THE Election 2008 Megathread!

Who are you voting for?

  • McCain

    Votes: 31 26.3%

  • Obama

    Votes: 77 65.3%

  • Other

    Votes: 10 8.5%
  • Total voters
    118
  • Poll closed .
Brightblade said:
I have a buddy on welfare and now hes never gonna get a job (his words, not mine) because the gov't is handing him free money. Hes voting for Obama because he'll be ok with him in office. He has 2 kids and only ever had a job for about 5 months of his entire life. Does he think its fair for his friends to basically be paying for his food and shelter? No. Does he have it as tough as me anymore now that hes on welfare? Nope, he has cable he has more food in his fridge then I do. Is that fair?
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Your friend is a fucking lazy leech who abuses the system, stop thinking that everyone who is for Obama is just as lazy as him.
 
Sabia said:
My sister's first child was born at 2lbs 12 oz and was in NICU for over a month complete with multiple blood transfusions, an 80% heart failure, a move to another hospital amongst a various myriad of other health problems. If her health care hadn't of been covered by the Canadian government my children's children would be paying off her health bills - but obviously we weren't 'trying hard enough' because it's totally my family's fault that we wouldn't of been able to afford the 50k+ a day that it was costing to keep her alive and it's definitely my sister's fault for having a premie baby.

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Sometimes life deals you a shitty hand and I don't mind paying a bit of money every month to make sure these people have the basic right to life and quality of that life. I find it very mind boggling that some people value their money over the lives of their neighbors....

Oh and as far as education...



taken from : http://kapio.kcc.hawaii.edu/upload/fullnews.php?id=52

Oh and my 82 year old grandma fell earlier this week and had shoulder replacement surgery yesterday that she would of never been able to afford.... Go go healthcare!
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You know I'm gonna sound like an asshole here, but is gotta be said. You said "Sometimes life deals you a shitty hand". Sometimes people are meant to die. Thats rough, but its a fact of life. Theres people in 3rd world countries that die everyday for things like your sisters child had or your grandmother. I'm glad they're ok, but if I had cancer right now, which I might, I dont have the money to pay for it and I will not ask my parents for help. I wont even tell them until its too late so they can't do anything. Helping your neighbors is one thing. Giving anything to anyone just because i have it and you don't is a retarded policy of lazy people.
 
Mirewen said:
Your friend is a fucking lazy leech who abuses the system, stop thinking that everyone who is for Obama is just as lazy as him.
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I don't, but thats who Obamas playing to. And with that I'm done here for now. I'm getting a little angrier then I should be.
 
Brightblade said:
I don't, but thats who Obamas playing to. And with that I'm done here for now. I'm getting a little angrier then I should be.
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No, that's just who McCain says Obama is playing to. Obama's plan effects those who fall under a certain income level (under $250k/year).
 
In your opinion, to others he's trying to stop the repetitive cycle of people that need help not getting it because they can't afford it and rich people getting "handouts" to keep them supporting, sound familiar?

Just because you know one asshole that takes advantage, does not mean there aren't millions who actually need it. Working families that have 2 wages that can't make ends meet, single people that can't pay rent because it is hard when you only have 1 income. Not everyone is lazy.

What government is it that your friend is under right now?..
 
Brightblade said:
You know I'm gonna sound like an asshole here, but is gotta be said. You said "Sometimes life deals you a shitty hand". Sometimes people are meant to die. Thats rough, but its a fact of life. Theres people in 3rd world countries that die everyday for things like your sisters child had or your grandmother. I'm glad they're ok, but if I had cancer right now, which I might, I dont have the money to pay for it and I will not ask my parents for help. I wont even tell them until its too late so they can't do anything. Helping your neighbors is one thing. Giving anything to anyone just because i have it and you don't is a retarded policy of lazy people.
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Sometimes you're in a position to help someone who is less fortunate than you. I'm floored that you think that all that money isn't worth this;

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but I'm going to have to disagree. Life > Money. Oh and my Aunt is a 3 year breast cancer survivor - more treatment she wouldn't of been able to afford. Oy I don't even think I can talk to someone as cold as you, I just can't wrap my head around the fact that you value money more than life...


Edited to ad that Health care isn't the only reason I support Obama. I think he'll be better for the economy (thank god), will deal with your never ending war (iraq) and properly deal with the war that was abandoned to the rest of the world to take care of (Afghanistan). I also see him being more respectful to minorities (Hi New Orleans) and not relying so heavily on religion make decisions his government policies. He also gave a very clear and great answer on the abortion issue which is something nice to hear. He sounds like he wants to give Americans more rights in their lives (ie Gay marriage, birth control and abortion). He picked a running mate that has experience in areas that he's admitted to not being as confident in rather than some back-water hick who thinks it's cool to have a grizzly skin on your couch and shoot wolves from planes among a few things....

I know in the end he's just another politician but after 8 years of disaster lead by Bush and the Republican party that the rest of the world has had to put up with, it'll be refreshing to try something different.
 
