Stop buying Ulli stones, you *#%*tards

delsus said:
64 stacks of food but how many people buy them in a hour? Probally around 30-40. They sell dam fast there is more money in some foods then items they spend 3 hours waiting for pops.
yes but how many people sell food, Alot including myself sometimes. That exactly why you cant do anything about them there no other way to obtain food or crafted meds except buy them, there is however other ways to get items.
 
hellstorm said:
yes but how many people sell food, Alot including myself sometimes. That exactly why you cant do anything about them there no other way to obtain food or crafted meds except buy them, there is however other ways to get items.

Did you even read your own post? "there no other way to obtain food or crafted meds except to buy them, there is however other ways to get items."

Crafted food and meds. Hmmm. How else can I obtain those besides buying them? Oh I don't know, maybe craft them? It comes down to your unwilling to spend the time to lv/craft your own food. So you buy it from the AH and take a chance that it may or may not be from rmt. That sounds alot like what we did with our autumn stones does it not?

Let me save you the effort of your next post. Yes there is a higher % that your getting an rmt stone vs a rmt crafted food but how many stacks of food do you buy yearly? Your playing the odds alot more then we are with the stones.

This whole topic comes down to you hate how long ulli's spawn time is and that rmt have out claimed your ls's on more then one occasion and your sick of it and your way of venting has been directed towards us. I can understand where your coming from. For the last time, we're willing to take the risk that the stone we get from that bazaar is possibly rmt obtained. It's no different then when you buy off the AH that you have to except that the items your bidding on is possibly being sold by rmt.

And no that statement is not ment to be comparing AH-Bazaars. Its stating facts that your running the risk that it maybe from rmt. If you can live with that then congradulations, yours in the same boat we are in when we buy stones.
 
Zalbag said:
Did you even read your own post? "there no other way to obtain food or crafted meds except to buy them, there is however other ways to get items."

Crafted food and meds. Hmmm. How else can I obtain those besides buying them? Oh I don't know, maybe craft them? It comes down to your unwilling to spend the time to lv/craft your own food. So you buy it from the AH and take a chance that it may or may not be from rmt. That sounds alot like what we did with our autumn stones does it not?

Let me save you the effort of your next post. Yes there is a higher % that your getting an rmt stone vs a rmt crafted food but how many stacks of food do you buy yearly? Your playing the odds alot more then we are with the stones.

This whole topic comes down to you hate how long ulli's spawn time is and that rmt have out claimed your ls's on more then one occasion and your sick of it and your way of venting has been directed towards us. I can understand where your coming from. For the last time, we're willing to take the risk that the stone we get from that bazaar is possibly rmt obtained. It's no different then when you buy off the AH that you have to except that the items your bidding on is possibly being sold by rmt.

And no that statement is not ment to be comparing AH-Bazaars. Its stating facts that your running the risk that it maybe from rmt. If you can live with that then congradulations, yours in the same boat we are in when we buy stones.
wow you really full of yourself, It directed to anyone who buys stone from rmt or unknown bazaars. As for the crafting there a little thing called crafting lvl. Only lvl 1 craft per toon so it impossible to make your own food, make your own meds, make your own tools. As for playing the odds I beg to differ, considering most shells that get stone use it for themselves then there rmt that bot claim, the chance of a legit stone being sold is very very very slim. Considering your shell is obvious not the only one that buys stones the odds are increased even more. Crafting is diffent people sell the stuff that sells sushi, jack o' lanterns, glace, hedgehog pies, red curry, melon pies, kabobs that everyone not just rmt. Unlike stones where ~99% of the stones that legit player get go to there shells or themselfs to use on byrakko and never even enter the market.
 
Example... I hope your good with word problems.

BLACK SOLE the active ingredient in Sole Sushi or GIGANT SQUID the active ingredient in Squid Sushi (both fish consume ~95% of the recipe costs) has a 90% chance of being sold on AH by a RMT Fish Bot.

