WHM Melee

Phraust said:
Welp. I can tell you as somewhat of an expert. An A+ decked out melee Whm versus a same class of thief, the thief does almost 2x the damage, and that's not on EXP mobs, not EP's per se either.

Is it worth it? Yes
Is it fun? Yes
Would it be viable in a merit pt? If it was a Brd, Cor and 4 Whms sure.

What's the best settup?

Clubs:
1) Perdu/Antares. Speed wiht standard WHM gear, you swing faster than a decked out thief.
2) Morgenstern/Perdu. Awesom combo, Morgenstern is really slow and the 6% crit only affects the first hit on WS.
3) Perdu/Templar. Good combo added bonus of cure potency.

Builds:

Haste:
Turbo turban
Prudence Torque or Peacock Charm
Brutal Earring
Suppanomimi

Goliard Sao or Noble's Tunic, refresh is hard to pass up, even for 4% haste.
Blessed Mitts
Rajas Ring
Sniper Ring of some sort.

Altruistic Cape, or Boxer's mantle. Honestly see no diff in evade rate.
Swift belt
Blessed Trousers
Blessed pumps

WS
Marduk Tiara
Prudence Torque or Peacock Charm
Merman's Earring (Brutal's high risk of deminished returns on a 6 hit)
Merman's Earring

Tabin Jupon +1
Healer's Mitts +1
Aqua Ring
Aqua Ring

Prism Cape
Potent Belt
Blessed Trousers
Marduk Crackows

Merits:
Club 8/8
Divine 8/8
Enfeeb 8/8
Crit 4/4
Spell Interupt 4/4

One thing Whm does get over a lot of the melee is a shit tone of Haste gear, and access to thier own Haste spell. Turban, Belt, Body, Gloves, Pants, and Feet, all NQ get you 23, get any 2 HQ and you're capped. add on Haste, and you get a 40% delay in attack rounds, that's solo. From a base including the DW bonus thats a 66% increase in attacks. suddenly that 10.83/8.57 DPS club combo starts looking a little better. Throw in some really decent 298 skill enfeebles, stoneskin, flash, cures, and you got a decent settup for Whm.

I personally always wanted to try the melee Whm thing out in an actual parsed 'for real' merit pt, but the person that's good at it, and owns the above described character(sans Goliard Sao and some enfeeble gear) knows better than to waste a merit slot like that.

Honestly you gotta just play it smart. If you like that playstyle set up a group to do it. But a Melee Whm to level up is a really hard thing. There's a lot gaps between damaging clubs as you progress those gaps are less frequent, but the clubs you get are either really slow or really low damage, either way, a bad thing. In short I don't reccomend it, it willl make you a little loopy in the end. Enjoy your melee on the side, don't ruin it by making it the theme of the job.
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Quick question

Wouldn't
BellicoseMantle.jpg


be better then

Altruistic_Cape.png


for TPing in, and

Reverendmail.png


be better then

Tabin_jupon_plus_1.jpg


to WS in?
 
I'd take the Jupon +1 personally, it's only 2 acc loss for a gain in a Primary modifier and no loss to a secondary (not that those matter much). That's just me though.
 
Neisan said:
I'd take the Jupon +1 personally, it's only 2 acc loss for a gain in a Primary modifier and no loss to a secondary (not that those matter much). That's just me though.
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I was under the impression that 2 DEX = 1.5 ACC when two-handing, but only 1 ACC when one-handing (at least according to http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/DEX).

You could very well be right in that Jupon +1 > Reverend, but if it was me, I'd want to stack as much ACC+ gear on as possible to make sure all 6 hits connect, then begin tweaking equipment swaps to find the right balance of ACC, STR, & MND.
 
I see what you're saying - I think. Probably also depends on target mob though.
 
Don't use Reverend Mail for WS. I swap in O-hat and put on my Blessed Briault for the Mind bonus. The Mind -5 isn't important and the O-hat offsets the Reverend mail accuracy. Plus I don't miss too often anyway since I'm usually not fighting too many IT++'s. Though, I've managed to get a few licks in dynamis at one point XD

Only reason I say blessed briault is practicality when not meleeing so you aren't dropping too much money into a melee whm. Really, it should be more of a hobby for whm to melee. It's definitely not a job.
 
