Treasure Coffers, Priorities...

[Sneakypants]

well.. that depends what you are popping the coffer for...

In this context, no, it does not.


I mentioned that it isn't my concern what people are doing in an area unless it's brought to my attention. Maybe some see it differently, but I think that's warped. I could give a crap what people are doing in a zone. At the same time, I can be extremely helpful if called upon.


So that's what I mean when I say "in this context". Disagreements outside of the context aren't without point, but they are outside of the context, making them unimportant to the thread.

 

[yanzi]

imo, i think the JPs were whiny bitches. Too bad they didnt get the coffer, they can try again. First comes first serve.

right.. and we have people who camp something and bitch about being CC when the CC takes the claim. better luck next pop right?

 

[Bajaratt]

imo, i think the JPs were whiny bitches. Too bad they didnt get the coffer, they can try again. First comes first serve.

right.. and we have people who camp something and bitch about being CC when the CC takes the claim. better luck next pop right?

Most of the people don't bitch about the CC or someone else getting the claim.

 

[yanzi]

imo, i think the JPs were whiny bitches. Too bad they didnt get the coffer, they can try again. First comes first serve.

right.. and we have people who camp something and bitch about being CC when the CC takes the claim. better luck next pop right?

Most of the people don't bitch about the CC or someone else getting the claim.

http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=14221

apparently if you kill placeholders, the NM is yours.

also.
http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=12766

but no.. that never happens right?

 

[Davio]

imo, i think the JPs were whiny bitches. Too bad they didnt get the coffer, they can try again. First comes first serve.

right.. and we have people who camp something and bitch about being CC when the CC takes the claim. better luck next pop right?

Most of the people don't bitch about the CC or someone else getting the claim.

http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=14221

apparently if you kill placeholders, the NM is yours.

also.
http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=12766

but no.. that never happens right?

Sucks for the JP, they lost the coffer fucking off to Leeches, better luck next time, thats all i have to say.

 

[Bajaratt]

I believe if you look very carefully, you'll see a cleverly hidden MOST in my post. And neither one of those threads were bitching about the CC. the BoL was complaining about an exp party vs camping Ulli. The GBY was about GBY stealing an nm they wiped on. CCing wasn't involved in either of them, nor was there whining about it.

 

[yanzi]

I believe if you look very carefully, you'll see a cleverly hidden MOST in my post. And neither one of those threads were bitching about the CC. the BoL was complaining about an exp party vs camping Ulli. The GBY was about GBY stealing an nm they wiped on. CCing wasn't involved in either of them, nor was there whining about it.

in the GBY thread they bitched about how they killed placeholders so r.ESP shouldn't have even attempted charby.
in the BoL thread (and any other BoL literature) apparently if they hang around Ulli for hours at a time, it belongs to them and them alone.

 

[Bajaratt]

I believe if you look very carefully, you'll see a cleverly hidden MOST in my post. And neither one of those threads were bitching about the CC. the BoL was complaining about an exp party vs camping Ulli. The GBY was about GBY stealing an nm they wiped on. CCing wasn't involved in either of them, nor was there whining about it.

in the GBY thread they bitched about how they killed placeholders so r.ESP shouldn't have even attempted charby.
in the BoL thread (and any other BoL literature) apparently if they hang around Ulli for hours at a time, it belongs to them and them alone.

In the GBY thread the guy was just checking if it was up, and was expecting to get a ToD. They were wiping, so he called people to help him. The thread was about how they stole the nm, which after they all died became completely fair game to anyone who wandered by.
The BoL one it was a party wanting exp, and poor communication between the groups and inside the groups. Still nothing about CC, it was about BoL mpking that exp party after they pulled ulli.

Perhaps I should have said it differently. No GOOD people whine about CC's, if there's stealing, MPKing or other stuff involved, that's different, but only wimps whine about CC.

 

[Sneakypants]

I'd like to add that I have never been asked what my intentions were regarding coffers before.

If this would be common etiquette in FFXI, why does no one bother to "fall in line" with it?


It's pretty doubtful that they'd let me have the coffer or ask me what I wanted with it. I wouldn't take it personally. Neither should they. And neither should you.


What I have been trying to gauge, is how long is appropriate to give someone a chance to pop a coffer they are next to?

 

[Panda]

sneaky as far as im concerned if you see a coffer and its not popped than you should just do it - there should be no time.

 

[Lavi]

Just did all my thf AF (yay me! ) and it wasn't easy. 3 coffers (4 including another coffer for whm gloves). I got several mimics. You all think they are stupid for waiting, but maybe they waited for a reason. Lets say they killed all the leeches to avoid agro. Then you all suggest the thf should have popped the coffer while his high level friend killed the leeches. You're right, they could have easily opened the coffer and the thf could have gone back to helping his friend IF (don't forget that pesky "if", its ALWAYS there) they got lucky. What if a mimic popped? Maybe they thought of this and to avoid them both dieing, they would kill the leeches and that way if a mimic did pop they could devote their full attention to killing it, cuz lets face it mimics are not easy to kill. But you didn't think about that. You didn't think about anything but your own pocket.

