PLD job and Native provoke ability

[Elemmire]

That's all for naught anyway. /nin offers the best damage mitigation out of any sub.

at the loss of a shield? Shield abilities and such seems pretty useful for a pally. Or do you mean just using the ninjutsu? I dunno.. I'd say PLD/RDM is prolly better.

 

[dedalius]

Just using Utsusemi. Ours generally use Mas+1/whatevershieldtheywant. That of course is for HNMs, for EXP dual wield, since hate doesn't really matter.

 

[Ruffyreborn]

Been done on nidhogg before. Mage jobs that complain about mp sponging are not always people who don't do their job. Play a mage job.

I have played a mage job (not as extensively as others) but I get the gist of it. Ive had mages turn down PT invited because I have a PLD tank. Their reason is "lol mp sponge, no thanks"

Thats just retarded. And no one can deny that. But on the WAR subject. People have been babied too much in this game. They only believe a single, or two certain setups will only work. (kind of one of the reasons I made my BLU healing topic) Just like with NIN. You can guarantee that if a NIN is lfp as a DD, then they will not get invites. Ridiculous.

 

[Romper]

Come on! PLD/BLU, Caccoon spam GOOO. There could be so many cool SJ applications with this. @_@

I was hoping SE would put in the JA provoke, I would so level Paladin then. Unfortunately not, I guess.

Stuns with flash in haste build ontop of cocoon n metallic skin. Prolly the best sub if pld got its own provoke. PLD/DRK for stun/flash in haste set up could be a close 2nd/3rd. PLD/NIN blink n take hits probably 2nd. PLD/RDM 5th SS blink phalanx dispel en-spells. PLD/WHM 4th SS blink phalanx erase -nas bars curagas. PLD/BRD could have worked if mazerka didnt get gimped. PLD/BLM idk. PLD/MNK HP boost VIT boost could work some how.

Edit: My MNK is only 32 but I changed to pld/mnk the vit difference between war n mnk is 3 points and HP is 22 points difference slight increases in both. Tim get your pld to 75 I dont feel like leveling mnk 5 levels and tell us if there is a notable difference of 75PLD/37MNK

 

[Svina]

I have played a mage job (not as extensively as others) but I get the gist of it. Ive had mages turn down PT invited because I have a PLD tank. Their reason is "lol mp sponge, no thanks"

They are partying with PLDs who sit on their MP then. I can practically main heal with all this new refresh stuff PLDs get. And me main healing as a PLD = not losing hate, especially if I heal with my enmity gear-swap on.

A mage that don't wanna party with a PLD does not know what they are missing. They can spam spells a lot more without pulling hate ;p

 

[Skaw]

at the loss of a shield? Shield abilities and such seems pretty useful for a pally. Or do you mean just using the ninjutsu? I dunno.. I'd say PLD/RDM is prolly better.

Who says that because you're subbing Ninja that you have to Dual Wield? I would think Paladin would be better off using a Tatami as /NIN to try and get Intimidations to prolong Utsusemi. Or for the rare Paladin, Aegis to just laugh between Utsusemi recasts.

 

[Elemmire]

Who says that because you're subbing Ninja that you have to Dual Wield? I would think Paladin would be better off using a Tatami as /NIN to try and get Intimidations to prolong Utsusemi. Or for the rare Paladin, Aegis to just laugh between Utsusemi recasts.

I made the assumption that most go "SUB NIN FOR DUAL WIELD LAWL!" And then I asked about the ninjutsu itself... I still think a PLD/RDM would be better off though.

 

[Svina]

I made the assumption that most go "SUB NIN FOR DUAL WIELD LAWL!" And then I asked about the ninjutsu itself... I still think a PLD/RDM would be better off though.

Depends on how well you know how to use /RDM for hate and damage mitigation.

One difficult thing to do as a pld really is level enhancing magic... which would be a huge determinant in how well /RDM works for them. Unless of course, you already have RDM levelled and capped enhancing

 

[Elemmire]

I have that Enfeebling and Enhancing were so easy to cap as a Red Mage (duh)

 

[Mariox]

If PLD should get provoke, RDm should get sleepga and sleepga 2. (sleepga without having to sub blm)

 

[Romper]

Not to mention other RPGs lol.

Anyways. Curious. Do you higher level PLDs have any use for the other /WAR JAs? I find myself only using provoke, and maybe on occasion I'll use Beserk before a WS, though most of the time I forget to do this; does it even help? I read it on a guide somewhere. I've also read in guides where they discourage the use the other JAs provided with /WAR.

Rampart + Warcry= Lots of hate. AoE buffs stacked is something that really works well. There isn't shit we can do about losing hate to DDs 65+. I didn't have that problem though until 70s.