Kotsu said:
Don't use Reverend Mail for WS. I swap in O-hat and put on my Blessed Briault for the Mind bonus. The Mind -5 isn't important and the O-hat offsets the Reverend mail accuracy. Plus I don't miss too often anyway since I'm usually not fighting too many IT++'s. Though, I've managed to get a few licks in dynamis at one point XD

Only reason I say blessed briault is practicality when not meleeing so you aren't dropping too much money into a melee whm. Really, it should be more of a hobby for whm to melee. It's definitely not a job.
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Do the 20% modifiers really help that much, or is HS more similar to Asuran Fists (with 10% mods) which, from what I've read, give you better returns throwing on +ATK and +ACC rather than +STR and +VIT. Or is it more similar to Rampage (with 30% mods) in that you should have a healthy mix of +ATK, +ACC, +STR, and, to a lesser extent, +DEX (which is not a mod)?

Or is shit just situational?
 
Well, it's always situational in my opinion. I don't need as much accuracy gear on EP-EM mobs really. I can tank Ose Easily too assuming I have the echo's to burn and I land slow/paralyze on his ass and if shit gets real tough I can always repose him.

Basically, I use a mix of everything. My WS set up is: Martial Wand - Templar Mace : Holy Ampulla (Mind) - O Hat (Acc) - Chivalrous Chain (Str + Acc), Coral Earring x 2 (Att+), Blessed Briault (if I don't need acc, for hexa strike mind build) or Errant Houpelande (if I'm using Black Halo, Mind and Int mods), Blessed mitts (If you get Healer's Mitts +1 from Limbus; use that instead of these), Rajas Ring, Uthulams Ring, Red Cape +1 (Mind mod for Hexa, Mind/Int mod for Black Halo), Potent Belt (Acc and Str mod), Blessed slacks and feet (mind mod).

I have broken 1k multiple times on Torama's while camping Ose, I dunno if that's good or not. I have crit hit rate merits (2x) and no club merits or mind merits. I have 1 or 2 str merits I think, I don't really remember. Haven't logged in to do melee whm in over a month.
 
Kotsu said:
Well, it's always situational in my opinion. I don't need as much accuracy gear on EP-EM mobs really. I can tank Ose Easily too assuming I have the echo's to burn and I land slow/paralyze on his ass and if shit gets real tough I can always repose him.

Basically, I use a mix of everything. My WS set up is: Martial Wand - Templar Mace : Holy Ampulla (Mind) - O Hat (Acc) - Chivalrous Chain (Str + Acc), Coral Earring x 2 (Att+), Blessed Briault (if I don't need acc, for hexa strike mind build) or Errant Houpelande (if I'm using Black Halo, Mind and Int mods), Blessed mitts (If you get Healer's Mitts +1 from Limbus; use that instead of these), Rajas Ring, Uthulams Ring, Red Cape +1 (Mind mod for Hexa, Mind/Int mod for Black Halo), Potent Belt (Acc and Str mod), Blessed slacks and feet (mind mod).

I have broken 1k multiple times on Torama's while camping Ose, I dunno if that's good or not. I have crit hit rate merits (2x) and no club merits or mind merits. I have 1 or 2 str merits I think, I don't really remember. Haven't logged in to do melee whm in over a month.
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Until you come back, I'm blisting you :mad:
 
Lucki said:
:partay: moments
:dur: moments
or
:awesome: moments?
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Well, moments like this
:chairshot:
and of course our ability to do this
:threadjacked:
and when we're bored
:sex:
or just freaky.
:sm:
 
So :awesome: moments...
 
Yea, that sounds about right.
 
Melee'ing in any cape really works, The Belecrose Mantle is Fine, but there's a thing about when is it worth the space? I mean I am pretty rediculous as is I think he character is capped out on space with only like 8 slots open when in full ballte gear. So that 1 Mantle would be nice, though not too important. (could also just be me giving up on it too =P )

All in all she's got the following sets in full:
Enfeeble
Utsusemi
Stoneskin
Cures
Regen
Banish
Divine build for Sleep
Weaponskill
Melee_TP
Melee_Accuracy

And a couple of Swap-in's for things like lowering the recast on certain spells as low as possible.

Granted, most of the gear is indeed reused, but it adds up. If you want a full equiptment list I could post it here if you want.

She does need Nash Pants, Tabin+1(never any up), Alt Cape, and 12 O.Ingots for Tiara, and 12 Imp.Ingots to really cap out (She's got all the slavage pieces).

But to answer your other question, Tabin Jupon +1 or Marduk Jubba would be your best choice. Jupon would be prefered. You're losing 2 accuracy for basically 5 mind and 2 Str. Seems like a decent sacrifice. Switchign to jubba might not be as good but you're basically sacrificing 10 accuracy for 17 mind, tough call.

And I retract Marduk Tiara for WS, I meant Optical Hat. Tiara was for Divine Build for sleep.
 
