You're gone, good, go away

Jeska said:
Isnt buying gil considered cheating the system?
Click to expand...

So is using Windower...

People buy gil/gold/game currency for various reasons. Some people play these games for various reasons. To you its cheating, for some it's leveling the playing field, saving them time farming to play aspects of the game they enjoy more. Some its just simply part of their addiction. This game seems to frown down upon it a lot more than other games I've played where people were very open about buying currency. During my break from FFXI I knew of people who would drop 100s to 1000s of dollars. People that couldnt wait to get their tax returns, of all things, just so they could boost their toons. One guy who debated on whether or not to buy a motorcycle or a top game account, which did he chose? That is just down right addiction, but for some they have more money than time.
 
I wouldnt flame him for his post, he just pointed out his own realization.
I too came to that very same realization myself.
You see, you can get addicted to the game very much so, this much is known and warned when you start the game every time.
But what makes us addicted? at first its the excitement of advancement, becoming better and getting better things that drives us, then when you hit end game its the feeling of responsibility.
You feel like when your groups are doing something major at certain times, you need to be there to be a part of that team. You feel you are required to be at these events or help out if you want to earn your spot and keep in the good viewings of your LS.
Theres also the feeling of being left behind, you dont want to be a few levels lower than your friends and be left out of things your friends are doing, so you push to advance with them.
Now in no way am i saying this is the general population of FFXI or any other MMOs path or feelings, but it is the basic reasons addiction sets in for many.
I was too an addict, being my first MMO, and spent 4 years playing this game, logging in everyday for hours on end, losing jobs and my house because of it.
It took alot for me to quit, and just to be sure i purposley had my character banned. There are times i wish i didnt have him banned so i could play again if i wanted to. But that is exactly the reason i did it, because i knew id want to come back.
but when a person realizes how much they missed out on or let slide by because they were far too engulfed in the game, they feel like they wasted alot of time and realize its only a game.
This is in no way a put down for those who still play, unless they come right out and say it is, its just more of a notice to those who may fall into the same problem and not realize it before its too late.
I dont think their post was in anyway made with ill will in mind.
 
I left partly out of addiction, and partly out of .. just being "done" with it.

I always had a particular disdain for gil-sellers.. but I didn't hate gil buyers.. I resented the fact I worked so hard to get something to watch them just "instantly" have it...
But, that was selfish of me. If their morales were loose enough to allow them that luxury, then good for them I guess.

Personally, I don't think purchasing or selling gil should be an issue. I toyed with the notion of selling my account when I retired, but didn't relish the notion that either a gil-seller would be running around in control of my hard work, and well.. it came down to this.
Many people were affiliated with me ingame, and many people respected me. I valued that too much to do anything that would be detrimental to the relationships I forged in-game.
To those who bought gil.. good for you.
To those who didn't. even better.

I won't judge, I won't condemn.. I just think it's more worthwhile to do it the "honest" way.. but in the end.. who cares?
 
Sandria said:
So is using Windower...

People buy gil/gold/game currency for various reasons. Some people play these games for various reasons. To you its cheating, for some it's leveling the playing field, saving them time farming to play aspects of the game they enjoy more. Some its just simply part of their addiction. This game seems to frown down upon it a lot more than other games I've played where people were very open about buying currency. During my break from FFXI I knew of people who would drop 100s to 1000s of dollars. People that couldnt wait to get their tax returns, of all things, just so they could boost their toons. One guy who debated on whether or not to buy a motorcycle or a top game account, which did he chose? That is just down right addiction, but for some they have more money than time.
Click to expand...

Saying you buy gil because you don't have the time to farm/craft is a very shitty excuse. There is no excuse, making gil is part of this game, a difficult part sure, but still a step needed to make your character into what you'd like it to be. The moment you buy gil, I don't even care if its 100k, you no longer have worked for what you've accomplished in game, and it now means nothing. So if you have fun knowing you haven't worked for what you have, then gil buying is for you.
 
I almost never even craft/farm and i've managed to not bu gil. Sure i dont have a +1 hauby but I've managed to stockpile a decent collection of gear.
 