A. Linkshell buys 5 Autumnstones over the course of 3-4 months with a 80% chance of it coming from RMT.
The Math: 5 x 0.8 = 4 autumnstones bought from RMT for a total profit of 6M x 4 = 24M

B. Linkshell composed of 30 active Melees collectively buys 500 stacks (4-5 stacks per person per month) of Sole/Squid Sushi in the same time period with 90% of the food being created with RMT created ingredients.
The Math: 500 x 0.9 = 450 stacks and 450 x 30k = 13.5M

So guess what, both linkshells fund RMT! In B, maybe RMT's dont create the food directly but they are responsible for the ingredients. And in A, the same way that RMT don't create Byakko's Haidate or Kirin's Osode, their just responsible for the ingredients.

Every LS funds RMT in some way or another, claiming ignorance is not an excuse and is only a way to convince yourself that your not as bad as the LS that buys Autumnstones or any other expensive RMT dominated item thats sold directly in bazaars.
 
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decidence said:
Example... I hope your good with word problems.

BLACK SOLE the active ingredient in Sole Sushi or GIGANT SQUID the active ingredient in Squid Sushi (both fish consume ~95% of the recipe costs) has a 90% chance of being sold on AH by a RMT Fish Bot.

A. Linkshell buys 5 Autumnstones over the course of 3-4 months with a 80% chance of it coming from RMT.
The Math: 5 x 0.8 = 4 autumnstones bought from RMT for a total profit of 6M x 4 = 24M

B. Linkshell composed of 30 active Melees collectively buys 500 stacks (4-5 stacks per person per month) of Sole/Squid Sushi in the same time period with 90% of the food being created with RMT created ingredients.
The Math: 500 x 0.9 = 450 stacks and 450 x 30k = 13.5M

So guess what, both linkshells fund RMT! In B, maybe RMT's dont create the food directly but they are responsible for the ingredients. And in A, the same way that RMT don't create Byakko's Haidate or Kirin's Osode, their just responsible for the ingredients.

Every LS funds RMT in some way or another, claiming ignorance is not an excuse and is only a way to convince yourself that your not as bad as the LS that buys Autumnstones or any other expensive RMT dominated item thats sold directly in bazaars.

black sole- seem pretty legit to me.
http://ffxiah.com/item.php?id=4384&sid=16

giant squid- ok that 1 seem slightly odd
http://ffxiah.com/item.php?id=4474&sid=16&stack=0

either way you look at it someone that buy the food is not giving rmt a profit. Just like someone who resell a o kote. so your math a bit off.
 
hellstorm said:
either way you look at it someone that buy the food is not giving rmt a profit. Just like someone who resell a o kote. so your math a bit off.
You cannot seriously be this stupid. In BOTH(food and Ulli stone) cases people are buying items from RMT, BOTH are being destroyed and something else is created(into food or gear from byakko), in BOTH you're supporting the RMT. They get less money by selling things cheaper, that's fucking obvious, but it's still supporting the RMT. They work on volume, however, since everyone needs food and other consumables, so while they might not make 1 mil per sale, they'll make over a mil a day in volume.

Unless you only buy from people who farm up all of their own ingredients(hint: that's no one) then you have a very, very high chance of buying something from RMT.
 
decidence said:
A. Linkshell buys 5 Autumnstones over the course of 3-4 months with a 80% chance of it coming from RMT.
The Math: 5 x 0.8 = 4 autumnstones bought from RMT for a total profit of 6M x 4 = 24M

B. Linkshell composed of 30 active Melees collectively buys 500 stacks (4-5 stacks per person per month) of Sole/Squid Sushi in the same time period with 90% of the food being created with RMT created ingredients.
The Math: 500 x 0.9 = 450 stacks and 450 x 30k = 13.5M

so... you're saying a linkshell that buys stones..... contributes 37 mil as compared to 13.5...