Oh and Double posting cause I'm a douche like that, For the life of me I cannot get any consistancy on Weaponskills. On DC-T mobs she'll do anywhere from 400 to 1200 Hexas... I think the "Enhances Critical hit" on Hexa is like "Triples damage on successful critical hits" but idk. Just really wierd, her parsed averages are around ~500-600 that's pretty decent for an average.
 
iaredrew said:
Situation B)
The dreaded PL:

I really wish it was against game rules to PL any person at any time outside of a duo. It makes most people lazy because they think, "Oh this is a how a PT works, spamspamspam." No thank you. BUT if you realize that the PL is only there as a means of support then you should still be able to function normally according to your job.
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I whole heartedly concur! I agree w/ PL stunting one's growth as a player. If i join a party and there is one present I will of course will not turn it down. However I will never activley seek one. I try to learn to be good at the jobs I use, even to go as far as (for example) On my 25 NIN I don't even use xp ring. I need the practice and to put the time in to learn how to do my job properly is my personal opinion.
 
Jimmydaneck said:
I whole heartedly concur! I agree w/ PL stunting one's growth as a player. If i join a party and there is one present I will of course will not turn it down. However I will never activley seek one. I try to learn to be good at the jobs I use, even to go as far as (for example) On my 25 NIN I don't even use xp ring. I need the practice and to put the time in to learn how to do my job properly is my personal opinion.
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Leveling sub jobs that would typically cost gil, I always got a friend to PL me. Usually solo if it's a better DD, but PL the party. Why? Save gil, time, maximize XP/hr and because I usually struggled finding a true healer for the party. IE: I went through garliage on my ninja with BBT or Hollie PL'in me for a bit because there was no whm, rdm, smn, blm or blu out there. However, there are some intricacies that people need to observe with some jobs. However, these jobs are all so easy that you really don't need to take it too seriously.
 
hmmm

I get what yall are saying in regards to learning to play jobs, and for the most part i agree. I can however tell you for a fact that if you party with my whm minimarx you will see him melee colibri into the 60's. I realize that my str and dex merits dont compare me with a dd.. but then again.. those dd's arent 2 boxing my rdm healing the party like i am. I would prolly feel bad about learning to play like yall said, but this is my second whm taken to 75.. do i really need to grind like i did the first time?

As far as PL's go.. i definitly do not agree that they shouldnt be allowed. I worked hard leveling my alt rdm to 75 just to PL, and ive met more than one pld that couldnt tank at 65-70. All a PL does is eliminate the problem of people that typically don't understand hate, accuracy, damage and healing anyway. Maybe others have had different experience, but typically in my experience you can't reason with or teach a drk that won't cancel souleater. Point, its not as simple as people just learning their job.

Whether you agree with me or not, if you ever do party with me I hope you enjoy my PL's enmity, vit, mp, and casting interruption merits.
 
marxx said:
I get what yall are saying in regards to learning to play jobs, and for the most part i agree. I can however tell you for a fact that if you party with my whm minimarx you will see him melee colibri into the 60's. I realize that my str and dex merits dont compare me with a dd.. but then again.. those dd's arent 2 boxing my rdm healing the party like i am. I would prolly feel bad about learning to play like yall said, but this is my second whm taken to 75.. do i really need to grind like i did the first time?

As far as PL's go.. i definitly do not agree that they shouldnt be allowed. I worked hard leveling my alt rdm to 75 just to PL, and ive met more than one pld that couldnt tank at 65-70. All a PL does is eliminate the problem of people that typically don't understand hate, accuracy, damage and healing anyway. Maybe others have had different experience, but typically in my experience you can't reason with or teach a drk that won't cancel souleater. Point, its not as simple as people just learning their job.

Whether you agree with me or not, if you ever do party with me I hope you enjoy my PL's enmity, vit, mp, and casting interruption merits.
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And I hope your tank enjoys a lot of Pecking flurry's -.-;; Wait till you're on Puk's and they spam wind shear on you lol And as for the Pld's... That's sad. My pld on Kotsu is level 1, but I (in my opinion) very successfully tanked as a pld with a couple shield merits and 1 merits in chivalry, 1 merit in enmity, in a merit party. Granted, I lost hate from 1500+ sidewinders and penta thrusts but I got it back pretty well. And I've never even played Pld. lol I tanked on pld in dynamis and I've never even leveled pld. I think you just found the "winners" man
 
Let's keep it on topic guys. If you want to talk about what happened, make a Flameboard thread about it. This is not the place.
 
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