Treasure Coffers, Priorities...

[Sneakypants]

There are a lot of assumptions from the people trying to build cases against me and say that I am bad, wrong or immoral.
What you people need to understand is that I was not in the wrong or immoral in my actions.

and you didn't make an assumption that they didn't want the coffer? lol.

If you just think I'm wrong, well I already told you I'm not. That's fact.
If it wasn't, SE would have programmed this differently so as not to allow me to pop that coffer, or a GM would have thrown me in jail or something. I'm guessing a GM wasn't called because the people that wanted their cake and to eat it too, knew deep down just how petty they were being. They just wanted to complain.

i never said it's wrong. there's a lot in this game that is not wrong (against the ToS). colbwa (no offense) can be whatever jerk he wants to be and not be against the ToS. what i see is this game degenerating from greed.

:lol: :lol: :lol:
I never assumed they didn't want it.
I know for a FACT that they were too damn slow to be that interested in what was in it.

Edit: They were in fact interested, but it didn't show. Sucks for them. I still would have helped them out afterwards. 30 more minutes. Boohoo.

 

[yanzi]

There are a lot of assumptions from the people trying to build cases against me and say that I am bad, wrong or immoral.
What you people need to understand is that I was not in the wrong or immoral in my actions.

and you didn't make an assumption that they didn't want the coffer? lol.

If you just think I'm wrong, well I already told you I'm not. That's fact.
If it wasn't, SE would have programmed this differently so as not to allow me to pop that coffer, or a GM would have thrown me in jail or something. I'm guessing a GM wasn't called because the people that wanted their cake and to eat it too, knew deep down just how petty they were being. They just wanted to complain.

i never said it's wrong. there's a lot in this game that is not wrong (against the ToS). colbwa (no offense) can be whatever jerk he wants to be and not be against the ToS. what i see is this game degenerating from greed.

:lol: :lol: :lol:
I never assumed they didn't want it.
I know for a FACT that they were too damn slow to be that interested in what was in it.

Edit: They were in fact interested, but it didn't show. Sucks for them. I still would have helped them out afterwards. 30 more minutes. Boohoo.

when you saw they didn't make a move to it in 15 seconds, you assumed they weren't interested.
it's not just 30 mins for another coffer to pop, you have to find it and hope another greedy thf doesn't pop it.
i doubt you have stayed to help, since obviously you didn't try to rectify the situation in any way other than justifying it by their angry tells. i bet you take secret pleasure in that you screwed over some jp and think you're all badass now?

 

[Lavi]

You come here asking for others opinions then insult them when you do. Why post here for people to respond (remember its still posted in General Discussion) if you plan on being stubborn in your point and ignoring any discussion to the reverse view? You are only looking for justification that you did the right thing. You even use their insults to justify your own feelings for stealing. Thats like a thief stealing a purse, getting sprayed with mace and uses that to justify his stealing. It was a seperate event and should have no bearing on whether what you did was right or not.

So next time I see you dieing, I should wait until you ask for help? If you don't and die, its not my probelm I guess. After you die, I should warp out too. That way when you ask for a raise, I can say I already warped and you asked too late. You'd probably flame me afterwords, but hey, I had no obligation to help you. All you needed to do was /sea yet you didn't. It was probably very obvious they were after the coffer and you didn't care. You said you would have maybe left the coffer if you had known he was a 50 thf, but I think you knew he was a thf well before. When I look at a 50 thf's gear its almost too easy to tell he is a thf. You just didn't want to know for sure.

Paragraph one...Why I get pissy at others is because they don't answer the question. They see something else (what they believe to be an injustice) and start going off on an emotional tangent. Piss off if that's all you have to say. To take this out of context is pointless.


Paragraph two...The point is not to be spiteful. I even said numerous times that I'd aid them if they wanted aid. Off topic, going into the saving me from dying thing, yeah I think you should let people die if they don't call for help. I send tells to people in that case to see if they want help. Some people get pissed if you interfere at all.

Basically, you can't know what someone is up to unless you hear it from them. There will always be things you don't know unless that person has answered your questions. It is NOT necessary to ask questions when doing certain things in this game and everyone knows that. My moral fiber? I showed it. My kind-hearted, everyone else comes first attitude? Didn't show much of it. Didn't need to.