Simply said, there are a decent number of legit fisherman and a large number of legit cooks out there making some of that profit, don't exclude important factors so readily.. realistically i will conceed that about 80% of that 13.5 RMT strait profit, so, that's down to more like... 10.8? over that span of time, i don't think 800k in fishing gear lost is an unreasonable estimate for all rmt fishing bots out there, i'll go ahead and factor that in as 10m flat.
so a ls that buys stones supports 2.4 chinese families for every one another linkshell does?

My shell doesn't do sky, i don't really care about the topic in general, just had to adjust the sums.

most of the economy, on the supply end is RMT doing dirty work, when you buy anything worth buying, 99% of the time you support RMT, your argument is invalid... i mean, you basically said more than doubling their income isn't any worse... so, if a linkshell starts a contract with a rmt company to start farming all their pop items, claims nm's for them, it's no worse than the guy who just bought food off the ah? lolreally?
 
Bajaratt said:
Unless you only buy from people who farm up all of their own ingredients(hint: that's no one) then you have a very, very high chance of buying something from RMT.

I'm a level 97+2 cook and a level 72+5 fisherman on PS2.

I fish up and cook all my tacos and sushi. 100% RMT and Bot free.

If anyone wants to sleep at night knowing they didn't help the trash on this server ruin this game one gil at a time, shoot me a tell and I'll hook you up.

P.S. There's plenty of us out there.
 
93 pages and still on topic...amazing.
 
Why did this argument all of a sudden get to be about "Who support RMT more?" ... who the hell cares, your all supporting them regardless of how much.

Haha you support RMT 2.4x more then I do, I'm better then you, whatever I say sticks to you Im rubber your glue!

Give me a fucking break, stop trying to justify yourself.
 
decidence said:
Why did this argument all of a sudden get to be about "Who support RMT more?" ... who the hell cares, your all supporting them regardless of how much.

Haha you support RMT 2.4x more then I do, I'm better then you, whatever I say sticks to you Im rubber your glue!

Give me a fucking break, stop trying to justify yourself.
Well, we all support RMT, it cant be avoided. Lets all go buy Gil because it doesnt matter anymore, right? And while we're at it, lets invite them into our LS's and help them camp NMs.

Right?

Go Earn your Hidate, chumps.
 
Watching people do statistic in this thread makes me lol in real life.

Kinda makes you realize how much the school systems failed.
 
Firestreak said:
I think they're all Canadians. That explains it.
We have the higher Literacy rating and Lower high school dropout rate. Duno what this has to do with anything.
 
Firestreak said:
I think they're all from Canadia. That explains it.
damn right, those canadians :(

if it wasn't for beer and hockey...
 
ok well... yall have fun with this whole FFXI thing... im gonna go make love to my new PS3... and laugh at how theres no RMTs in Fall of Man...

heres the simple solution...

(im not about to kiss kaizen's ass on the issue, but im simply stating where i stand)

the fact is, Kaizen gets shit done... if they wanna buy ulli stones, thats totally their business and anyone who isnt a member, or otherwise has no say over the innerworkings of the shell should get the fuck over it... just because your unable to realize that this game is starting to mimic the rl economy isnt anyone's fault but your own. seriously, buying stones from RMTs is simply exersizing ones rights to free enterprize. consider RMTs camping ulli a service, then you pay gil not neccesarily for the stone, but for the time you dont hafta spend waiting for pop for just a CHANCE to claim. so essencially, your paying the rmts for the service they provide for the ffxi community... yes, i said they provide a service.

instead of sitting on your asses bitching about RMTs 24/7 just to be in the same, or a worse situation than when you started is utterly pointless. how about instead of your LS spending 12 hours camping ulli, you focus on other HNMs or pop NMs so that your LS Bank can afford to buy the stones. this not onry guaruntee's your shell a Byakko, and eventually kirin, but it adds the long lost element of fun to ffxi. i for one would much rather kill a buncha Uggl Pendant dudes, and sell the drops to buy a stone than sit in a room for hours on end only to get beaten by rmts, or just another shell. your not gonna banish RMTs no matter how long you hold your breath, so why not take this negative, and turn it into a positive?

