What Tank you will pick for your exp pt?

[Vandoura]

PLD almost losing by 30 x.X

Come on Pally Favor! Vote for Pally!

 

[Amidamaru]

I voted thf tank

 

[Passions]

you try a 15hr party with a nin? you cant

Um...?? Toolbags much?

I've done 24hr sessions on blm before, i dont think i could handle it on ninja.

Ninja requires skill and focus much like it would in RL. PLDS just sit there and mash buttons and the only skill they have is curing between hits.

NIN>PLD in xp unless your comparing 2 nOObs then i'll let you say PLD>NIN

I have no problems holding hate on ninja. The only times i do is when its a dumb ass blm going on a nuke fest spamming AM like its aero 3. That would be the same shit that a pld would lose hate on. I'd rather let the blm die and laugh at them and hope they learned there leason. Then if they do it again just leave the party or if i'm leader kick them.

GOOD Ninja's are hard to find much any more, they are out there though. I'm sick of all these people being biased against ninja's because they've dealt with shitty ninja's. One's that can't count and forget to voke every 30 seconds.

But gimi a good ninja > pld and the xp will be off the chart.

 

[Zoolander]

so many people have said that and so many have failed

lol..../bets 5 mil...shit any sum of gil. Wouldnt even be close.

how about giving PLD the ability to provoke!!
75PLD/nin would be the ultimate end-game tank!

Already is a viable option in end game fights. Just needs proper support. Same with....war/whm, nin/whm, nin/drk...

 

[Bajaratt]

Ninja requires skill and focus much like it would in RL. PLDS just sit there and mash buttons and the only skill they have is curing between hits.

My nin's only 34 at the moment, but I'm pretty sure that I'm playing it right, which is mashing buttons. Unless the pro-nins do a little dance or something, that's all they're doing, that's all ANY job does in ths game. Nin just requires you to learn how to count to 5, that's not a big deal.

 

[kisada]

a war/nin tank a bard 38+ and a haster is probably the most dominating exp tank anyone will ever see. that notion doesn't even include the possibilities of really powerful end-game gear, such as ridill/joyeuse/adaman hauberk, and the like.

aside from that, what mithe pointed at i think was very true. a lot of people are quick to discount the possibilities, when they haven't had a chance to play with other jobs in more favorable circumstances. this thread itself is an example of it, limiting the choices to nin and pld, when war (and in my honest opinion, war destroys both tanks in exp) isn't even an option.

while i don't think anybody should be faulted for having their preferences, it's probably best to take into account the surrounding circumstances and player his or herself, before passing final judgement.

 

[Excim]

PLDS just sit there and mash buttons and the only skill they have is curing between hits.

See, it's crap like this that leads to more Ninja bandwagoning. Yeah, you're absolutley right Passions. When I have to cover a BLM that only casts tier 4 spells and does it FROM the start, I'm only mashing buttons. When I have to time my provokes and other skills just right as to not let the healers and nukers take hate, but not over due it so the DD setting up for a SATA Skillchain can get hate temporarily... I'm just mindlessly mashing buttons.


Seriously, stfu.

 

[Omniscientx]

Um...?? Toolbags much?

I've done 24hr sessions on blm before, i dont think i could handle it on ninja.

Ninja requires skill and focus much like it would in RL. PLDS just sit there and mash buttons and the only skill they have is curing between hits.

NIN>PLD in xp unless your comparing 2 nOObs then i'll let you say PLD>NIN

I have no problems holding hate on ninja. The only times i do is when its a dumb ass blm going on a nuke fest spamming AM like its aero 3. That would be the same shit that a pld would lose hate on. I'd rather let the blm die and laugh at them and hope they learned there leason. Then if they do it again just leave the party or if i'm leader kick them.

GOOD Ninja's are hard to find much any more, they are out there though. I'm sick of all these people being biased against ninja's because they've dealt with shitty ninja's. One's that can't count and forget to voke every 30 seconds.

But gimi a good ninja > pld and the xp will be off the chart.

im sorry but if counting time requires skill then I've missed a lot, a BLM saying all PLD do is mash buttons lol, funny shit. Also I have to add that not many things in this game require skill, just time, and a lot of it.

 

[Psylentcuda]

PLD for the simple fact they can Cover, heal themselves, and let me cast Bio2

 

[meeze]

a war/nin tank a bard 38+ and a haster is probably the most dominating exp tank anyone will ever see. that notion doesn't even include the possibilities of really powerful end-game gear, such as ridill/joyeuse/adaman hauberk, and the like.

It does account for needing a BRD, they aren't exactly the most leveled job in the game. At any given time there is rarely more than 2 BRDs for most levels.

WAR is decent tank in the right PT situation, melee parties with RDM/BRD WHM, but they lack hate grabbing abilities for BLMs and often need someone else who can voke if needed.

I tanked quite a bit getting my war to 55, most of the time getting a co-tank because that made the job easier.

