Help me settle a brd disagreement

[xKronox]

Gear means equipment, such as clothing or tools, used to perform an activty. That would include armor, weapons, meds, and materials.

Regadless, adding the "s" is unnecessary.

Ok, point proven, we know your pet peeve now, lolz.

 

[revrandlord]

Question: exactly what songs generate a lot of hate to make –eminity necessary?

i don’t know bard that well. Most times I have seen most bards only cast ballad, acc, attack, mind+, for chi, range attack+, some sort of carol and finale.

Is the eminity- more for long fights to avoid hate or is it really necessary for a average fight.

 

[Areya]

Rng - Best body piece available to them.

Bst - 10 CHR good for charms.

Sam - Good for ws's when /thf.

War - Same as sam, but when do they ever sub thf for HNM or anything any more?

Nin/Mnk - There's better pieces for everything that are cheaper/easier to get.

Brd - It's better than errant. If you're pulling so much hate that 5 enmity is an issue, you're better off with higher def and 17 more VIT.

Apart from rng, I don't see why any job fights for priority for it. But then again I don't see why people fight over relic pieces that are completely and utterly useless.

Actually, the famous Kyudogi ( http://ffxi.somepage.com/itemdb/8923 ) is one of those pieces that rangers tend to drool more on. Sure Osode would give better modifiers sidewinder/slug shot..but other than that, Kyudogi might be better for DoT imo. But hey, I don't have one, so I have yet to experiment with such an item.


/end derail

 

[Bajaratt]

Mazurka is a lot of hate if you hit everyone in your party with it, but the main reason is probably because bards don't wear much -enmity gear and they're singing a lot. So they're constantly adding to their hate while having it slowly decay; while it might not pull hate unless they're spamming something like mazurka, if the tank goes down the bard might be the next target. -Enmity would be more useful in a longer or more difficult fight where your tanks have a chance of either dying or losing a lot of hate suddenly.

Back to the orignal topic, osode is show-off for bards, as has been discussed already. If I had an osode, I'd never wear errant again, just because I hate how it looks. I have multiple jobs that'd use it though and bard is the last on my list of jobs that I'd want an osode for, but I'd still use it.

 

[Khajit]

Question: exactly what songs generate a lot of hate to make –eminity necessary?

i don’t know bard that well. Most times I have seen most bards only cast ballad, acc, attack, mind+, for chi, range attack+, some sort of carol and finale.

Is the eminity- more for long fights to avoid hate or is it really necessary for a average fight.

It's because a common practice in many HNMls is to have the bard constantly swap which party they are in since technically a brd can sing enough songs to hit 3~4 parties before the first songs even think to wear off. Hitting 6 people all on the hate list with a tiny hate generator every 12 seconds adds up the longer the fight goes. Theyre also slowly adding to thier hate via support cures and debuffs.

 

[Stouter]

Elegy, threnodies, and lullaby are brd hate. Buffs give very little hate, and mazurka has been nerfed to give virtually none.

I'm not sure why rng would want Kyudogi over Osode, 7 racc isn't going to do much of anything when the +80 racc you're wearing has almost no effect, and 10 STR is going to be better for ranged attacks than 2 Ratt (the 10 STR gives 5 Ratt).

 

[Vilurum]

My two cents on CHR is that its effectiveness is based on how high it is relative to mob CHR. Hence a number of around 100 or so is plenty sufficient for most things you encounter in the game, and for some of the beefier HNMs you may want to get more towards the 110-120 range (which when all is said and done, means "use the same gear, actually eat food for a change, and etude yourself" which can amount to a CHR difference of 30 or so).

I happen to like AF+1 over Minstrel's Coat for debuffing not for potential debuff effectiveness, but so I don't have to delegate some *other* slots to CHR instead, and can wear more interesting things there (such as Tamas Ring or Loquacious Earring). For a pure debuffing build, ideal (not necessarily practical) would probably be something like:

- (Post-update) 8 Wind, 8 Singing merits (16 wind, 16 singing)
--- CHR merits if feeling particularly overkill, but lolCHRmerits
- Appropriate HQ elemental staff
- Gjallarhorn (4 CHR, 10 wind, 10 singing)
- Marduk's Tiara (3 CHR, 7 singing)
- Wind Torque (7 wind)
- Singing Earring (3 singing)
- Musical Earring (5 wind)
- Minstrel's Coat (3 wind)
- Choral Cuffs +1 (7 CHR, 10 singing)
- Heavens Ring/+1/Light Ring x2 (5 CHR each)
- Astute Cape (5 singing)
- Gleeman's Belt (6 CHR)
- Choral Cannions +1 (8 wind)
- Goliard Clogs (4 CHR, 2 macc)

Pre-food/buff total (not counting occasional 2 CHR on Apollo/Pluto Staff): +34 CHR (= 104 or 96 depending on race), +49 wind (= 274), +51 singing (= 276), +2 macc (= who knows)

However, that is *way* overkill for sticking debuffs on practically anything in the game you'd come across (and anything that's resistant even so, is probably just plain gonna be resistant no matter what, and you might as well free up some other slots for other stuff). Which means you may be better served with somewhat less of an ideal debuffing setup, and have something instead that has, say, auto-refresh and more -enmity and more max MP.

