Kaizen "leadership"

[Lyall]

It only took the entire shell watching all day long to finally get some replies. You shouldn't need permission to defend your linkshell on a public forum.

I tagged along with Rone and you for some summoner burns, back before they were really known how to be performed. Was I grateful for it? Yessir, I was. Summoner exp is horrid to accumulate. But I was apparently in debt to you over it? I'm not sure how you repay someone for an alternative exp camp. The fact you're holding against me that I never "repaid" you is kind of... sad, really, and I don't mean pathetic with that term. You would begrudge a member of the linkshell because they had a job that also benefited you? You didn't need my summoner, you could have used anyone else. I'm pretty sure I killed mobs for you and Rone, I wasn't aware that I was somehow supposed to pay back you beyond doing my part. Are you referring to the burns I would get later? The ones I didn't organize and couldn't really invite people into? I'm sorry I couldn't do more to help, I guess, but don't make it sound like I took something from you when you got just as much exp as I did from the exchanges.

I mentioned gear being uncontested because it was made out like we (I, us, whomever) hawked over it and took it because we allegedly planned on quitting. I can't stress enough how ridiculous that is.

The reason I joined Kaizen initially was because you guys were an event shell. You did things I was interested in that I can't do with lower numbers or things I was personally unfamiliar with. My Limitless sponsorship is newly minted, and I never wanted to do HNMs, or open-air HNMs like Sandworm or DI. As for not wanting to AFK for potentially hours at Faf/Aspid/KB, I don't think anyone would begrudge me for wanting to do something productive during the time instead. This is a matter of personal preference, honestly, so it shouldn't honestly matter. I didn't join an HNM shell, I won't join an HNM shell, and when Kaizen was rather abruptly turned back into an HNM (allegedly) the choices were pretty clear; There wasn't a choice at all.

As for wearing the pearl constantly, aside from some incredibly-small-scale sky or sea farming, spontaneous events just didn't happen. On event days, I was always on the shell. Off event days, Kaizen was mostly full of AFK people not doing anything. Could spontaneous events happen? Yes. Did they happen in the year I was a part of the shell? Less than you're making it sound.

I didn't like the way the shell was going, and I did end up quitting when Gains pointed the "Conform or die" ultimatum at us. My list of problems is yes, Gains is an incapable leader who had no business making those sort of demands so suddenly. The fact she was basically called out of retirement to lead people she was disconnected with for a year after being banned for ALSO cheating was astounding. I heard you guys beat JoL the other day; I'm glad. Like I said, I like most of the people in that shell.

I know you guys will go your way, and I'm obviously on going on my own. I couldn't just sit by and keep my mouth shut, though. Anyone who knows me knows I'm passionate about things I enjoy, and after Gains basically threw us out because we didn't sign up to an HNM shell that suddenly thought they could do HNMs again stung. A lot. As someone (I won't spell his name right, I know it) put it earlier, suddenly finding out you are expendable sucks royally. This is mostly up just in case anyone from Midgardsormr was approached; Expect a cold, unfriendly environment wherein you're expected to not do anything outside of Kaizen. Kaizen has good people in it, but your PR sucks, and your demands are insane in this day and age regarding how easy most things in XI have become.

Lastly, I'm curious as to what you mean in that final sentence. I don't know what to expect regarding Limitless on Friday anymore, as I expect everyone from Kaizen will most likely be frowned upon for showing up to anything I lead (IF I'm still the leader, even) and I don't know what you mean about Ein. I don't run it. Professionally, I'm completely capable of working with people I don't like, and have proven such in the past, especially given the history Kohra and myself have going back to lolD. If you're implying that people in Kaizen no longer want to play nice, well, that's interesting.

 

[Dejavu]

I think his point is that with the shitstorm that you have created you may have just cheated Rampagesama out of his e body should you not be able to play nice but thats just speculation because neither myself or Truegrave are in that einherjar group. (and i say you cheated him out of it because if you would have just quietly quit kaizen instead of making this thread it would never have been an issue). As for your friday thing what i expect will happen is what several of the monday people have been asking for, for a long time in that we can now do Tazvania runs on Thursday without being accused of stealing members access from the friday runs which makes me very happy cause i have wanted to run 2 days a week for a while.

Have fun getting absorbed completely by LOLD and maybe just maybe they will let u keep some of the coins.

 

[Arthur]

Shouldn't effect dynamis at all. I really don't even know who is in Kaizen anymore though. Also, not sure what Kaizen has to do with you being sponser D= hopefully nothing changes.