Time people, time!!!! I am asking a question about what kind of time you should give someone to pop a coffer. Nothing else.
Some say none. I can accept that answer, because that means zero time. Some say to send tells and make sure, blah blah...I don't accept that as an answer for how long. That's your own separate, besides the point, answer. Liking my ways isn't what this is or what I care about. I want times.

First Bold: You ask people if they need help and yet you won't ask if they needed the coffer? Ok...

Second Bold: Read your OP. I responded to the OP. You asked the question and now don't want it? You didn't ask for how much time until after the OP. And because you are the original poster does not mean you can decide to discontinue the subject you started nor can you stop it from doing so (as seen in numerous Flameboard posts).

 

[Firestreak]

Just look at it from the perspective of the AF hunting THF. If you run in and try pop it with pick there's chance of mimic. If helpers are busy fighting liches you could get killed. Should someone have to die in order for you to not take their coffer when they clearly saw it first and by taking their time could open it safely? Now had you found the coffer first I don't think it matters a damn if you get gil or they get AF, what's yours is yours. It's just unfortunate people have to endangered themselves in order to open a coffer when it's so blatently unneeded.

But yeah...

http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=7055&highlight=

It's kinda funny how when it happened to Kiere how many say it's such a shitty thing to do for a THF to steal a AF Coffer. I on the other hand disagree, I think it's wrong to take a coffer people are clearling around for a safe open.

For future reference, those leech drop nothing notable except item for unlocking SMN job once in a very rare while. If you see people clearing leech around a coffer you damn well know why.

 

[Sneakypants]

You come here asking for others opinions then insult them when you do. Why post here for people to respond (remember its still posted in General Discussion) if you plan on being stubborn in your point and ignoring any discussion to the reverse view? You are only looking for justification that you did the right thing. You even use their insults to justify your own feelings for stealing. Thats like a thief stealing a purse, getting sprayed with mace and uses that to justify his stealing. It was a seperate event and should have no bearing on whether what you did was right or not.

So next time I see you dieing, I should wait until you ask for help? If you don't and die, its not my probelm I guess. After you die, I should warp out too. That way when you ask for a raise, I can say I already warped and you asked too late. You'd probably flame me afterwords, but hey, I had no obligation to help you. All you needed to do was /sea yet you didn't. It was probably very obvious they were after the coffer and you didn't care. You said you would have maybe left the coffer if you had known he was a 50 thf, but I think you knew he was a thf well before. When I look at a 50 thf's gear its almost too easy to tell he is a thf. You just didn't want to know for sure.

Paragraph one...Why I get pissy at others is because they don't answer the question. They see something else (what they believe to be an injustice) and start going off on an emotional tangent. Piss off if that's all you have to say. To take this out of context is pointless.


Paragraph two...The point is not to be spiteful. I even said numerous times that I'd aid them if they wanted aid. Off topic, going into the saving me from dying thing, yeah I think you should let people die if they don't call for help. I send tells to people in that case to see if they want help. Some people get pissed if you interfere at all.

Basically, you can't know what someone is up to unless you hear it from them. There will always be things you don't know unless that person has answered your questions. It is NOT necessary to ask questions when doing certain things in this game and everyone knows that. My moral fiber? I showed it. My kind-hearted, everyone else comes first attitude? Didn't show much of it. Didn't need to.


Time people, time!!!! I am asking a question about what kind of time you should give someone to pop a coffer. Nothing else.
Some say none. I can accept that answer, because that means zero time. Some say to send tells and make sure, blah blah...I don't accept that as an answer for how long. That's your own separate, besides the point, answer. Liking my ways isn't what this is or what I care about. I want times.

First Bold: You ask people if they need help and yet you won't ask if they needed the coffer? Ok...

Second Bold: Read your OP. I responded to the OP. You asked the question and now don't want it? You didn't ask for how much time until after the OP. And because you are the original poster does not mean you can decide to discontinue the subject you started nor can you stop it from doing so (as seen in numerous Flameboard posts).