Either way, Osode is not something to stand around in for HNMs. It has no auto-refresh and it has no -enmity. Throw it on if you pull hate and are getting smacked, otherwise it's kinda pointless. (Protip: +/- enmity also affects how fast you bleed enmity while doing nothing, so don't just limit it to macroing in to hate-generating actions.)

 

[crookedmidget]

If your Osode drop order is strictly based on job, then sure, give priority over someone else, rather than someone who has 75 Bard only. I would give special consideration to the individual if they had other jobs leveled like BST (like me. ).

But when it comes to these items, my experience has shown that there are numerous other factors involved in getting Sky Gear. I can see situations where a bard is rewarded over a ranger; but generally speaking I don't see leadership doing this except under very special circumstances.

 

[Fonzy]

Bst - 10 CHR good for charms.

+10 intelligence for tame, +10 mind for pet food potency, +10 STR/DEX for rampage/DD, +mp for WHM sub job, +10 AGI for shield/parry, +10 VIT and high base defense for when your getting your ass handed to you. Your right, we barely get any use out of it at all and should never even consider wanting one. Frankly, it's the best body piece available to BST in the game, as it stands.

 

[Stouter]

+10 mind for pet food potency

Omg 40 more HP for your pet vs no +MND gear, or curing status effects with AF/relic

+10 STR/DEX for rampage/DD

lolosodeforDD http://ffxi.somepage.com/itemdb/1398

+mp for WHM sub job

Max MP means squat, http://ffxi.somepage.com/itemdb/6224

+10 AGI for shield/parry

This doesn't even deserve a response

+10 VIT and high base defense for when your getting your ass handed to you.

Brd can use the exact same arguement, as can any other job that can wear it...

Your right, we barely get any use out of it at all and should never even consider wanting one. Frankly, it's the best body piece available to BST in the game, as it stands.

It's the best for charm and tame, how often do you really use tame (enough to merit -recast on it?), and how often do you honestly get resisted on charm, and how much would 7 CHR over gaudy really help that?

 

[Vilurum]

And in spite of all those rebuttals, they *still* get more mileage out of the thing than BRDs do.

 

[Reauland]

Omg 40 more HP for your pet vs no +MND gear, or curing status effects with AF/relic

Actually, as MND is an internal factor in the Reward calculation, +10 MND can be a much more substantial increase than a mere +40 hp, depending on what other MND gear and "Enhances Reward" pieces you have at your disposal. With the combination of gear I use, I'm effectively doubling the potency of our most powerful pet food.

lolosodeforDD

In a merit party? Definitely. Against gods and HNMs? Absolutely. Against the Ts/low VTs that a Bst tends to solo at 75? Not so much.

Max MP means squat,

Agreed.

+10 VIT and high base defense for when your getting your ass handed to you.

Brd can use the exact same arguement, as can any other job that can wear it...

+10 AGI for shield/parry

This doesn't even deserve a response

Considering that at 75, a well-geared Bst easily tanks as much as their pet, every little bit helps. As far as "Bst tanking" goes, CHR also has a noticable effect on intimidation procs.

It's the best for charm and tame, how often do you really use tame (enough to merit -recast on it?), and how often do you honestly get resisted on charm, and how much would 7 CHR over gaudy really help that?

With the exception of extremely charm resistant mobs, the additional 7 Chr seems to be putting me over the hump on absolutely requiring my Apollo's staff on every charm. Before I was fortunate enough to obtain an Osode, I easily mischarmed 25% of the time without my staff, and that was with CHR +36(which of course included the Gaudy). With the Osode, I'd say that might knock it down to as little as 20%. If one mischarm in 5 sounds like a lot, it is. That's how important Tame is to a Bst, and why we usually find it unthinkable to not use our staves when we charm, as Apollo's staff puts us at the floor on mischarms without heaping tons of CHR gear, not that Bst really has all that much really juicy CHR gear available to them in the first place. At 75, Brd(and hell, mages too for that matter) can bury a Bst in terms of CHR gear.

 

[Fonzy]

It's the best for charm and tame, how often do you really use tame (enough to merit -recast on it?), and how often do you honestly get resisted on charm, and how much would 7 CHR over gaudy really help that?