Would BRD be playing march songs? And would you put WAR tanks against raptors toromas and birds, or find other leveling areas?

I know tanking gobs, beetles and crabs isn't too bad as WAR.

 

[Chasym]

Ninja requires skill and focus much like it would in RL. PLDS just sit there and mash buttons and the only skill they have is curing between hits

and then you remember every job just mashes buttons. found out thats how the game works recently...

 

[Numa]

I've had good discusions about this with Veteran, a good friend and 75 Galka PLD. I also have a few 75 jobs.

Good NIN > Good PLD > Bad PLD > Bad NIN

A god nin will never lose hate, get hit, does good DD and only requires Haste from support classes (stoneskin is nice too).

The problem with PLD is that they require too much support from party members. They need a white mage to heal them and a bard/rdm to refresh them. That basically means 3 people (half a party) are dedicated to keeping the tank alive. That leaves room for 3 DD.

A good nin can go through whole chains without needing cure. I do it all the time, although Im only 54 atm. And thats even with me swapping out alot of my evade gear for emnity and DD gear. But its not easy at all. being a good nin is damned hard - I have a full set of emnity gear I swap in just before I voke and if I lose hate, and a full set of evade/agi gear I swap in once hate is established or if I run out of shadows. But most importantly you need to know how and when to cast.

The point is that with a NIN, you dont need anywhere near as much support as a PLD. that pushes the pt makeup from 3 D to @ 5.5 DD (RDM instead of WHM healer, and a RDM can Nuke/MB for about 2/3 what a BLM can.)

That equals hella faster XP.

But since being a good nin is hard, You wont find many good nin out there. Ive seen "soandso's Utsu:ichi has no effect" because they dont know what theyre doing. or when the nin wont start casting until theyre already being hit. (Ive accidentally cancelled shadows right after casting em before in XPs too, leaving me SoL for 40 seconds, so I admit I can make a bad nin at times too. If Im tanking and say 'shit', thats why >.> )

BTW, I love how Isoptope keeps raiding this thread about how Shes played NIN and played WAR with NIN tanks, and the NIN kept getting hit and couldnt hold hate. Let Me just say, take your WAR and NIN past 37 - Utsusemi:Ni kinda helps a NIN tank more effectively ;p

A PLD is easier to play as a mediocre player, since theres much less 'finess' involved. Its like kicking in a door instead of picking a lock. again, let me say:

Good NIN > Good PLD > Bad PLD > Bad NIN

A pld can make a bad party acceptable. a good nin can make a good party exceptional.

 

[kisada]

It does account for needing a BRD, they aren't exactly the most leveled job in the game. At any given time there is rarely more than 2 BRDs for most levels.

WAR is decent tank in the right PT situation, melee parties with RDM/BRD WHM, but they lack hate grabbing abilities for BLMs and often need someone else who can voke if needed.

I tanked quite a bit getting my war to 55, most of the time getting a co-tank because that made the job easier.

Would BRD be playing march songs? And would you put WAR tanks against raptors toromas and birds, or find other leveling areas?

I know tanking gobs, beetles and crabs isn't too bad as WAR.

well i guess i didn't state it explicitly, but i was making the assumption that people would know that wars can (and they do) hold hate through pure damage only. i.e. you never have to worry about hate, when you do more damage than the blm in the first place (let alone use provoke/warcry).

the implication with bard is that you're entitled to an elegied and slowed monster (of course's there's the assumption that both slow and elegy land too), and in that instance it's possible to tank most things in the game with utsusemi:ichi alone. minuet/march/madrigal etc, that is really just a preference thing. my main worry when i tank as a war, is that the bard casts elegy right away, rather than melee songs. carnage elegy and slow spell will slow a monster down by about 50% (i don't think i can recall exact numbers unfortunately), making it definitely viable for wars to just ichi tank an entire fight.

as far as monsters: raptors, toramas, and birds are definitely feasible with a war. the relatively harder things i've tanked included raptors, perytons, cockatrices, and tigers, but honestly they're just a joke with a good bard, slow, and haste. to directly answer your question, yeah i'd pit war (solo tanking, i should mention) against those monsters, and pretty much anything else you can exp off of. when you can spam provoke and rampage, war hate comes second to nobody.

a war who doesn't have to hold back will out-damage and out-hate anybody else not similarly equipped (not including mnks, in certain circumstances).

 

[Stirce]

I have lvled pld and nin, pld 66. nin 37. NIN is a good tank and done right can be a great tank. got alot of respect for nin cuz its not easy. but what i learned is you take hate from a nin you die or get pretty damn close to dieing. take hate from a pld you dont. just my personal thoughts. parties with nin if your a melee you have to sub war and be ready to help voke. parties with pld you dont unless a thf is in the party. I picked pld. people say you dont get exp as fast with a pld tank, thats your own fault. that means you didnt bring your A game to the party. Ive been in alot of parties with lazy whms. why are they so damn lazy "omg i have to cure someone wtf?" fool you have over 500 mp stop bitching and cure. pld and nin both great tanks but honestly ppl complain about not getting the exp they fell the should be get over it cuz a party is only as good as you make it.