I've repeatedly said coffers are different. If it's 10k I get, I don't really care. The fact is that the coffer is as much mine as anyone's. If it was a concern of theirs that they didn't want the coffer stolen, they could have mentioned it and i wouldn't have touched it. I would have helped them find it. Simple. What I said though, was that I don't believe I should have to send them tells when I am just doing what I do there.
If they wanted it, they should have taken it. Their method of popping that coffer didn't work out so well for them.

OK. Mostly though I'm asking for time, and have asked that 20 times. I think that is called narrowing the scope. A necessary thing in this thread as it went here and there, and has still not gotten answered by more than 1-2 people. I toss it back at you B&Mers because you just complain and don't even answer to that.

 

[Sneakypants]

when you saw they didn't make a move to it in 15 seconds, you assumed they weren't interested.
it's not just 30 mins for another coffer to pop, you have to find it and hope another greedy thf doesn't pop it.
i doubt you have stayed to help, since obviously you didn't try to rectify the situation in any way other than justifying it by their angry tells. i bet you take secret pleasure in that you screwed over some jp and think you're all badass now?

No that's not what I assumed. I said they didn't make a move for it fast enough. I could give a shit what they are doing with that coffer if all they show is that they'd rather be killing leeches and picking their butts.


/sigh
More assumptions from you about what I probably did. Sweet.
I'm not out to fuck anyone over, Yanzi. :roll:

 

[Sneakypants]

Just look at it from the perspective of the AF hunting THF. If you run in and try pop it with pick there's chance of mimic. If helpers are busy fighting liches you could get killed. Should someone have to die in order for you to not take their coffer when they clearly saw it first and by taking their time could open it safely? Now had you found the coffer first I don't think it matters a damn if you get gil or they get AF, what's yours is yours. It's just unfortunate people have to endangered themselves in order to open a coffer when it's so blatently unneeded.

But yeah...

http://www.qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=7055&highlight=

It's kinda funny how when it happened to Kiere how many say it's such a shitty thing to do for a THF to steal a AF Coffer. I on the other hand disagree, I think it's wrong to take a coffer people are clearling around for a safe open.

For future reference, those leech drop nothing notable except item for unlocking SMN job once in a very rare while. If you see people clearing leech around a coffer you damn well know why.

This is so off at this point...For future reference I will still take the coffer if it remains sitting there. It's just a matter of how much time I'll give it.
For future reference, if you want a coffer, you'd better pop it, or at least not bitch when someone can actually manage to.

 

[yanzi]

I've repeatedly said coffers are different. If it's 10k I get, I don't really care. The fact is that the coffer is as much mine as anyone's. If it was a concern of theirs that they didn't want the coffer stolen, they could have mentioned it and i wouldn't have touched it. I would have helped them find it. Simple. What I said though, was that I don't believe I should have to send them tells when I am just doing what I do there.
If they wanted it, they should have taken it. Their method of popping that coffer didn't work out so well for them.

BS, you made no attempt to rectify the situation. obviously you don't care about anyone except yourself. try not being so selfish next time, maybe you'll turn out a better person.

OK. Mostly though I'm asking for time, and have asked that 20 times. I think that is called narrowing the scope. A necessary thing in this thread as it went here and there, and has still not gotten answered by more than 1-2 people. I toss it back at you B&Mers because you just complain and don't even answer to that.

and i've said 20 times, you didn't have to wait for any time. just send a /tell or a /sea which takes less than the 15 seconds you waited. you knew they might have taken the coffer so with your greediness you just ran and grabbed it and now you try to justify your actions.

 

[etchdog2000]

I am late to this post but I wanted to post my opinion. I think back to when i was hunting AF coffers. I had 1 that I actually had to camp (good luck i suppose). But when I did the first thing I did was search for thieves, and send a /tell to them that I was looking for AF. I did this every 10-15 minutes to let all the thieves in the zone know. If they dont care then so be it. Making gil is a cut-throat business and I guess all I can say is.... Let the best man/woman win.

 

[Sneakypants]

I've repeatedly said coffers are different. If it's 10k I get, I don't really care. The fact is that the coffer is as much mine as anyone's. If it was a concern of theirs that they didn't want the coffer stolen, they could have mentioned it and i wouldn't have touched it. I would have helped them find it. Simple. What I said though, was that I don't believe I should have to send them tells when I am just doing what I do there.
If they wanted it, they should have taken it. Their method of popping that coffer didn't work out so well for them.