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Mirewen said:
I lol’d. Yes, that’s what the world wants. We want America to fail. That wont effect us in the slightest! I worked in the tourism industry for nearly 4 years in Victoria, BC. A city where about 75% of employment relies on tourism. When our dollar went up with respect to the American dollar, our tourism suffered because Americans could not afford to travel here anymore, that meant massive lay offs in the industry to try to cope with it.

Stop with the paranoia, the world needs America to succeed because it effects us all.
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I've seen the sentiment coming from more than just a few handfuls of people out and about. I'm glad you got a lol. I was more or less pointing to the fact that American industry is flocking to the East in droves, and with higher taxes we won't be able to compete. Thats the reason Joe Factory Worker isn't doing so hot and can't afford health care, because Joe Business Owner doesn't have a good paying job for him anymore.

But you are all absolutley correct, giving handouts to the "less fortunate" will help fix everything. I mean, lets take Canadian health care for instance. It's near perfect, isn't it? (No, it's not horrible, but it is in no way better than American health care.)

You can call me paranoid, I really don't mind. I've seen and heard enough to see my views validated, and I have nothing to prove to any of you.

I also never said Canadians in specific want to see America fail, nor specifically anyone in the tourism industry, which naturally hinges on foreign dollars. (duh) I was talking about those in specific who do indeed stand to make profits from the failure of our industries. Take a look at all the countries who have lower tax rates for business, and look at how they will be "struggling". Take a look at all the behind the scenes mergers and aquisitions being made by European companies absorbing or buying out American companies.

When it comes down to it, I want a president who is looking out for whats best for me, as an American. Otherwise, I would have stayed in Montreal. :spiteful:
 
The right has long been painting the picture of welfare recipients as lazy, meth-addicted, single moms who have more kids for more welfare. This is not the norm. Stop buying into that bullshit they’ve fed you and do a little research.

Didn’t “Joe-the-Plumber” admit to receiving welfare at one point? And he’s afraid of Obama "redistributing the wealth"? Wtf…
 
Cerato said:
The right has long been painting the picture of welfare recipients as lazy, meth-addicted, single moms who have more kids for more welfare. This is not the norm. Stop buying into that bullshit they’ve fed you and do a little research.

Didn’t “Joe-the-Plumber” admit to receiving welfare at one point? And he’s afraid of Obama "redistributing the wealth"? Wtf…
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The funny thing is, is that he'd actually benefit more under Obama than he would under McCain... at least according to the reports I've heard from NPR.
 
Cerato said:
The right has long been painting the picture of welfare recipients as lazy, meth-addicted, single moms who have more kids for more welfare. This is not the norm. Stop buying into that bullshit they’ve fed you and do a little research.

Didn’t “Joe-the-Plumber” admit to receiving welfare at one point? And he’s afraid of Obama "redistributing the wealth"? Wtf…
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Dunno if you are talking to me, but I'm gonna assume you are if that's okay.

Welfare recipients come from all colours, races, and backgrounds. The idea of welfare is beautiful, but even you can admit that it is taken advantage of grossly by a large part of the population it serves.

The fact of the matter is, if people take care of themselves, and hold themselves finacially responsible, then they wouldn't find themselves in need to begin with. Sure, screw ups would happen, and that's when welfare shines, to take care of those who are down on thier luck. But damn, when you look back 4, 5 years later and you haven't bettered yourself... it's time to cut the ties.

Today, I can honestly say up until now, if you are willing and able to work, you can find work to support yourself and your family. It took some effort, but that's the scary part right?

Tomorrow... well, we may very well all be dependant on some kind of welfare, since the jobs won't be out there anymore to be had.


Oh, and here is some food for thought. With a student loan still on the books, a house payment, and the daily ins and outs of life, I live technically worse than a person on welfare. And I couldn't be happier that I didn't need Uncle Sam to hold my hand. You know how I did it? I went without. I don't have a new car. I don't wear Gucci. And I haven't bred any children yet, because I know I can't pay for them. My neighbor owns a house the same size as mine, drives a nicer car, and his girlfriend sits at home all day and watches her kids and his. (5 total) He works part time at a car wash, and collects welfare and food stamps. I work a full time job and a part time job on the weekends, and my girl works full time as well so we can make the bills. Now I want you to disect that and tell me how it's fair in any way.

I suppose we should just get fired from our jobs and collect the welfare, since there is really no advantage in trying to get ahead the right way, eh?
 
Sabia said:
You know...when he needs it.
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Exactly. I'm not against welfare. I'm against people who exploit it. It can get damn easy to sit back and be lazy as long as the cheque is coming in.... Major respect to the people who needed it, used it properly, and got off it when they could stand on thier own again.


Edit:

But back the the whole Obama thing. He won't be a horrible president, because a lot of the things he's trying to get done simply won't go through, with that silly little thing called checks and balances. He's a great speaker, and a very intelligent man. Also, I am hopeful that if he did begin to see his policies being a detriment to our country, I belive he wouldn't "stay the course" like everyone's favourite republican.