Anyone who condones buying gil because they "don't have the time" is a self-serving dumbass. It, just like every other game in the world whether it be MMO or console, isn't going anywhere. You don't say "Oh I don't have time to play FF6, let me just game genie all gear and L99 to everyone so I can finish faster".

People need to stop obsessing over being at the top, there's nothing special there. Game isn't going anywhere, people need to stop rushing and obsessing over being omfgtehbest.
 
Mishaela said:
Anyone who condones buying gil because they "don't have the time" is a self-serving dumbass. It, just like every other game in the world whether it be MMO or console, isn't going anywhere. You don't say "Oh I don't have time to play FF6, let me just game genie all gear and L99 to everyone so I can finish faster".

People need to stop obsessing over being at the top, there's nothing special there. Game isn't going anywhere, people need to stop rushing and obsessing over being omfgtehbest.
Click to expand...

not trying to be a hypocrite or anything...

but on FF7... you bet your sweet little ass I gamesharked all my shit!
materia, money, skills, spells, and even brought that lil dead bitch back.

HAHAHAHA

but in my defense, I beat the game normal before I used the shark.
 
I used cheat devices for almost every game I played when I was a lot younger (I mean, 8-10 years old, N64 years)

Obviously, I've since gained a respect for doing it without any of that kind of stuff, but I can understand how younger people playing the game can get addicted, and/or will buy gil to do stuff faster. It's more appealing.
 
Jeska said:
Isnt buying gil considered cheating the system?
Click to expand...

It is. I never once said it wasn't. The point behind what I said is that it's a difference of magnitude in degree of intensity. Using Silente's analogy - I'm saying that it's a whole lot hotter down in the "Botting / Flee Tool" segment of Hell versus the 'Gil Buying' segment of Hell.

I guess you can say for me personally I draw the line of 'it bothers me a lot' between Buying/Selling Gil and Other-More-Malicious-Form-Of-Cheating. Again, this line is drawn on a personal level. Your line may be drawn on the left of both those acts; or it may be on the right thereof.

My response was one to the clause of 'every legit players hate RMT more than anything - more than cheaters'. No, I represent one legit player that hate cheaters more than I dislike RMT and it's not even close.

Cheaters, in the sense that they are 'breaking' game mechanics and not circumventing. By the way, even circumventing has degrees of intensity. But breaking game mechanics - i.e., movement enhancements - that's out right cheating and that tops my list for dislikes in a MMO.

As Sandria said there's a lot of reasons that people buy on-line currency. I happen to agree with just about none of them, but I can at least understand their line of reasoning.

Actually now that I think of it, if I try hard enough I can rationalize why people cheat (in the sense that I've been defining the word), too. I just have to try really hard, and then try not to be really disgusted.

And Sharpe - yes, I think we're in agreement. Without gilbuyers there won't be gilsellers. Without gilsellers there may or may not be gilbuyers (remember, your average joe semi-legit player can be convinced to sell, too). What I've accepted, which I don't know if you agree or not, is that RMT is a part of modern MMORPG. FFXI has done a better job than any MMO I've ever played (and this pretty much means every single mainstream one) at combating RMT ever since the age that RMT was considered bad. I commend SE for this. The STF(u) brings me joy. It makes my game play experience more enjoyable. I'm not arguing that at all. I also am not naive to think that there is going to be a way for SE to completely eliminate this aspect of the game. However, I am more than satisfied with the efforts they put in and the amount they have been able to regulate. The hacking is unfortunate, but pretty much came from left field. I do not fault SE for that.

~Tanshui
 
Darthyoda said:
not trying to be a hypocrite or anything...

but on FF7... you bet your sweet little ass I gamesharked all my shit!
materia, money, skills, spells, and even brought that lil dead bitch back.

HAHAHAHA

but in my defense, I beat the game normal before I used the shark.
Click to expand...
This. But there's no real beating FFXI if you think about it.
I did the same thing you did, lol, except I did it with stat+ items. Using braver at level 1 for 9k damage was awesome.
 
Flag said:
This. But there's no real beating FFXI if you think about it.
I did the same thing you did, lol, except I did it with stat+ items. Using braver at level 1 for 9k damage was awesome.
Click to expand...

