WAR preferred weapons and why!

[etchdog2000]

The last Axe/Axe WAR I parsed against had alot of the bells and whistles and even had an E.Body. I outparsed him pretty significantly by 8% with /NIN. My WAR is not merited at all except 3 GA and 1 DA. I dont think his was merited much as all either.

IMO, if you arent fully merited, and have a Ridill, just use GA. And even then its still going to be close. Its really hard to fuck up using a GA.

And to be on topic, Perdu all the way. Would be interesting to see parse data on Fool.

 

[Khajit]

outparsed an axe/ridill war in ebody @ trolls by 3% on my war/sam the last time a few months ago. I took a shitload more damage than everyone else damage but but after i looked at the parser i noticed that a huge majority of the damage I took was from overthrow which ignores shadows anyway so the extra damage was probably a result of having hate more than anything.

 

[K. Ishitar]

some good info here nice read everyone not too suprised with /sam being the highest dd sub every job I see with it tends to take more damage even with seigan and TE up they're still fairly exposed from the healer perspective it just doesn't spread very far as far as making parties last on end

with a halfass bard and trying to use mp as conservatively as possible I think I only got to chain 68 or so before I was nearly tapped out convert wise on birds with 2 drg a nin and a thf and a bard. We were killing insane though after chain 68 I think i had to give it like two mins before convert was online again.


nothing against /sam people but jobs that have it to me show that they're trying at least but I know in the end I'll have to give them the most attention unlike the others that use /nin

i think the above could apply for more than just war/sam since i know quite a few good drg/sams that tap me out pretty well

 

[jamal]

outparsed an axe/ridill war in ebody @ trolls by 3% on my war/sam the last time a few months ago. I took a shitload more damage than everyone else damage but but after i looked at the parser i noticed that a huge majority of the damage I took was from overthrow which ignores shadows anyway so the extra damage was probably a result of having hate more than anything.

Yea, the overthrow damage is pretty comparable to firespit from mage Mamools...it will be a heavy damage sink regardless of who takes it, so negating the rest as much as possible helps. Due to the High VIT/DEF of trolls (especially MNK and PLD) I'd really expect WAR/SAM to shine there damage wise, not trying to take anything away from you just saying.

Trolls low AGI ups everyone's crit rates, so those teetering just below the tiers on lizards may jump up against them. This could also be a reason for a higher damage percentage done than normal.

 

[Redshift]

Top floor nyzul (mamools) camp, WAR/SAM x2, NIN/WAR, COR, BRD, 73-74 RDM (dinged 75 and we left) +33k/h, I don't have the parse but Necrosis was there as BRD and can confirm this. We lost chains because we ran out of monsters to kill, we sat around many times for a good while waiting for repops and still maintained pretty decent exp/hr. The NIN never tanked, myself and the other WAR/SAM switched between hasso/seigan often. Mamools go down like puks with two handers.

Foolkiller sucks, the fSTR bonus from the STR+8 and STR% mod on Raging Rush won't add 6 DMG compared to Perdu. At most you'll get is 2 DMG from fSTR (or none if you're capped), and 35% of 8 is int(2.8) = 2 DMG, even if you had extra STR from gear, and even if the α factor doesn't effect it and you get 3 DMG anyway, Perdu is STILL better.

Steel Cyclone should never be used in merit parties. With that in mind, Martial Bhuj should never be used in merit parties either. You lower your DoT damage to increase an already crappy WS to not even be as good as Raging Rush, what the hell is the point in that?

The math was shown to me a while ago that showed in merit parties Rampager wasn't as good as Perdu; I wouldn't be able to recall it the math, maybe I can find it. Maybe that will change with the inclusion of Brave Grip, but until then Perdu is better.

 

[jamal]

Top floor nyzul (mamools) camp, WAR/SAM x2, NIN/WAR, COR, BRD, 73-74 RDM (dinged 75 and we left) +33k/h, I don't have the parse but Necrosis was there as BRD and can confirm this. We lost chains because we ran out of monsters to kill, we sat around many times for a good while waiting for repops and still maintained pretty decent exp/hr. The NIN never tanked, myself and the other WAR/SAM switched between hasso/seigan often. Mamools go down like puks with two handers.

Foolkiller sucks, the fSTR bonus from the STR+8 and STR% mod on Raging Rush won't add 6 DMG compared to Perdu. At most you'll get is 2 DMG from fSTR (or none if you're capped), and 35% of 8 is int(2.8) = 2 DMG, even if you had extra STR from gear, and even if the α factor doesn't effect it and you get 3 DMG anyway, Perdu is STILL better.

