Str <=> Atk

ds083roadkill said:
i've switched to 2 flame rings a while back to tp in because with full GK merit + DM earring, 25 acc with sushi or meat netted me between 88-95% acc. i figured 2 acc rings would gain you only 10 acc, equivilent to life belt, where 2 flame would get you 10 str, not equivilent to warwolf

still open for suggestions thou
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swift belt 4tw (speed if you're rich and want to make nins mad)
I use rajas and woodsman with meat food
 
For my SAM, i use Store TP/Acc gear for TPing, and use STR with alittle bit of attack and accuracy, being the n00b that I am, with food, I have +50 STR and +7 accuracy, and can normally so really decent dmg.

For my DRG, I use Acc/Att gear, usually ranging from 30ish acc and 60ish attack. For my WS, I macro in STR and DEX, with little bits of Acc in it. I'm still trying to build my DEX side up, but I have +42 STR w/o food on DRG, which I'll probably start sacrificing for DEX here and there.
 
don't sacrifice str for dex if you're not a thief
 
Reality said:
don't sacrifice str for dex if you're not a thief
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I've actually heard a lot of nins go for dex rather than str for merits, since katana has a low dmg rating, and you won't benefit from str at all. Since jin has the same mod for str and dex, you're better off putting it into dex, because you get more criticals--is the reasoning, I believe. I think +10dex = +3% critical was how it went.
 
metachronism said:
I think +10dex = +3% critical was how it went.
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I dont think that is correct at all. I know i have 70ish DEX on my DRK and I in no way shape or form get 21% crit rate. Let alone from the merits. I think I sit at around 10-12% crit rate.
 
For my MNK, for TP gear, I use this list of equipment:

Head- Turban
Neck- Chivalrous Chain
Body- Shura Togi
Hands- Bandomusha Kote
Waist- Brown Belt
Back- Forager's Mantle
Left Earring- Brutal Earring
Right Earring- Merman's Earring
Left Ring- Rajas Ring
Right Ring- Flame Ring
Legs- Byakko's Haidate
Feet- Dune Boots
Ammo- Tiphia Sting

I have been 75 MNK for 1 year 9 months so I do all the testing, extensively, and in my opinion, for the best damage while gaining tp, I like to add more attack. As you can see from my gear, I mix it up with haste, attack, and str. It is a very good balance, in my opinion. Weaponskill gear, however, is much different. The changes for WS gear are as follows:

Head- Shura Zunari Kabuto (if using sushi, this is Genbu's Kabuto)
Neck- Soil Gorget
Right Earring- Triumph Earring
Hands- Alky Bracelets
Body- Kirin's Osode
Legs- Shura Haidate
Feet- Rasetsu Sun-Ate +1

Feel free to mess around with it, but for MNK the best is a nice mix of haste, attack, and STR with a main focus around attack (hence my choice to use shura togi instead of Kirin's Osode for TP gain.) Again, test all options out yourself, but for me this setup works the best.

~Legolias
 
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etchdog2000 said:
I dont think that is correct at all. I know i have 70ish DEX on my DRK and I in no way shape or form get 21% crit rate. Let alone from the merits. I think I sit at around 10-12% crit rate.
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That's because the *total* critical rate is determined by the difference between your dex and the mob agi. The 3% is from the differential. That is, if you had 10 less dex, you should do 3% less criticals.

It's also said that criticals cap at 30%
 
metachronism said:
That's because the *total* critical rate is determined by the difference between your dex and the mob agi. The 3% is from the differential. That is, if you had 10 less dex, you should do 3% less criticals.

It's also said that criticals cap at 30%
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I get ya. I misunderstood what you were saying.
 
metachronism said:
That's because the *total* critical rate is determined by the difference between your dex and the mob agi. The 3% is from the differential. That is, if you had 10 less dex, you should do 3% less criticals.

It's also said that criticals cap at 30%
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Etch, do you mind parsing yourself with 10 less dex against the same mobs? I'd like to see this in numbers.
 
Kire said:
for 5% haste lol
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For the +15 DEX... Nothing in that slot compares closely to that amount of +stats. Shura Haidates and Warrior's Cuisses give +5 STR (+1 give 1 more STR) or Melee/Bahumut's Hose give +kick attack which are good choices, but only Shura is for SAM. So either Shura or Byakko's Haidate for WS.
 