 

[meeze]

I have lvled pld and nin, pld 66. nin 37. NIN is a good tank and done right can be a great tank. got alot of respect for nin cuz its not easy. but what i learned is you take hate from a nin you die or get pretty damn close to dieing. take hate from a pld you dont. just my personal thoughts. parties with nin if your a melee you have to sub war and be ready to help voke. parties with pld you dont unless a thf is in the party. I picked pld. people say you dont get exp as fast with a pld tank, thats your own fault. that means you didnt bring your A game to the party. Ive been in alot of parties with lazy whms. why are they so damn lazy "omg i have to cure someone wtf?" fool you have over 500 mp stop bitching and cure. pld and nin both great tanks but honestly ppl complain about not getting the exp they fell the should be get over it cuz a party is only as good as you make it.

You took nin to 37, so you think every melee has to sub war to help voke...of course before NI...You never even touched the levels where NIN tanks every second of the fight. Elemental NIs make the job so much more fun and so much more powerful. I had THFs SATA VB their own partner without the mob even turning around. Something I can do with PLD as well, so hate isn't an issue.

And how does taking hate from one job make you die faster than taking hate from another? PLD vokes and casts flash, NIN vokes and hits an elemental NI. Both get hate back quick, where is death immenent(sp) for the hate taker?

 

[Sneakypants]

You people saying "they're ok damage" and "they can't hold hate" have no idea at all.

I totally agree wiht that. Those of you that had bad experiences with a NIN just got a bad NIN.

I XPed THF about 40k XP about a month ago. In that time, we saw a lot of rotations, but I had a <long time>, so kept going...We had a PLD tank at first who was a very good tank. Maybe not the best, but very good. We saw 4 other PLD tanks in that time, none of which were as good as the first. It was painfully evident that they didn't hold a candle to the first PLD.

However, we also had the fortune of partying with one Ninja. DD and mage setup was mostly the same for the duration. The XP from the NIN tanked "XP Party" (with a decent NIN at best) was time and a half compared to the best PLD tank we had...And several times better compared to the lack luster PLD tanks we had.


This is just one of many situations though. For me, NIN experiences, time and time again, are just better. 2 things help though...The NIN knowing what he is doing, and the rest of the party knowing what they are doing. I've been NIN tank in all too many parties where the "support" class does anything but support effectively. No Erase ("too expensive", "not my main" >< wtf), no Haste, no monitoring debuffs, silencing WAR MOBs, etc.
Next time it seems like the tank sucks, tank a look at what the support is doing to aid the party. It could be that the advantages we all become used to with good support players are taken for granted. We know how it's supposed to work...But it just doesn't some times.

 

[Sneakypants]

I had THFs SATA VB their own partner without the mob even turning around. Something I can do with PLD as well, so hate isn't an issue.

I'm a big fan of this method, especially with THFs that are the weak link and are really slow on the SATA. Slow SATA ruins shit. Versus, I can take first voke and just tank the MOB hard. SATA+VB on the DD. Mostly, the MOB won't even turn. When it does, I get it back with the very next voke, or even just a Ni casting, lol.

 

[Vondoom]

BLM 75. Maxed Thunder, Elemental Magic Skill, and Int merits. Paladin or nothing. I exp for exp, not to run around in circles dying as a Ninja pecks at a golem for 35 hp at a time while it swats the shit out of me for 250+ per swing.

To be specific, Kile or Boondock. Any Paladin will usually do, but I prefer one of those two. If it absolutley must be a Ninja, you absolutley need to find a different BLM.

 

[Mithe]

BLM 75. Maxed Thunder, Elemental Magic Skill, and Int merits. Paladin or nothing. I exp for exp, not to run around in circles dying as a Ninja pecks at a golem for 35 hp at a time while it swats the shit out of me for 250+ per swing.

To be specific, Kile or Boondock. Any Paladin will usually do, but I prefer one of those two. If it absolutley must be a Ninja, you absolutley need to find a different BLM.

That's pretty funny. You exp for exp? This seems to me like you're saying manaburn parties slaughter and get mass exp and you think ninjas are inferior.

Some food for thought- before I left, the avg cannon I did was at least 12k/hr, usually all ninjas, or all warriors, or a combination of ninjas and warriors, or ninjas warriors and monks, only two support slots. Now I don't know what kind of exp you're exping to exp, but that's not too bad imo.

 

[Isotope]

From the perspective of one who plays the tank job... I've played both, left NIN @ 37 due to my personal opinion of it not being as fun of a job as PLD, plus the costs of playing NIN. I plan on saving NIN as one of the last jobs I get to 75. I might push NIN to 60 just to get AF, but that'd be it for now. Playing NIN early on really hinders your wallet for a long time, best to play it near the end when you've done tradeskills & have got multiple high lvl jobs for which you can make better Gil with to support playing NIN.