Steel Cyclone should never be used in merit parties. With that in mind, Martial Bhuj should never be used in merit parties either. You lower your DoT damage to increase an already crappy WS to not even be as good as Raging Rush, what the hell is the point in that?

A needed evil...starting out with a little one, post some of your best dmg's here on either NM's or if you're not involved with it a high e-peen exp party shot.

Gettin the ball rolling with:

(Mod's please sticky )

Never said Steel Cyclone should be used in merit parties. I said I prefer to Steel Cyclone when equipping GA, because it's the spike damage part of the job.

The foolkiller was in reference to any situations. The game isn't all about merits.

 

[Redshift]

Never said Steel Cyclone should be used in merit parties. I said I prefer to Steel Cyclone when equipping GA, because it's the spike damage part of the job.

Steel Cyclone should never be used in merit parties. With that in mind, Martial Bhuj should never be used in merit parties either. You lower your DoT damage to increase an already crappy WS to not even be as good as Raging Rush, what the hell is the point in that?

I don't see your name mentioned.

The foolkiller was in reference to any situations. The game isn't all about merits.

Foolkiller sucks, the fSTR bonus from the STR+8 and STR% mod on Raging Rush won't add 6 DMG compared to Perdu. At most you'll get is 2 DMG from fSTR (or none if you're capped), and 35% of 8 is int(2.8) = 2 DMG, even if you had extra STR from gear, and even if the α factor doesn't effect it and you get 3 DMG anyway, Perdu is STILL better.

Where do you even see the words 'merit' or 'situations'?

 

[jamal]

You're comparing Foolkiller for Raging Rush only. In my previous examples of when other GA's may be better than perdu, it was in reference to holding tp to 300 for steel cyclones.

I'm not looking for an argument.

I also don't doubt you did 33k/hour at that spot. I've had the same thing happen where mobs don't repop quick enough. To note though, it's extremely easy and no plugin is needed to get proof of your total exp/hour.
Start of party:
/clock and check current merit exp (SS or digicam pic)
End of party:
/clock and check current merit exp (SS or digicam pic)

 

[Redshift]

You're comparing Foolkiller for Raging Rush only. In my previous examples of when other GA's may be better than perdu, it was in reference to holding tp to 300 for steel cyclones.

In the time you took to get 300TP with Foolkiller, you could have done more damage through DoT and much more WS damage with Raging Rush or King's Justice. What situations do you TP to 300 and wait? None.

Again, Foolkiller sucks compared to Perdu. I'm not looking for an argument, this is fact.

 

[jamal]

In the time you took to get 300TP with Foolkiller, you could have done more damage through DoT and much more WS damage with Raging Rush or King's Justice. What situations do you TP to 300 and wait? None.

Again, Foolkiller sucks compared to Perdu. I'm not looking for an argument, this is fact.

Big Fights:
Bigger fights is generally when I use my Great Axe setup. The sheer girth of the weapon allows for incredible damage to be done. Also, WAR's A+ skill (with merits + torque) allows for an extremely accurate weapon.

You're not spamming weaponskills on high tier fights...a zerg maybe, but that's not what's being discussed.

 

[Redshift]

Define "high tier fight."

"A zerg maybe" If you aren't spamming even on a zerg then I don't know what to tell you.

 

[jamal]

Define "high tier fight."

"A zerg maybe" If you aren't spamming even on a zerg then I don't know what to tell you.

1. Ixion -- slow steady damage from behind and weaponskills when hate is peak established.
2. Any Tier IV ZNM's. Skillchain damage and/or hate placement
3. Wyrms. Skillchain damage and/or hate placement

I meant in a zerg you would be spamming. If you're not in a zerg situation you wouldn't be.

 

[Redshift]

Ixion/Khim/Cerb, never held back and didn't pull hate very often, get better tanks.
Jorm and Tiamat most people just BLM those to death. Vrtra zerged.

So if you ever hold to 300TP, for whatever reason this is, it will be incredibly rare anyway.

 

[jamal]

Ixion/Khim/Cerb/Hydra, never held back and didn't pull hate very often, get better tanks.
Jorm and Tiamat most people just BLM those to death. Vrtra zerged.

So if you ever hold to 300TP, for whatever reason this is, it will be incredibly rare anyway.