my guess is that the members of Kaizen enjoy the game alot more than most because they realize that they have the skill and cash-flow to run rampant killing everything their lil hearts desire... more power too them. this is a game, its about fun.

so yea... let the "ZOMG SYL'S A SCAMMER" flames begin

btw...

lolMedicineman said:
Oh and note- LARGE said that Celvantes, Ajs, and syliph bought gil ^^ quick everyone flame them!

lol you pathetic petty son of a bitch!...

ok QCDN...im sure a few of you at one point saw me camping with rmt's in sky...Bajaratt recently brought it to my attention again, and i realize that i had failed to clarify due to my respect for BDS...(which is about as exhistant as a black man at the GOP)

let me refresh your memory of a conversation you and i had lolMM....
i very much recall bringing up the potential to have a LS member sabotage RMT sky efforts by having someone infultrate their ranks, gain their trust, and steal their drops. i also remember you offering to pay me outta the LS bank for each stone/gem i could provide(btw i believe you owe about 14 mil). so im curious anout something Medicineman...

Why are you lying to the public in order to keep your 1337 LS looking all super and legit?

Why are you throwing around false accusations of Me, Celv, and Ajs buying gil?

Why did you lie to me and tell me that you had discussed our deal with the other leaders? but instead went behind their backs and when you were busted, simply left me out to dry? (not very good leadership skeels)

Why are you still breathing?

Why is Bush still breathing?

Where do babies come from?

OH YEAH! And why do you use the LS bank to fund your own personal endeavors?


I was willing to put my reputation, alough not very clean, on the line to help a LS that i was proud to be a part of.... effectively ruining my chances of aquiring any endgame LS... all for you and BDS... and you are the son of a bitch who fucking sold me out and ruined my slowly returning good standing on this server...

on a side note, my lil escapade with the rmts was kinda fun... i was like a secret agent or something... i definatly reccomend it just for the sheer lawlz of it^^

so yeah....

Quite frankly my dear Medicineman, you are the jock-strap of the server in my opinion... please go give a 9mm a blowjob...

good night^^
 
Firestreak said:
You have to factor in that we're averaged in with the Southern states.
Alberta is alot like the southern states, lol.
 
Firestreak said:
C) When I say that I have evidence, I have evidence. Was Arcien, not Jolin though and I've already posted it.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y237/Rednibia2/fafnirbs1.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y237/Rednibia2/fafnirbs2.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y237/Rednibia2/fafnirbs3.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y237/Rednibia2/fafnirbs4.jpg

Which it isn't my point that he's obviously guilty. Certainly seems that way to me, but my point is that the same group of people who declare that because of an MSN conversation with a person nicknamed Chrono we can conclude that Chronicles is a botter - will turn around and say those screenshots somehow don't prove anything.

And it isn't my point that I'm pissed off that in the process I got MPKed as well, cause I'm over that. The point is only that it's something declared 'wrong.'

Sorry if you as well misinterprete posting these as another attack. Rather, it's you calling me a liar and me showing that I'm not.


These screenshots... they're hardly any evidence. Fygla blaming a Kaizen member for getting MPKed means absolute shit. It's exactly what I would have expected JDA to do at that time. In fact, and I'm sure that I've pointed this out in the other thread orginally concerning this matter, but I really felt they probably MPKed themselves to blame us for it, though who knows... maybe it was yet another LS!!!!

As courtney pointed out, several people had access to that character. No, not several Kaizen people. Now, I didn't know Halflife at all, nor was I aware that anyone in our LS had access to that account. What I did know was that that several people did in fact have access to that character. From what I knew at that time, that even included people who were currently in JDA.

now for a history lesson...

I don't really care to go back and read all the pointless drivel throughout this thread, but someone had mentioned being one of the first groups to go up against the "evil JP." If by "evil JP", you mean linkshells such as JDA or HNMPT or Genesis Union, then I should point out that Kaizen was pretty much founded by NA players who were sick and tired of being treated unfairly in such LSs (players such as Nasya). As the first NA HNM LS on our server, our goal was to recruit skilled players approaching level 75 who wanted a chance at the gear and the gil that could only be earned through camping HNMs, without having to put up with the discrimination and favoritism present in the predominantly JP endgame LSs of that time. Nasya wanted us all to have the same chance as all the other LSs without having to be treated differently for not knowing Japanese. If you were around about 2 and a half to 3 years ago, you'll know that this was a big issue for NA players seeking endgame shells at that time.