 

[Kalefury]

From my experince, after maxing merits on Chivalry, Guardian, and Sentinle recast time. i can keep hate pretty well without the use of provoke. but i do still sub it in most cases outside of exp parties. usually cause some blm that loves to over nuke then run in circles with the mob casing them cough*darthyoda*cough is always around. but yeah, i am waiting for that one day i can walk out of my MH as a PLD/Mnk

 

[Westyle]

 

[Kelyon]

its still funny!

 

[Skaw]

[xIMG]http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y35/BR_Trooper/hotdog.gif[/IMG]

It's nice that they did a PHF marathon tonight, but why did they have to fuck it up with their April Fools translations and grainy picture. I'm sure people who only watch it for Anime were pissed off enough that they couldn't see their shows, but those of us that couldn't care less have to suffer as well?

 

[Eulore]

I made the assumption that most go "SUB NIN FOR DUAL WIELD LAWL!" And then I asked about the ninjutsu itself... I still think a PLD/RDM would be better off though.

Not even close for 90% of the mobs in the game. You use koenig shield (or kaiser/aegis) most of the time because it has the best damage mitigation as well as hot stats. Ninjutsu isn't used at all, except for utsusemi. You keep hate with spamming flash (you really need haste and 1-2 marches for it to work well) and self-curing. You don't get hit, so long as the mob has elegy and slow, and when you do you don't take much damage because of the whole pld thing. The only situation I could see pld/rdm being better for is something like ouryu where shadows aren't insanely easy to get up and JoL where the mob doesn't really physically attack you. For JoL it's actually one of the best job combos (in theory) imo because of the MDB, Phalanx, Stoneskin, and the spells flash, bind, sleep, dispel, and I think blind all cause decent amounts of hate and can be spammed with the right amount of refresh (can get up to +8mp/tic, +9 if you use vermy).

 

[reddogneo]

I recently pted with a pld/nin in xp pt and found then to be really effective. pld/nin would need mostly DD gear and some def and vit gear in case shadows went down or something. He was hitting like 300-900 dmg vorpal blades farley consistanly not that along with there skill they help hate just like or maybe better than a pld/war

 

[Skaw]

(can get up to +8mp/tic, +9 if you use vermy).

You can get more than that. Don't forget Evoker's Roll.

 

[Tomasello]

I recently leveled nin to 57 just to be able to equip hocho lol and for some reason people tend not to mention, and maybe its just implied, the the act of casting utsusemi on oneself generates decent hate. Sometimes I would turn a mob just by casting a shadow so I'm sure that helps pld/nin alot if there hasted, etc.

I also noticed I generated more hate when my tools went unresisted (enfeebles and elemental) versus if I casted hojo for example and it resisted. Significately more. Same with pld when using spells. For hate purposes, if the spell your going to cast has no chance of landing either ninjitsu or mp, I don't think its worth wasting the mp to generate hate. Good spells to use regardless of skill that rarely resist are things like Stun, Flash, Dispel, Cure etc.

I know some people think differently but this is just what I noticed.

I haven't seen it yet but Nin/drk spamming a capped skill San elemental Wheel with stuns and utsusemi in between must be phenominal.

I also agree making Utsusemi: Ni level 38 in order to give plds their own provoke as someone else suggested would really put the balance back into this game for tanks and open up the job to a variety of subs. It would also help SE with the /nin problem they seem to have with all the melee. The boosted SAM, as a sub for 2 handed weapons, attempt has clearly failed.

 

[neophytal]

I also noticed I generated more hate when my tools went unresisted (enfeebles and elemental) versus if I casted hojo for example and it resisted. Significately more. Same with pld when using spells. For hate purposes, if the spell your going to cast has no chance of landing either ninjitsu or mp, I don't think its worth wasting the mp to generate hate. Good spells to use regardless of skill that rarely resist are things like Stun, Flash, Dispel, Cure etc.

thats because tools only generate noticable amount of hate if they land really. resisted doesnt do much if anything at all.

I know some people think differently but this is just what I noticed.

they are retards if they dont know that.

I haven't seen it yet but Nin/drk spamming a capped skill San elemental Wheel with stuns and utsusemi in between must be phenominal.

negative. sans cast WAY too much time for the extra minimal damage to make it worth, so, disagreed.

I also agree making Utsusemi: Ni level 38 in order to give plds their own provoke as someone else suggested would really put the balance back into this game for tanks and open up the job to a variety of subs. It would also help SE with the /nin problem they seem to have with all the melee. The boosted SAM, as a sub for 2 handed weapons, attempt has clearly failed.

itd really suck for support healers, if they really did make ni lvl38.