I've done it in 5 fights (multiple occasions) in the last week. Raging Rush on Tinnin did 346 with Hedgehog Pie. Don't tell me to get better gear either. After a death, all I had left was sushi. Each Steel Cyclone was 1k-1.2k damage without a bard, done every 5 minutes. Very little TP given to the mob, waiting until hate established well, then skillchaining a cyclone so that part of the hate was given to the tanks. Get tp again, rinse and repeat. Pulling hate = draw in + ws. You have to be careful.

Sarameya. I tank this. I have our melees SATA ws's onto a tank sitting behind it. No one is to be pulling hate in any circumstance as hate is erased periodically by howls. Pulling hate by anyone else equals an MPK to the alliance. Melee's have specific times to be in. Running back and forth and continually weaponskilling would prove fatal to not only you, but the entire group. SATA SC's are MUCH more beneficial to the group as a whole.

Tyger. Not sure how you do this, but we just shift in melee to TA WS. Pulling hate by a melee again is a deathwish for the entire group due to the extremely small size of the ledge to fight on.

Ixion. Sentinel is a 5-minute recast (4:10 fully merited I know). Warrior's Charge fully merited is a 5-minute recast. Saving TP to skillchain immediately after sentinel/voke/flash gives you a free thrashing to the mob. Constant weaponskills will do more damage yes, but smart usage of JA timers makes for a more stable fight.

Sandworm -- Guivre: WAR/THF with SATA ws then holding tp until the next charge plants hate on a tank so everyone can go all out. THF or SAM/THF can do this as well.

I could give a multitude of more options. KS99 Wyrm TAWS right before it takes to the air. KS99 Turtle or Aspid, SC for dark skillchains for Ice MB's.

It's not as rare as you think.

 

[Tymon]

i don't see how foolkiller can "suck" compared to perdu, the stats are so close to each other the damage would be almost negligable anyway..

and jamal, the last time you did ixion on your war did you melee it or tp off of other mobs? I find it a little bit faster and certainly faster for the LS to melee it with hermes' sandals on and just run out for rampant stances and etc

you can actually hit somewhat accurately if you have a brd giving you minuet/madrigal and you never run out of mobs.

of course, this doesn't outperform rng / smn's, but this isn't the rng nor the smn forum.

(my damage sucked because I don't have SL for a perdu / martial bhuj :awesome: )

ps: this isn't directed to anyone, but if you're using raging rush on sarameya/cerb if you have access to a steel cyclone build, you're just plain stupid

 

[Langly]

Whenever I've done Ix, we have enough DD's that there's no point leaving us in when it's possible to build TP and cycle in/out.

 

[Tymon]

well, the most effecient way to do ixion is to have 4-6 dedicated damage dealers just melee / ranged / blood pact him and ws when available, the WS numbers are pretty when you crank out a 300% tp steel cyclone but you'll just pull hate and die eventually, the melee dmg + consistent damage from guillotine / raging rush / sidewinder or whatever else is far higher when you calculate the entire fight long

and yes, you can easily melee him if you have any kind of movement speed gear

if you're a rng it doesn't matter, if you're a smn it doesn't matter

if you're a war you have hermes, if you're a drk or whatever you have w.legs

if you're a sam, well, you're in a bit of a bind but you can probably get out in time anyway, if a grav'd pld can, you should be able to

 

[jamal]

i don't see how foolkiller can "suck" compared to perdu, the stats are so close to each other the damage would be almost negligable anyway..

and jamal, the last time you did ixion on your war did you melee it or tp off of other mobs? I find it a little bit faster and certainly faster for the LS to melee it with hermes' sandals on and just run out for rampant stances and etc

you can actually hit somewhat accurately if you have a brd giving you minuet/madrigal and you never run out of mobs.

of course, this doesn't outperform rng / smn's, but this isn't the rng nor the smn forum.

(my damage sucked because I don't have SL for a perdu / martial bhuj :awesome: )

ps: this isn't directed to anyone, but if you're using raging rush on sarameya/cerb if you have access to a steel cyclone build, you're just plain stupid

I was actually watching Fygla behind the mob on one and am patterning my thoughts on his and I can't remember the DRK's actions. You do kill other mobs for tp yea, but i've seen a few melee doing consistent damage and avoiding weaponskills from behind. I haven't put it into practice yet, but it's something I've been looking at.

 

[Tymon]

zenosu and fygla both melee it when they come a job that functions that way, and they both consistently and constantly outparse the smn's and most of the time, the rng's

 

[jamal]

zenosu and fygla both melee it when they come a job that functions that way, and they both consistently and constantly outparse the smn's and most of the time, the rng's

Yea, it looked quite effective.