 

[Lyall]

I think his point is that with the shitstorm that you have created you may have just cheated Rampagesama out of his e body should you not be able to play nice but thats just speculation because neither myself or Truegrave are in that einherjar group. (and i say you cheated him out of it because if you would have just quietly quit kaizen instead of making this thread it would never have been an issue). As for your friday thing what i expect will happen is what several of the monday people have been asking for, for a long time in that we can now do Tazvania runs on Thursday without being accused of stealing members access from the friday runs which makes me very happy cause i have wanted to run 2 days a week for a while.

Have fun getting absorbed completely by LOLD and maybe just maybe they will let u keep some of the coins.

Nothing I have said should have any effect on anyone that isn't me. Stay classy, Deja.

@Arthur
We'll have to see.

 

[Caelia]

Gotta agree with Arthur on this one.

 

[Arthur]

Going to be an intresting week indeed... I always thought it was Courtney decision on who sponsers next because we had to apply to court. But it does make sense if it is/war Kaizen leadership in general. Which im told it is. '_'.

 

[Mai Ikari]

If any of this Kaizen shit actually affects Limitless operations, that's going directly against what all of us have been told since day 1 about Kaizen / Limitless interactions. That they're separate shells with separate leadership decisions.

If Kaizen leadership feels the need to "get back" at Lyall over this flame by destroying friday Dynamis, I don't know what the fuck. I've got issues with them, but I trust them enough to not do that.

 

[somedude]

Have fun getting absorbed completely by LOLD and maybe just maybe they will let u keep some of the coins.

i don't think it is fair for LOLD to get pulled through the mudd. we rotate who buys glass, and buyer gets all the coins. we have done nothing but try and be fair. pls don't go around trying to tarnish our name when you have no clue what you are talking about. this has nothing to do with LOLD, keep us out of it.

 

[Truegrave]

I will make my last statement clear. The fact that you have brought this flame here, is saying you are airing your problems, which it should. What I am saying is that if those members of Kaizen, who are also in limitless, do not feel you work with the group, then how exactly do you plan to work with the group for groups gain? This is honestly none of my concern because I run my own Einherjar shell, I am just pointing out a situation that could and probably will arise.

In all regards, Limitless is its own entity, but when members of that entity do not get along with each other, you can have the same situation if people refuse to work together. Someone either A. gets the axe or B. You set aside petty bullshit and win.

 

[Caelia]

In all regards, Limitless is its own entity, but when members of that entity do not get along with each other, you can have the same situation if people refuse to work together.

From what I can tell the majority of the people tend to get along well on the Friday runs. And lolD has been nothing but helpful and hospitable.

 

[Javir]

There's nothing wrong with a "wear our pearl only" policy if it is communicated right and members are accepted under the pretense that this is a requirement. Different strokes for different folks. Sad to see a great group decline over the years even if the game is getting close to the end.

It happens in EVERY SINGLE game to many different teams though, not just with Kaizen. Eventually some dickwad is going to end up at the helm when old leadership isn't around anymore and shit like this happens. The only reason it's a flame here is because in this case it happened to a team that had build up a reputation as being one of the best. Sucks for everyone involved really- including mentioned clueless leadership. Not sure why people are so surprised here.

I'm shocked you even still post here offering leadership advice. Honestly knowing you quit leading the same shell twice just makes you seem like an unlikely positive source of guidance. Then again, I supposed you could have learned how to be a better leader without the jealousy issue since you quit on us in CK.

I successfully helped to guide what was CK to a graceful and dignified end via MaliciousIntent (no thanks to you or Moriarti), I've successfully colead a Limbus shell during Limbus' prime and when several groups had issues and I am one of a good group of leaders in an Einherjar shell. And despite this, I don't presume to give leadership advice when I'm not asked for it, or it doesn't directly involve an activity I'm involved in.

Ultimately, thank you for helping me get my start in end-game FFXI, and then for showing me by example what not to do.

@Deja, lots of stuff and don't wanna waste 30 minutes formatting:

Re: Limitless's leadership- We were shorthanded from the get-go, so if you're implying numbers dwindled because no one wanted to tough out a change-of-command, there's not a lot anyone can do about that.

Re: Kaizen's policy, the different bill of goods: You are correct, they were completely different sales pitches, but it doesn't mean they get to go back on their word overnight. Well, I guess they can, but they're scumbags for it.

Re: Rone leaving- Had nothing to do with us, Rone left because Ilana/Treg/Gains were refusing to listen to him. No one ran Rone out except for the leaders.

Re: Livvy avoiding us: Livvy is a too-proud stupid cunt with no reading comprehension skills.