BS, you made no attempt to rectify the situation. obviously you don't care about anyone except yourself. try not being so selfish next time, maybe you'll turn out a better person.

OK. Mostly though I'm asking for time, and have asked that 20 times. I think that is called narrowing the scope. A necessary thing in this thread as it went here and there, and has still not gotten answered by more than 1-2 people. I toss it back at you B&Mers because you just complain and don't even answer to that.

and i've said 20 times, you didn't have to wait for any time. just send a /tell or a /sea which takes less than the 15 seconds you waited. you knew they might have taken the coffer so with your greediness you just ran and grabbed it and now you try to justify your actions.

Why should I try to rectify a situation in which I am being talked to rude?
What happened, happened. If I saw another coffer after this discovery, I would never pop it. I would mention tho them the position. That's helping.

 

[yanzi]

I've repeatedly said coffers are different. If it's 10k I get, I don't really care. The fact is that the coffer is as much mine as anyone's. If it was a concern of theirs that they didn't want the coffer stolen, they could have mentioned it and i wouldn't have touched it. I would have helped them find it. Simple. What I said though, was that I don't believe I should have to send them tells when I am just doing what I do there.
If they wanted it, they should have taken it. Their method of popping that coffer didn't work out so well for them.

BS, you made no attempt to rectify the situation. obviously you don't care about anyone except yourself. try not being so selfish next time, maybe you'll turn out a better person.

OK. Mostly though I'm asking for time, and have asked that 20 times. I think that is called narrowing the scope. A necessary thing in this thread as it went here and there, and has still not gotten answered by more than 1-2 people. I toss it back at you B&Mers because you just complain and don't even answer to that.

and i've said 20 times, you didn't have to wait for any time. just send a /tell or a /sea which takes less than the 15 seconds you waited. you knew they might have taken the coffer so with your greediness you just ran and grabbed it and now you try to justify your actions.

Why should I try to rectify a situation in which I am being talked to rude?
What happened, happened. If I saw another coffer after this discovery, I would never pop it. I would mention tho them the position. That's helping.

the rude tells were caused by you and your actions; obviously you enjoyed rubbing it in their faces through tells and made no attempt in trying to alleviate the situation.

 

[Davio]

Maybe Admin should move this to Flameboards...

 

[ultraseven]

If it's their AF versus your whim, I'd say let them have the coffer. I don't just pop coffers whenever I see them, but that's mostly due to mimics and me not wanting to take a trip back to Jeuno. When it comes to castle oz coffers these days, I'd say need>greed. Back when they had astrals in them, I'd say tough luck.

i agree. back then when astrals come from those coffers, it would be first come first serve. but now that it's just gil over someone's AF... i woulda just given the THF his AF and let him/her be happy that they got 1 part of their AF out of the way. come on sneaky, let's not be THAT greedy.

 

[Peregrine]

Your takes on this?
Pop first, ask questions later?
Or ask questions first and then pop if all is well and good?
Just curious to see how this is viewed.

Probably should have deleted the first line if you didn't want comments. This turned into a justification thread, not an input thread. No one cares enough about you for you to bother justifying yourself to them. I for one don't particularly care, but since you asked I put my two cents in. Castle oz is a dead house. Has been ever since they took astrals out. I might go up there to get my ni spells for my ninja. Might. That's basically it. If I were lazy enough to still farm it when honestly it's about the worst stronghold for gil now out of all 4...I wouldn't touch a coffer with a ten food pole. It's not worth forcing a trip back to Jeuno. They're just not worth it, and there's AF there. To be there in the first place isn't smart. To be popping coffers there with tools isn't smart. To be actively seeking them enough to make AF seekers mad might be something a thief can do...but why? Again, that's a dead house. Don't make up for unoriginality by being an ass. Doesn't convert. That's like a L30 in the dunes farming lizards...why?

Given that the zone is dead, the coffers are dead, the mobs don't drop jack compared to quads or orcs...what were you doing there so hell-bent on popping coffers, when other thieves stopped bothering with them almost a year ago?