I spent many hours of my life morphing things into stat-tablets. : (

Speed, then power, then pretty much anything and everything. I don't think I ever finished the game personally since I saw someone else finish it. I got kind of absorbed in the 'maxing out my character' part : O To me, that's the fun and joy. Aside from the community, it's the largest reason I seek to play a MMO. I actually would not like it if I was given a fully built character to play as my main. I always feel it's not the same if you don't make it yourself from scratch.

~Tanshui
 
Darthyoda said:
not trying to be a hypocrite or anything...

but on FF7... you bet your sweet little ass I gamesharked all my shit!
materia, money, skills, spells, and even brought that lil dead bitch back.

HAHAHAHA

but in my defense, I beat the game normal before I used the shark.
Click to expand...

Godmoding once you've beaten the game is the one exception I can see to it, but it doesn't really ever apply to online games unless you're running a private server (which is a whole different matter in itself.), y'know?

And yeah, I remember morphing those mutants in the sunken sub for +stat items for ages. x_x argh.
 
Or those guys on the mountain for power sources .. man those bitches were stubborn sometimes.
 
I only remember cheating in Warcraft 3, and only on levels I'd already beaten because my saved data kept getting erased switching laptops and/or removing/reinstalling the game. I don't even know how to use a gameshark.

But I digress. I'll admit I have been rather fortunate when it comes to gil (In my own way, I can't think of single NM drop I've gotten that sold for a lot of cash) But when it comes down to it, gotta farm.
 
TanShui said:
It is. I never once said it wasn't. The point behind what I said is that it's a difference of magnitude in degree of intensity. Using Silente's analogy - I'm saying that it's a whole lot hotter down in the "Botting / Flee Tool" segment of Hell versus the 'Gil Buying' segment of Hell.

I guess you can say for me personally I draw the line of 'it bothers me a lot' between Buying/Selling Gil and Other-More-Malicious-Form-Of-Cheating. Again, this line is drawn on a personal level. Your line may be drawn on the left of both those acts; or it may be on the right thereof.
Click to expand...
And what about those that hack the game and buy gil, are they twice damned or just really deep down that hellfire hole? Like the expression in for a penny, in for a pound.

Funny enough I recall when Empress bands first became available for use in FFXI, a friend of mine considered getting experince faster than someone else in a party unfair for others in the party. I guess to level the playing field he could just use a band also.

Much like if we all bought gil it would be a level playing field. And AH prices would skyrocket and newer players would be forced to buy gil just to survive in the game.
 
Though the 'lack of time' argument is apparently frowned upon, it is a legitimate reason. There are many people who work, go to extra classes, or other other activities that prohibit them from being able to play as often as the average high schooler/middle schooler (whereever the age 13+ applies). Though it makes me wonder why someone would spend money on e-money, they simply cannot compete with the people who have more time. Real life will always take priority over in-game antics. End-game and some of the high-priority pieces are quite hard to attain if you don't have the time.

And honestly, I don't see why people are bitching anyways. People are always exclaiming how this is only a game, yet when somone gains an 'unfair advantage' in something that is 'only a game', peoples' panties get all tied up in a knot. People buy gil because of many reasons, one of which they just don't have the time. If it really pisses you off, confront them, and smack them across the face. But just remember: people who buy gil only hurt themselves by using their paycheck to pay for money that has absolutely no real value (unless you're RMT of course). That is their punishment and their stupidity fee.
 
They hurt others by supporting gil sellers. And no, limited time isn't a reason; divide your play time wisely and stop rushing through the game. There is no goal waiting for you at the end, for there is no end.
 
I just wanted to ask why no one said anything about using the windower?
I'm sorry but cheating is cheating. There are not gray area's you either are going by the rulez or you are breaking them. Bottom Line.
 
There's an enormous difference between using features that give you gold out of nowhere and using a feature that allows you to do other things on your computer while camping a HNM and such. Using Windower breaks ToS but it by absolutely no means is it actually cheating, because there's zero ingame benefit to using it unless you're using the plugins as well.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top