No actually I called TG and asked him if he minded if I posted he told me "I’m not going to be able to stop you even if I did mind, so go for it," however that doesn’t mean that I am posting on his behalf

As for true not posting in this thread ... see post #23 in this thread

Gains over her head leading the shell, Sure I’m not gonna argue that

Ilana over his head leading the shell, He wouldn’t even argue that

I was in ventrilo the night that Rone quit Kaizen and was he screaming about Ilana and the other leaders… no not really he was having a bitchfit about NBers and how he finally couldn’t put up with you guys anymore and it was the last straw. You know one reason I know he wasn’t screaming about Ilana… because Ilana was in vent with us at the same time trying to tell him just to deal with it.

As for the calling Livvy a stupid cunt… I cant actually think of words to properly respond to that. Livvy is the best kind of person and if she is a "stupid cunt" towards you... you probably deserve it.

People misunderstand, it happens. But having gotten to know Livvy, I am sure there are a lot of things that she felt you had done to wrong her (directly or indirectly via some Kaizen issue). Now, you appear to be a fairly intelligent individual, but you defeat yourself.

Nothing I have said should have any effect on anyone that isn't me. Stay classy, Deja.

@Arthur
We'll have to see.

If you believed this, you wouldn't have posted anything. ok, maybe an initial post explaining your gripe. But the walls and walls of text tells me that you have a great deal of investment trying to get this to affect others that are not you. As a matter of fact you're blatantly calling out Kaizen members (as a whole not by individual). I don't think either side is winning, and what you fail to see is that Kaizen, by ultimately keeping an official stance of silence is going to win this. I've seen way too many "boo Kaizen" threads and have seen them survive to some extent. Obviously Kaizen isn't innocent, but obviously you're not either. Shouldn't that be good enough?

I do not say anywhere in my response that I am representing Kaizen. I am representing myself, so please do not use general terms for one person.

You're proving the point, though. You're a part of the same shell I used to be in, you were a part of the same policies I was, you were at the same events I was, yet you won't say anything in one direction or the other. Your silence is exactly what is expected whenever Kaizen gets mentioned in anything dramatic. The fact you HAVE been posting in this thread without commenting on the original topic is testament to Kaizen's refusal to do anything for their public image.

You could represent Kaizen but you have a standing gag order to never comment on anything that might make the shell look bad (worse). Inaction is still an action, every single officer has viewed this thread today, current and pre-existing, and every one of them bit their tongues. If I'm wrong, why didn't anyone come forward to plead their case?

There's a reason most people thought Kaizen didn't exist anymore. Outside of the shell, you don't.

Kaizen doesn't believe in validating nay-sayers. For better or worse, and ultimately it's worked out better for them. The one time this rule didn't hold was during the bannings and it nearly tore the shell asunder. Sounds like silence works, and it's going to drive you mad that they defy you, unless you just accept it and move along.

 

[Anaeran]

I'm shocked you even still post here offering leadership advice. Honestly knowing you quit leading the same shell twice just makes you seem like an unlikely positive source of guidance. Then again, I supposed you could have learned how to be a better leader without the jealousy issue since you quit on us in CK.

I successfully helped to guide what was CK to a graceful and dignified end via MaliciousIntent (no thanks to you or Moriarti), I've successfully colead a Limbus shell during Limbus' prime and when several groups had issues and I am one of a good group of leaders in an Einherjar shell. And despite this, I don't presume to give leadership advice when I'm not asked for it, or it doesn't directly involve an activity I'm involved in.

Ultimately, thank you for helping me get my start in end-game FFXI, and then for showing me by example what not to do.

I quit the game because I didn't enjoy the game. If you view that as quitting on you, then so be it. The only reason I came back the first time is because a good friend (Sosuke if anyone remembers the uber taru) had asked me to come back and rebuild CK.

I recall dealing with much of your whiney emo shit during my time here, as I often did with many people in FFXI. You were a good player but the emotional kid shit was annoying. Here you are showing the immaturity once again by attacking me as such in a thread that has nothing to do with me, MI or CK. From what I heard through the grapevine, MI didn't last very long. I can't imagine you handling a team yourself, but if you did well, good for you. I never wished anything but success for you and the rest of the old CK.

For whatever reason the crowd in this game was always more sensitive than the populations of other games I've played and it seems that is still the case. We enjoyed much success during my time in ffxi with a team that was probably more casual than it was hardcore. We weren't number one, no, but we weren't half bad for the types of players we were either. I don't have any problem admitting that I made many mistakes in leadership here, learned from them, and took it with me into other roles in other games. I don't regret playing with that team one bit.

I've run the same team in several different games since my FFXI days, so much of what I say isn't even coming from my experiences in FFXI. I offered up opinions on the subject here. From what I can tell, at least a few people enjoyed reading what I had to say. If you don't, well, it doesn't really matter much to me. If you want to flame me 6 and a half years after I've been done with this game because you're still butthurt about my departure, this thread probably isn't the place to do it.