 

[ultraseven]

after reading this entire thread...

some of ya'lls attitudes are totally out of wack.

it's always about ME ME ME GIL GIL GIL... that's why personally i leave coffers alone unless i need it for AF.

edit: also, instead of just going with instinct as a THF with tools, always keep in mind your surroundings. if you're competing with other THFs for a coffer that has something nice, then don't hesitate. if you see a PT next to the coffer fighting off mobs... either 1) /poke Treasure Coffer so that they know what your intent is and 2) send a tell if they plan on opening it.

 

[ForteTeppo]

heh.. i remember this.. good times and no regrets.

 

[Jagster]

1.

perhaps it would be rude of him to just grab it while his helpers are busy fighting. he might as also not have been expecting greedy people to happen by.

First off, unless his friends had a giant stick up their ass, I really can't see them getting mad for their friends success. Secondly, you call sneaky a greedy thief in this context, but I think the thief is a greedy prick for going to his level 56 AF at level 50, he would've deserved a mimic at that level, it's just stupid to try at 50.

2.

right... all rank 10 JP are HNM botters...

So you can call all NA greedy and JP are the greatest people ever, but I can't make an assumption to prove a point? Of course they're not all botters, but judging from the problems I see from posts here on qcdn and other FFXI websites, I'd say something is up in perfect JP land.

3.

for all you people trying to compare farming or NMs with this, stop. the thf cannot resell his AF and it benefits no one but himself. it's ridiculous to compare his AF with farming or NMs.

You're missing the points of these comparsions, they're not about need vs need vs greed. They're proving that FFXI is indeed full of competion, and you can't always stop to smell the flowers, if you have a chance to take something, generally one should do it. Of course moral limits are set in place by each individual, however none can be proved right or wrong, but what the majority thinks can be obtained, and clearly this topic has equally supporitive sides, thus leaing us to the grey area.

I won't go deep in but I'm supportive of having to be alert and competive most of the time. Although what I'm saying has pissed me off before it's still the way things work. The only things I'm against are outside programs, bots, gil sellers/buyer, stealing mobs that have already been claimed. Coffers don't really fall under a main area of discussion, so I think comparing them to farming plentiful(sp) mobs was a great comparion. The competion:supply ratio is about the same as farmers:enemy competion, so I therefore extend the same rules to them, and that's be aggresive and take chances.

 

[Jagster]

if you see a PT next to the coffer fighting off mobs... either 1) /poke Treasure Coffer so that they know what your intent is

This is probably a very good idea, although no one has to be polite about it. but if someone wishes to give warning to nearby AF seekers, this sounds good and fair.

2) send a tell if they plan on opening it.

I disagree, I think it's the AF seeker's job to /t the thfs in the area. This is assuming they're not /anon. I can't speak for other thief, but I tend to always be not /anon so this possible problem wouldn't occur to me.

 

[yanzi]

You're missing the points of these comparsions, they're not about need vs need vs greed. They're proving that FFXI is indeed full of competion, and you can't always stop to smell the flowers, if you have a chance to take something, generally one should do it. Of course moral limits are set in place by each individual, however none can be proved right or wrong, but what the majority thinks can be obtained, and clearly this topic has equally supporitive sides, thus leaing us to the grey area.

I won't go deep in but I'm supportive of having to be alert and competive most of the time. Although what I'm saying has pissed me off before it's still the way things work. The only things I'm against are outside programs, bots, gil sellers/buyer, stealing mobs that have already been claimed. Coffers don't really fall under a main area of discussion, so I think comparing them to farming plentiful(sp) mobs was a great comparion. The competion:supply ratio is about the same as farmers:enemy competion, so I therefore extend the same rules to them, and that's be aggresive and take chances.

ok, here's an analogy. you see a guy standing around. there's a $20 at his feet. what do you do? run up grab it, and run away? or do you ask him if it's his?

 

[Pompidou]

A better analogy: There's one piece of pie left and you and another person want it. This other person *might* be hungrier than you, but you really don't know. Do you grab the last piece or ask if s/he wants it? Either way, another pie is coming out of the oven in 30 mins, so it doesn't matter. In the event that this other person might totally overreact, because while he was closer to the pie tin, he wasn't doing anything but staring at it, and you decide you're going to eat it, well, you can rest assured half the people you ask about the issue would suggest that you shouldn't have any pie at all.