Somebody did 10 minutes of Beastmaster gear research on FFXIcyclopedia prior to responding apparently. You seemed to miss the entire point of the post to instead make some pretty underinformed snipes. It's the best OVERALL piece of body gear available to BST at 75, which can benefit from every stat it has in one way or another to greater or lesser effect(maybe not the light resist, I'll concede that). Does it greatly benefit a party BST or a sky ls as a whole? Not really, but any solo BST worth his salt knows the amazing versatility and immediate benefits of having an Osode to solo in. It's the conjunction of ALL the stats together which make it a greatly useful piece to BST. This is why, BST's want Osodes, oh wise one

 

[Calais]

Give all the osodes to rng, bst, and brds no matter what. I still see melees TPing in osode when I go to merit and it pisses me off every single time.

 

[Rhaddy]

It's the best OVERALL piece of body gear available to BST at 75

Sorta disagree. But then again I never use bst/whm or carry around pet food anymore.

Again, stacking CHR is somewhat useless on bst as has been noted forever, and Apollo will make a bigger difference than adding +10 chr on top of +25 chr or whatever most people have around in charm gear. Having someone borrow my osode, I never noticed a difference in charming and just used AF2 body and got around the same resist rate (charm is dumb.) This was about with 20 chr and ocassionaly not really bothering to switch in Apollo either cause I wanted to keep TP for WS. With /Nin you really don't need to give a shit about mischarm unless you're doing high risk stuff like charming a korrigan with 10 other korrigans looking around. Also, you really don't need the +int to tame DC~T successfully, and if you're trying to get an IT for 2hr, its mostly luck than stats.

Reward... Uh... yeah I rarely use this, awesome it healed 400 hp and gives a regen effect. Oh cool, the mob just crit'd my pet for 1/2 of what i just healed, guess i'll wait another 5 minutes. Yeah it's good for capped stuff and that's about it?

If you're tanking with your pet, you're probably using /nin, and you probably shouldn't go out of your way to take hits and make use of the +vit and +agi. But whatever, I tank with my pet in haubs.

If I had no sky gear as BST, I'd go for haidate over osode first, as those are so useful for shadow recast and a bunch of ACC to boot.

 

[Bajaratt]

In a merit party? Definitely. Against gods and HNMs? Absolutely. Against the Ts/low VTs that a Bst tends to solo at 75? Not so much.

Hi, welcome to 2004. Osode was proved long ago to not be the best body piece for damage dealing, a hauby is far cheaper/easier to get and is far better for DoT and is about the same for weapon skills; that means it's better all around. Against an HNM, the +10 accuracy from Hauby/Hauberk would be even more important, especially given axe isn't A+ for BST.

BST is one of the jobs that actually gets a use out of it, no one is saying otherwise. All they're saying is that BST shouldn't be the top priority for the piece when other, more used endgame jobs can wear it. Definitely give it to a vet BST over a new player though.

 

[Skaw]

Max MP isn't useful during fights.

Max MP is useful before starting to solo, or when you need to rest, when you take in to consideration what you're going to cast.

250~ MP is enough for prefight buffs. Reraise, Protect and Shell II, and Stoneskin or Blink. I never bother with both Blink and Stoneskin, and just use whichever works best against the type of mob. Shadow Ignoring AEs = Stoneskin. All without needing to rest to continue casting.

Now, take in to consideration /heal time saved over the course of EXPing on BST, and you've accumulated a nice chunk of downtime eliminated.

Osode is good for everything but meleeing. Fortunantly for BST, they do a lot of outside combat activities that put it to good use.

 

[Reauland]

Hi, welcome to 2004. Osode was proved long ago to not be the best body piece for damage dealing, a hauby is far cheaper/easier to get and is far better for DoT and is about the same for weapon skills; that means it's better all around. Against an HNM, the +10 accuracy from Hauby/Hauberk would be even more important, especially given axe isn't A+ for BST.

Actually, I'm saying that Hauby is better DoT overall, most especially against anything considered VT+ to IT++, but if your axe merits and tp gear already have you on or near the acc floor against the Ts a Bst tends to fight, wouldn't they get more benefit from Osode than Hauby?

EDIT: Oh, btw . . . Axe isn't A+ for anyone else either, but mine is capped out at 285 just like any war's.

 

[Bajaratt]

Hauby still wins out with the attack and accuracy. Osode's only real place for damage dealing is with weapon skills; if you don't have a hauby/shura togi, it's a good piece but it's not the best.

 

[Dowzer]

Sorry for continuing to derail this thread. I have no advice to add on behalf of the BRDs.

I'm not sure why rng would want Kyudogi over Osode, 7 racc isn't going to do much of anything when the +80 racc you're wearing has almost no effect, and 10 STR is going to be better for ranged attacks than 2 Ratt (the 10 STR gives 5 Ratt).

Not to mention the MND+10 if using Holy Bolts.

Now, I'm not too sure if these next stats are correct. If someone could let me know, that'd be awesome.

DEX+10 — Acc/Crit rate?
AGI+10 — Rapid shot rate?