 

[neophytal]

this is probably one of 3 times I've logged into qcdn within a year, and I got quoted. tight.

 

[jyakotsu]

Deja I think that any insinuation that Kaizen will pinch Limitless is in bad taste. If TG really does that on thursday to affect fridays run... it is in really poor taste honestly. If monday's run wants to run tavnazia, then honestly they should do it on mondays without affecting people that are in friday's run(who did nothing in this situation). I myself am not in limitless, nor do I lead LolD anymore, however I believe that trying to eat your own limb is in bad taste.

I really hope that TG and the rest of leadership in monday's run has a better conscience than that.

If you are doing thursday tavnazia on your own accord, you already insinuated that it was to get back at lyall. Good job at that one buddy.

 

[naue]

kaizen was always a lulshell after neyla left...good read tho interesting to hear people still actually care about what is going on in this game

 

[Arthur]

From what I can tell the majority of the people tend to get along well on the Friday runs. And lolD has been nothing but helpful and hospitable.

I think he ment Limitless and Kaizen. Not limitless and LolD. Anyone whos apart of the group knows its been nothing but fair for a while now.

 

[neophytal]

kaizen was always a lulshell after neyla left...good read tho interesting to hear people still actually care about what is going on in this game

uhhhhh you mean nasya? lol.

 

[bigbroon]

I'm shocked you even still post here offering leadership advice. Honestly knowing you quit leading the same shell twice just makes you seem like an unlikely positive source of guidance. Then again, I supposed you could have learned how to be a better leader without the jealousy issue since you quit on us in CK.

I successfully helped to guide what was CK to a graceful and dignified end via MaliciousIntent (no thanks to you or Moriarti), I've successfully colead a Limbus shell during Limbus' prime and when several groups had issues and I am one of a good group of leaders in an Einherjar shell. And despite this, I don't presume to give leadership advice when I'm not asked for it, or it doesn't directly involve an activity I'm involved in.

Ultimately, thank you for helping me get my start in end-game FFXI, and then for showing me by example what not to do.





People misunderstand, it happens. But having gotten to know Livvy, I am sure there are a lot of things that she felt you had done to wrong her (directly or indirectly via some Kaizen issue). Now, you appear to be a fairly intelligent individual, but you defeat yourself.



If you believed this, you wouldn't have posted anything. ok, maybe an initial post explaining your gripe. But the walls and walls of text tells me that you have a great deal of investment trying to get this to affect others that are not you. As a matter of fact you're blatantly calling out Kaizen members (as a whole not by individual). I don't think either side is winning, and what you fail to see is that Kaizen, by ultimately keeping an official stance of silence is going to win this. I've seen way too many "boo Kaizen" threads and have seen them survive to some extent. Obviously Kaizen isn't innocent, but obviously you're not either. Shouldn't that be good enough?






Kaizen doesn't believe in validating nay-sayers. For better or worse, and ultimately it's worked out better for them. The one time this rule didn't hold was during the bannings and it nearly tore the shell asunder. Sounds like silence works, and it's going to drive you mad that they defy you, unless you just accept it and move along.

I have to disagree with the bolded. To say anything should happen in a different shell with some members in common because of this is, as has already been said, tasteless, and to say it should be expected is naive. People have gripes with other people all the time, it doesn't mean the shell can't function properly. Flaming something you feel you need to air publicly shouldn't have any influence on the actions of a different shell. I have, however, played this game, and meeting or hearing about some of the characters who play, it wouldn't surprise me if there are some unsavoury repercussions to follow.

 

[Truegrave]

Deja I think that any insinuation that Kaizen will pinch Limitless is in bad taste. If TG really does that on thursday to affect fridays run... it is in really poor taste honestly. If monday's run wants to run tavnazia, then honestly they should do it on mondays without affecting people that are in friday's run(who did nothing in this situation). I myself am not in limitless, nor do I lead LolD anymore, however I believe that trying to eat your own limb is in bad taste.

I really hope that TG and the rest of leadership in monday's run has a better conscience than that.

If you are doing thursday tavnazia on your own accord, you already insinuated that it was to get back at lyall. Good job at that one buddy.

The majority of Monday run members do not attend Friday's. As to the Tav runs those have always been talked about and will be talked about. If members don't show up for Friday runs, why is it undermining the Friday if I do a run with friends? I fail to see how that decision is even in the least bit in spite.

 

[rampagesama]

The majority of Monday run members do not attend Friday's. As to the Tav runs those have always been talked about and will be talked about. If members don't show up for Friday runs, why is it undermining the Friday if I do a run with friends? I fail to see how that decision is even in the least bit in spite.

If it was always talked about, and it never had any bearing on friday's Limitlesss Dynamis, then why is this suddenly a possibility now?