is outparsed by a great margin, it isn't hard to realize it's thorougly roken and that one handed wielders are fucked. Jamal was right, when a job that isn't even a DD can compete in terms of attack with a dual wielder decked out in full attack just because they use a two handed weapon, something is not right. As it stands, my WHM isn't far behind in attack compared to my WAR and that's just not right.

Again, you did interpret it wrong, and the only one who seems to be having comprehension problems with what I wrote. I wrote it, and I would know. I didn't imply anything. You, as usual, are being argumentative when you're reading things how you want to read them and when it isn't necessary to be so. I'm not going to reexplain it. I was clear the first time and I'm not wasting my time breaking it down any further for you. I agreed with the fact it wasn't perfect and needed to be addressed, I said it plainly. If you can't figure it out, it's not my problem.

 

[Soujiro]

this one update allows someone who has just reached 75 and has mediocre gear be able to outperform DD's that have been striving for years to get to where they are.

This is the heart of the problem without a doubt. If they wanted to level the playing field then that's what they should have done but it isn't. You should not be able to be on par with someone, who has spent years getting the best R/E gear you can obtain and who took the time to cap merits, as a freshly dinged 75 with all AH gear just because you have a 2hander.

In this way it's also a slap in the face to those people that stuck with the 2 handed jobs. The ones that spent the time doing Sky, sitting in the Aery, getting Honam, etc now will all have to re-think their gear choices and leave alot of that stuff in their MH. With DEX = ACC now you can pretty much reach the cap naked which makes no sense to me. As someone who has both a Dual wielding and a 2handed job I can say that a boost was in order, particularly the long overdue changes to Penta. When you can now pull 1k+ single hit weaponskills easily with a 40 dmg Soboro then it doesn't take a genius to see that something isn't right.

It's getting old hearing from all the, "this is payback for not inviting me drk/sam to get the shit pounded out of me and drain the mages mp dry in 3 mobs to meripo before the update" types too. Maybe I'd be more inclined to believe that crying if I hadn't gotten a ton of merits with Phishn on sam/nin equaling or outparsing BB mnk's consistantly at Nyzule Isle Mamool Ja camp before the update or if I didn't do events with Rappa's drk or Audino's drg.

Things were far from one sided as alot of whiners would have you believe. It just required you to do the same thing the Ridillberk war or BB mnk did - collect the best gear you can get, max your merits out, and know how to play the job. The main difference I saw before the update is that those 2handers that did shine, that were on par with the "elite" war/mnk/nin didn't get the recognition for it. You'd have some tool mnk that wears Herald's Gaiters or a war that masturbates nightly to his Ridill saying, "lolsam, loldrk, loldrg, POIDH." Now they are getting the recognition only it's not because of the hard work and time they put into their characters but because SE decided to botch some math formulas in their favor.

 

[Raesvelg]

Get used to the idea of your 2-handed weapon having more Attack/Accuracy than your dual wield setup. I really doubt that's going to change at all when SE fixes the peak WS damage.

I find it ironic that the people I see complaining about this the most are WAR/NIN. (not pointing fingers at anyone, just a general observation) I realize that having a gear setup you've put a lot of time, effort, and gil into get functionally nerfed can be extremely frustrating, but considering that WAR at least has the capacity to once again slip into a primary position with Great Axe instead of Axe/Axe, it's just a trifle surprising to me. I would have expected more NINs and MNKs than WARs to be upset.