Lavi said:
For the +15 DEX... Nothing in that slot compares closely to that amount of +stats. Shura Haidates and Warrior's Cuisses give +5 STR (+1 give 1 more STR) or Melee/Bahumut's Hose give +kick attack which are good choices, but only Shura is for SAM. So either Shura or Byakko's Haidate for WS.
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nobody wears haidate for the +15 dex, lavi

it's for the 5% haste first and foremost.
 
Reality said:
nobody wears haidate for the +15 dex, lavi

it's for the 5% haste first and foremost.
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I would argue otherwise. For nins, if you just wanted to attack fast, Koga Hakama is actually faster because it reduces delay by 5% (and delay reduction is calculated before the haste calculation--I make the assumption that anyone who is crazy about attack speed already has suppanomimi). I do have some logs of a ninja friend who recently got a byakko haidate, and had a significant increase in criticals (however, other equipment changed as well, so I don't have control variables).

To address dedalius' question, I would suggest you go out meriting with a ninja buddy who has a byakko haidate. The +10dex = +3% critical is the conclusion log parsing folks at 2ch.net came to, not from my personal parsing.
 
Reality said:
don't sacrifice str for dex if you're not a thief
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Actually, for a DRG, penta thrust is both 25% STR and DEX based, so being balanced in both may be a very good thing for it's damage.
 
metachronism said:
I would argue otherwise. For nins, if you just wanted to attack fast, Koga Hakama is actually faster because it reduces delay by 5% (and delay reduction is calculated before the haste calculation--I make the assumption that anyone who is crazy about attack speed already has suppanomimi). I do have some logs of a ninja friend who recently got a byakko haidate, and had a significant increase in criticals (however, other equipment changed as well, so I don't have control variables).

To address dedalius' question, I would suggest you go out meriting with a ninja buddy who has a byakko haidate. The +10dex = +3% critical is the conclusion log parsing folks at 2ch.net came to, not from my personal parsing.
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ask anyone, they're wearing haidate for the haste first, dex second

some people might wear it for the dex, but the majority of people aren't. koga hakama is a dual-wield increase, which decreases TP gain, i'd wager most NIN's prefer haidate for attack speed + lower recast, than hakama's attack speed + TP reduction
 
Kypdurrondragoon said:
Actually, for a DRG, penta thrust is both 25% STR and DEX based, so being balanced in both may be a very good thing for it's damage.
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secondary modifiers are just that, secondary. they're calculations done after the first damage calculation which is mainly player STR vs mob VIT, in which case STR will be factored *twice* in damage, thus making STR more important (for non THF's) than DEX

Mercy Stroke however, has something like 70 or 75% bonus on STR, which makes that particular weaponskill heavily favored towards STR on the 'secondary' modifier portion, so in certain situations THF's would focus on STR there as well
 
Reality said:
ask anyone, they're wearing haidate for the haste first, dex second

some people might wear it for the dex, but the majority of people aren't. koga hakama is a dual-wield increase, which decreases TP gain, i'd wager most NIN's prefer haidate for attack speed + lower recast, than hakama's attack speed + TP reduction
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I didn't say whether people understood why byakko was better... :( For all I know, they might be wearing it for the same reasons they wear kirin... except kirin actually isn't all that impressive when you parse the damage (must be that "zomg it's a god drop so it has to be good" mentality).

I don't think there's any significant change in TP, since you'll be in the < 180 delay zone anyway. And when you compare damage output between koga with byakko, byakko wins hands down, because of the dex (contributing to both +critical, +acc and the big dmg boost on jin (~+5%, +7.5, +4.5DMG, respectively). Otherwise, there would be almost no noticeable difference.
 
I was under the impression that haidates gave so much +DEX that the critical hit increase is very noticeable?
 
with capped crit merits, i didn't notice any increase when I changed to byakko's haidate when i hit 75 war, though I don't use a parsing program anymore so if there was an increase it was very small

when you've got like 69+45 dex on VT mobs, i am of the opinion that you're already reaching the point of diminishing returns on critical hit rate that any amount of dex-whoring you do won't really show any difference (that's the conclusion i've come to from about 8-9 months of meriting with haidate), but like i said this is just from eye-balling it
 
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