Not all JP LSs were "evil." When Kaizen came around and first started camping HNMs, some Japanese LSs literally welcomed us to camps and went out of their way to tell us that they were happy to finally see an English-speaking LS at an HNM camp, and that they welcomed the competition. From this point on, we had expected only healthy competition. But It still took us months to even attempt camping fafnir.

The three biggest JP LSs back at that time considered each other allies. They would rotate camps, between Nidhogg, Aspidochelone, and King Behemoth. They would also borrow members as needed for each camp. I only recall one other LS, also JP, that countered this triple-LS alliance at all. The week we first tried to camp Fafnir, there really wasn't much competition for it. Countering the "evil JP" that first time around did not last long though. At that time we only really perceived one JP LS to be assholes, and it wasn't the JDA alliance. After a few camps that week, we were asked to join the JP alliance, as allies instead of countercamping them. For a short while we did just that, because it was how the King HNMs were treated back then. We camped Fafnir alongside JDA, and fought with them for weeks. Yes... I'm ashamed to admit this now. But as I said, it seemed like the right thing to do at that time, being that the only shells present at those camps during most of the week, were the ones who were a part of this alliance. After a while we also noticed that a new NA LS (OH), was now also starting to camp Fafnir.

After a few weeks of this arrangement, we felt really weren't being treated by the alliance as they had agreed at all. They would also constantly change the rules for us to conitnue as a part of that alliance as they saw fit. Anyway, we came to the conclusion (or at least I did!) that JDA, or at least their officers were racist pigs and also had no sense of fairness that did not solely benefit them. So the alliance between us was broken and we set out to do stuff on our own. We had to endure plenty of taunting and harassment on the part of JDA towards us; the usual "NA TOO WEAK!" nonsense of that time. JDA said we'd not be able to kill Fafnir on our own. For a short while we did not come back to Fafnir though, instead we we tried for Tiamat, which only JDA had killed. It was a quite a task and took us several tries back then, we really did not have the manpower or tools available to JDA, or LS on other servers. Kisada pretty much came up with a new strategy for killing it which made it much easier for us to do so with what we had. As opposed having everyone crowd around Tiamat as if it were Fafnir, PLD tank it with Aerial Armor, and rely on Chainspell Stun and two hours to kill it, which is what all LSs across all servers did at that time. Once we were comfortable with this strategy we pretty much monopolized Tiamat, since we could kill it before JDA ever even got wind of it being up, and we returned to Dragon's Aery and showed them we were perfectly capable of fighting wyrms on our own, despite their taunting. I personally feel that this is the source of bitterness that people such as Fygla had for us, and they made it clear.

Back at Dragon's Aery, the other JP shell camping fafnir was Genesis Union, who were also notorious MPKers. sometime after we had just returned to DA, JDA got MPKed by GU on nidhogg. All LSs present were completely wiped, except for us because we still had not dropped into the pit. Needless to say, we killed Nidhogg, to the discontent of all the other LSs involved. JDA MPKed us several times when we had Nidhogg. Back then there was no "/blockaid", mobs bound nearby attacked whomever was closest regardless of them not being in the party that held it claimed, and mobs did not despawn when aggro was lost. JDA took advantage of all of these things several times. They would bind spiders and the Malboro mob on us during Nidhogg fights. They would train spiders from both ends of pit and let them aggro us on the way back, they would cure us the entire fight and invincible towards the end and try to kite Nidhogg to cause spike flail. They did whatever shit they could and played as dirty as possible. Eventually we learned to deal with it better, and we managed to kill the HNM while having to deal with whatever shit they dealt us.