You come here asking for others opinions then insult them when you do. Why post here for people to respond (remember its still posted in General Discussion) if you plan on being stubborn in your point and ignoring any discussion to the reverse view? You are only looking for justification that you did the right thing. You even use their insults to justify your own feelings for stealing. Thats like a thief stealing a purse, getting sprayed with mace and uses that to justify his stealing. It was a seperate event and should have no bearing on whether what you did was right or not.

So next time I see you dieing, I should wait until you ask for help? If you don't and die, its not my probelm I guess. After you die, I should warp out too. That way when you ask for a raise, I can say I already warped and you asked too late. You'd probably flame me afterwords, but hey, I had no obligation to help you. All you needed to do was /sea yet you didn't. It was probably very obvious they were after the coffer and you didn't care. You said you would have maybe left the coffer if you had known he was a 50 thf, but I think you knew he was a thf well before. When I look at a 50 thf's gear its almost too easy to tell he is a thf. You just didn't want to know for sure.

Not saying what you did was entirely wrong, but you could have been nicer. Yah, you are there to farm for gil and a coffer is easy money, but they were there expressly for a coffer.

 

[Sneakypants]

OK Lavi, no doubt there are some points (that have already been made) in all of that, but no, I didn't know he was a THF before hand.

I saw people beating up leeches. I saw a coffer. I saw that everyone was doing ok. I waited. I popped it. That's more than many would give before steamrolling a coffer out of greed. I just took it because it was as much mine as anyone else's.

The issue about them being in danger...They weren't. The leeches were cake (all the more reason the THF in need should have taken care of business). If a mimic popped, PD and warp out. Shit happens in these events. The helpers wouldn't disown the guy for making an escape.

And how do I know he didn't have a legitimate Castle Oztroja Coffer Key. If that was the case, they wouldn't get a mimic.



There are a lot of assumptions from the people trying to build cases against me and say that I am bad, wrong or immoral.
What you people need to understand is that I was not in the wrong or immoral in my actions.

I only asked how long is appropriate to give someone a chance to pop a coffer they are next to? Panda answered in a way I tend to agree with. And in this particular scenario, I even waited to see if they would pop it and to see if they were doing ok.

So, do your best to answer to the question I have asked repeatedly. If you answer differently than Panda, then tell me why. Don't just B&M emotionally and without facts. The assumptions and speculation have led this thread stray.

If you just think I'm wrong, well I already told you I'm not. That's fact.
If it wasn't, SE would have programmed this differently so as not to allow me to pop that coffer, or a GM would have thrown me in jail or something. I'm guessing a GM wasn't called because the people that wanted their cake and to eat it too, knew deep down just how petty they were being. They just wanted to complain.

 

[Kiere]

I don't have a problem with what you did seeing as you didn't know at the time that they were there for an AF coffer. NO...I don't think it's your responsibility to find out. I had a similar thing happen to me in Monastic cavern when looking for my BLM AF coffer there. The thief got to the coffer before me. I congratulated him and /clapped for him on getting the coffer. I then let him know that I was there to get my coffer for AF. He said OK. Then proceeds to open the next coffer that popped. THAT was bullshit in that he knew I was trying to get my AF and left me with the impression that I could pop the next one.

 

[Firestreak]

I think the major point to be made is, regardless of who was there, and need versus greed, is simply that they were clearing leeches for a safe open. I think to an extent the coffer was rightfully theirs because they were clearing the mobs around it so opening it wouldn't require death or warping out.

On the other hand the NA and JP argument is bullshit. Not all NA are responsibile for what Sneakypants does, just as I don't hate on all JPs for what those guys said. Considering what they said about what I am and am proud to be, I don't feel to sorry about them. But if I was clearing mobs around a coffer and someone ran in and nabbed it yes I'd be angry and I feel justified.

 

[Palum_Q]

Unfortunately, I think coffers are open game for everyone. Mainly because they have specific spawn points and show up every 30 minutes. That's better than a notorious monster. As much as I'd be pissed if I was searching for the coffer and got caught up in a battle when I found it and someone took it, I guess it is fair. I'd still be ticked though..lol. The only coffer I'd probably be super ticked about would be the Garliage Citadel one and the Eldieme Necropolis because those take forever to get to since you need more than one person. However, it's only 30 minutes of my time I've wasted... (Notorious monsters..now that's a pain in the butt)

Shameless plug...anyone want to help me with the Eldieme key?

And.. totally not on topic... Kiere, you're UN-retired?????

 

[yanzi]

There are a lot of assumptions from the people trying to build cases against me and say that I am bad, wrong or immoral.
What you people need to understand is that I was not in the wrong or immoral in my actions.

and you didn't make an assumption that they didn't want the coffer? lol.