I am not a fan of his tax proposals. I am not a fan of his socialist background. I am not a fan of some of the people he has a history of being close with. But McCain and Palin are not the answer, clearly. I'll be voting Independant on the 4th, for what it's worth, and I know that no matter what happens, I have my own exit strategy if the proverbial shit does hit the fan in this country.
 
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Mirewen said:
Just because you know one asshole that takes advantage, does not mean there aren't millions who actually need it. Working families that have 2 wages that can't make ends meet, single people that can't pay rent because it is hard when you only have 1 income. Not everyone is lazy.
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I'm cynical and I go the other way. The few who are deserving are far outweighed by the users and abusers. This country has become lazy. Everyone feels entitled and wants the government to give them more. If universal health care is instituted in this country it will be abused to the point that it is unusable. Everybody will rush to the hospital for their entitled service and people who actually need hospital care will literally be dying in the streets because of the congestion and wait. Health care is already out there! You can go out and buy health insurance on your own! My father sells insurance for a living and for $240/month, you can cover an entire family! Sure, $240 is a lot you say, and that seems to be a knee-jerk reaction from a lot of people. But seriously, I see it all the damn time. People "can't" afford it, but I'm sure that if you add up all the money up that is spent on cigarettes, alcohol, cell phones, computers, internet, cable/sat TV, pets, etc. That money can easily be found! and not only that, but (unless McLame wins) that money spent is tax deductible too! and YES I know there are people that are too poor to have those extras and thus can't afford health insurance, but that is why we need to lower the bar, not raise it! Lower it to the point where only those that are truly indigent get the help that they need. Sorry, but I fear that this line of health care thinking is exactly the type of thought that got us into the current housing problems with the "every american in a home" policies.

I am sorry sabs, but I am one of those that you mentioned that is on the fence. I HATE them both! Obama is just a little too slick for my tastes. Like was mentioned, he answers everything very vaguely. I agree we need change, but tell me HOW we are going to change it, not all change is good. He has run a very slick campaign as well, he tells everyone what they want to hear without actually saying anything. He has run a subtlely ruthless campaign too.

There are two ads that stand out in my mind. One is the constant line of how McCain voted with Bush 90% of the time. Ok, I'm not exactly fond of W, but just how much of his more unpopular policies were actually votable? I know the declaration of War one, but most were on board for that at the time. Aside from that? How often did Obama vote against Bush policies? A lot of his voting is basically "I am here". Seriously, Bush sucks ass, but that does not by itself mean that McCain will. McCain just didn't grow up the same way that W did. Since I mentioned the war, I have to briefly say that while I HATE the fact that we are in Iraq, we can not just pull out, It will have worse repercussions in the long run if the region is not stablized. You can't just rub flea shampoo on a dog then walk away without washing it off...

The other ad that baffles me is where McCain gives tax breaks to companies that ship jobs over seas. Ok, what companies? Seriously. The only thing I can think of is giving breaks to the big three auto makers, who yes, also have over seas operations.

Which ties in well with how I think of McLame. I'm sorry, but the fucker can't even run a competant campaign, how can he run the country? Seriously, a lot of the attacks made on him are very shallow and could be easily rebuked, but he doesn't do it! Look at his choice of VP! You can look in this very thread and see how I felt the day she was announced. He wants a woman VP? Fine, but there are much more qualified woman out there to pick! At any rate, choosing any VP for the simple fact of trying to win votes is fundementally a bad idea in my opinion.

So yes, I am on the fence. I am choosing between a guy who's eagerness to please the voting masses and socialistic tendancies could lead this country to sink even farther down and a guy that seems to be an odd genetic mutation of Kerry, Quale and Bush Sr. ARGH! I look back on past elections and think specifically on 1996 and wonder what this country would be like today if Dole had won. The man had great ideas and strong ethics and was smart as a whip. The knock on him was he was presented as kind of a hard ass, and came off as such until the pressure of the election was off and he could concentrate on Visa commercials. Seriously though, if he takes office in 96, the housing crisis is no where near as bad today. Osama is probably a non-issue, and certainly W does not get into office in 2000...
 
alanon said:
You can go out and buy health insurance on your own! My father sells insurance for a living and for $240/month, you can cover an entire family! Sure, $240 is a lot you say, and that seems to be a knee-jerk reaction from a lot of people. But seriously, I see it all the damn time. People "can't" afford it, but I'm sure that if you add up all the money up that is spent on cigarettes, alcohol, cell phones, computers, internet, cable/sat TV, pets, etc. That money can easily be found! and not only that, but (unless McLame wins) that money spent is tax deductible too!
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Kinda like what I typed in bold. Be finacially responsible, and live to your means!
 
Phew, you guys are too fast and I'm trying to work while keeping up, but alas I cannot. Still, I had to respond to this.

alanon said:
....an odd genetic mutation of Kerry, Quale and Bush Sr. ARGH! ...
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Now THAT'S the stuff nightmares are made of *shudder*
 
I respect where you're coming from Al but there's one insanely crazy batshit decision breaker for me - Palin.
 
You mean McCain's current strategy?

Edited but still slightly NSFW
Spoiler:
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