Sometime after all of these things is when the whole Halflife thing happened. Now I know I fail at keeping my stories concise, but my point to all of the above is that this explains why Fygla's word means shit. I don't know that other members of my LS feel the same. But I feel that JDA hated us because their leaders were racist asses, and we were the first NA LS to give them a run for their money. JDA would naturally blame us first because they hated the competition we gave them and because they were dishonest foul-playing bags of scum.






As for Prophecy reporting us, saying "only kaizen survived!" as if that was in anyway incriminating, I have a much shorter comment to make on that:

From what I remember Prophecy was a dumbass. So, forgive me if you worshipped him or anything, but that's my perception of him. Surviving an MPK when you're not the one being MPKed isn't that difficult really... I mean... if you know anything about spike flail.. you'd know that.. well.. it hurts! So we got the fuck out when we saw Fafnir going crazy, it doesn't really take much brains to run the hell away or escape, sorry if prophecy didn't think of that though. At this time Fafnir's spike flail still hit outside of alliance, though that has been adjusted since then (note: Nidhogg's spike flail still hits anyone in area as it was never changed!).

Either way, we had no reason to MPK JDA over Fafnir. I would think that if any of my LS mates had chosen this course, that they would have more sense than going through the trouble of MPKing JDA over a stupid fafnir. JDA never MPKed us over Fafnir, they only MPKed us over Nidhoggs. MPKing for Fafnir would have been really dumb since it wouldn't have made us at all even or avenged.







The last thing I'd like to point out regarding those screenshots is that the GM says he knows all of Halflife's characters, which means absolutely shit. To me all it means is that the GM is knows all of the characters in the same account as Halflife's, and Arcien is obviously a seperate account. It's not even a suitable response to prophecy's accusation.

Either way, Fygla's and Prophecy's words are meaningless. What I think you're trying to say though, is that the GM is validating Prophecy, who said, "halflife=arcien." That isn't logical though. There's no way you can honestly say that that's proof, not only because it doesn't make much sense as a response to what prophecy said, but because it came quite a while after. You can see therere's plenty of lines of text between those two lines exchanged between Prophecy and the GM. In fact, there's even more lines you don't even see.

Look at the screenshots of the GM conversation and notice how the last lines of the first screenie, and the first lines of the second don't seem to follow. You can clearly see that there's something missing from the chatlog, because the actions you see don't match. There's obviously stuff in between. Otherwise just look at the slider on the scrollbar of the chat log. Notice how you can put the scroll bars side by side from each of the two screenshots, and they don't follow either, in the way that the second and third screenshots do. There's a block missing between the two screenshots. This also means that there's a gap of text missing from the chatlog. It looks like a full page of text that has been neglected. I wonder if that was done on purpose in order to deceive gullible readers. As I said though, I don't even see how that's relevant because to me it's the GM's line isn't a response to prophecy's accusation anyway.





Either way, I don't know why I bother wasting my time reading, or even worse, writing this long-ass reply. I can't say I have a positive image of active posters of such forums. The reason being, I know there's no sense that can be talked into such people and anything and everything that is said, will always be mangled and turned around to further fuel such flames. It's kind of sad that now even I find myself giving you the time of the day. I mean... why bother arguing with people whose opinions are inconsequential anyhow?

Even if opinions of posters like you mattered, If one doesn't post a reply to accusations made against him, you can just say a response wasn't made because the accused is obviously so guilty he can't talk his way out of it. If that person does make a response you'll just say he immediately lashed out to say something because it "hit a nerve," as any competent troll would do.

I seriously doubt that people actually believe half the dumb shit they post themselves. Maybe I'm being naive for believing that no one can possibly be such an idiot, but I really think people just make things up as they go along because they have way too much free time; that reading and making up such ramble and provoking such squabble is all they have to entertain them.



Either way, to my fellow LS members: forgive me for speaking so freely on an open forum where words are more than just likely to be twisted by numbskulls. I'll try to refrain from doing so in the future. I do hope readers will note I have pointed out that these are my feelings alone and I speak for noone else.
 
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