If you just think I'm wrong, well I already told you I'm not. That's fact.
If it wasn't, SE would have programmed this differently so as not to allow me to pop that coffer, or a GM would have thrown me in jail or something. I'm guessing a GM wasn't called because the people that wanted their cake and to eat it too, knew deep down just how petty they were being. They just wanted to complain.

i never said it's wrong. there's a lot in this game that is not wrong (against the ToS). colbwa (no offense) can be whatever jerk he wants to be and not be against the ToS. what i see is this game degenerating from greed.

 

[Sneakypants]

You come here asking for others opinions then insult them when you do. Why post here for people to respond (remember its still posted in General Discussion) if you plan on being stubborn in your point and ignoring any discussion to the reverse view? You are only looking for justification that you did the right thing. You even use their insults to justify your own feelings for stealing. Thats like a thief stealing a purse, getting sprayed with mace and uses that to justify his stealing. It was a seperate event and should have no bearing on whether what you did was right or not.

So next time I see you dieing, I should wait until you ask for help? If you don't and die, its not my probelm I guess. After you die, I should warp out too. That way when you ask for a raise, I can say I already warped and you asked too late. You'd probably flame me afterwords, but hey, I had no obligation to help you. All you needed to do was /sea yet you didn't. It was probably very obvious they were after the coffer and you didn't care. You said you would have maybe left the coffer if you had known he was a 50 thf, but I think you knew he was a thf well before. When I look at a 50 thf's gear its almost too easy to tell he is a thf. You just didn't want to know for sure.

Paragraph one...Why I get pissy at others is because they don't answer the question. They see something else (what they believe to be an injustice) and start going off on an emotional tangent. Piss off if that's all you have to say. To take this out of context is pointless.


Paragraph two...The point is not to be spiteful. I even said numerous times that I'd aid them if they wanted aid. Off topic, going into the saving me from dying thing, yeah I think you should let people die if they don't call for help. I send tells to people in that case to see if they want help. Some people get pissed if you interfere at all.

Basically, you can't know what someone is up to unless you hear it from them. There will always be things you don't know unless that person has answered your questions. It is NOT necessary to ask questions when doing certain things in this game and everyone knows that. My moral fiber? I showed it. My kind-hearted, everyone else comes first attitude? Didn't show much of it. Didn't need to.


Time people, time!!!! I am asking a question about what kind of time you should give someone to pop a coffer. Nothing else.
Some say none. I can accept that answer, because that means zero time. Some say to send tells and make sure, blah blah...I don't accept that as an answer for how long. That's your own separate, besides the point, answer. Liking my ways isn't what this is or what I care about. I want times.

 

[Sneakypants]

I don't have a problem with what you did seeing as you didn't know at the time that they were there for an AF coffer. NO...I don't think it's your responsibility to find out. I had a similar thing happen to me in Monastic cavern when looking for my BLM AF coffer there. The thief got to the coffer before me. I congratulated him and /clapped for him on getting the coffer. I then let him know that I was there to get my coffer for AF. He said OK. Then proceeds to open the next coffer that popped. THAT was bullshit in that he knew I was trying to get my AF and left me with the impression that I could pop the next one.

Played well. And I agree, in this case, the THF is a bastard.

 

[Sneakypants]

I think the major point to be made is, regardless of who was there, and need versus greed, is simply that they were clearing leeches for a safe open. I think to an extent the coffer was rightfully theirs because they were clearing the mobs around it so opening it wouldn't require death or warping out.

On the other hand the NA and JP argument is bullshit. Not all NA are responsibile for what Sneakypants does, just as I don't hate on all JPs for what those guys said. Considering what they said about what I am and am proud to be, I don't feel to sorry about them. But if I was clearing mobs around a coffer and someone ran in and nabbed it yes I'd be angry and I feel justified.

I can see that clearing leeches for a safe open is a possible scenario. This I know and it has been discussed. I mentioned that I thought of that. I also mentioned that wasn't so important, as I don't think clearing leeches lays claim to a damn thing.

Actually claiming something is the only thing that gets you what you're after. They didn't. I felt I gave ample time. Others may not. If you don't agree that 15 seconds is long enough, please tell me what time you think is long enough and why.

People get their sorry asses hurt in this game all the time. The worst that happens is they go look for another. The rules of coffers are that there are no rules...Mostly. This is gray area. A gray area that I think a certain amount of time addresses fine enough. I don't think any tells are necessary, especially on my part. Everyone would go away happy if they just didn't lollygag around a coffer that they assumed was theirs.

No it's not entirely right or wrong to take the coffer in this situation..."Gray area". Even after this discussion, it won't be entirely right or wrong. I was just look for what people think is an acceptable time to wait for others to pop the coffer, without having a conversation about it.

 

[Sneakypants]

Shameless plug...anyone want to help me with the Eldieme key?

I will.