The Dynamis Show

[Courtney]

But there are people that are also doing dynamis just because of the excitment of having accomplished taking down a zone full of mobs. Those people don't join because they want the AF, and so really their reward is success and lotting rules don't apply to their needs or requirements for joining a LS. There aren't many that join a dynamis LS because that is their #1 priority, but I know a few players that only log into the game to play dynamis and its not because of the AF2.

Same here, but it usually doesn't last very long, and if all they truly are interested in is fun, then the rules won't matter to them...

After a few months, the novelty usually wears off though, and a good set of rules will keep them coming back.

Luck isn't a factor though, with good rules in place and if you put in the work, you will get what you want...

 

[Raesvelg]

A lot of people will say "Well, I'm just in it for the fun of it", but take away any prospect of reward, and a goodly percentage of those people will mysteriously vanish, only to pop up somewhere else where they can enjoy Dynamis AND get some measure of compensation for their time.

 

[Lavi]

Same here, but it usually doesn't last very long, and if all they truly are interested in is fun, then the rules won't matter to them...

After a few months, the novelty usually wears off though, and a good set of rules will keep them coming back.

Luck isn't a factor though, with good rules in place and if you put in the work, you will get what you want...

The new system is placing whatever you want in search comment for primary or secondary. If they drop, you can lot. They opted to throw away hard work for random luck in the hopes they can lot future pieces.

 

[Courtney]

The new system is placing whatever you want in search comment for primary or secondary. If they drop, you can lot. They opted to throw away hard work for random luck in the hopes they can lot future pieces.

Yeah, well random is the worst possible way for selecting who gets AF drops. It means people only show up for zones which have AF they need, and provides no relationship between effort and reward, which means there's no incentive to work for the good of the shell.

It is the easiest way to get a group together though, because it offers the illusion of getting all of your AF within a few weeks, especially if someone isn't willing to come every week, or put in months (or years) to get their rewards...

 

[CmdrFly]

There is no primary or secondary anymore. Pick 2 jobs before each run, end of story.

They opted to throw away hard work for random luck in the hopes they can lot future pieces.

You still don't understand, or still choose not to understand so you can continue holding this torch.

Encore has nothing to do with TDS. Understand this. Encore, in some form or another, was going to start up regardless of TDS's future. TDS leads decided to make the obvious choice and let their members go to Encore.

"They" opted to throw away hard work. First sentence, referring to TDS.

"They" opted for random luck in the hopes they can lot future drops. Second sentence, referring to Encore. Completely different shells.

You may as well be slamming on PinCKS†, since they're starting up around the time TDS ended.

† Sorry to mention PinCKS, they've done nothing wrong. Simply used the name of another recently-started shell.

 

[neville]

Reading over, the ones that should be blamed/flamed should be SE because of their "genius design" of making things in this game so difficult to obtain. I've heard of other players participating in things such as sky, have a long wait before they ever saw the items they wanted, and I know that dynamis is just another one of those events that unfortunately some people wait months, and sometimes longer before they ever see the item they're after and even then they may have others lotting against them which only prolongs the wait

Eh, perhaps, but SE isn't really doing anything unprecedented here. Every game with a serious end game (FFXI, WoW, EQ, etc) has a system for distributing loot.

I'm personally surprised that a lot of shells here use attendance alone as a factor, instead of say, DKP. It's really moot, since its all just another way to decide who gets what.

The "best" way, thus far, is part of the system Blizzard introduced in some of their later dungeons, where certain "tokens" drop which can be converted into gear. So instead of a WHM brialt dropping, maybe a "mage chest token" drops which could work for WHM/RDM/BLM/SMN, so instead of SMN getting 6x one time and problems with WHM, you have more common items dropping that a wider group can benefit from.

But as far as just making it "easier" to get, then it loses its luster... If a few weeks gets you the best gear, then its not that big of a deal.

/endderailment

 

[Lavi]

There is no primary or secondary anymore. Pick 2 jobs before each run, end of story.


You still don't understand, or still choose not to understand so you can continue holding this torch.

Encore has nothing to do with TDS. Understand this. Encore, in some form or another, was going to start up regardless of TDS's future. TDS leads decided to make the obvious choice and let their members go to Encore.

"They" opted to throw away hard work. First sentence, referring to TDS.

"They" opted for random luck in the hopes they can lot future drops. Second sentence, referring to Encore. Completely different shells.

You may as well be slamming on PinCKS†, since they're starting up around the time TDS ended.

† Sorry to mention PinCKS, they've done nothing wrong. Simply used the name of another recently-started shell.

Same leadership. Same group. That leadership was responsible for TDS. It was leadership's responsibility to maintain the shell and keep it running. They failed, chose to make a new shell and foregoe any of the previous efforts of members. They failed me. Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it leadership's responsibility to look out for member's interests? Isn't it their responsibility to keep the shell running to maintain those interests? They didn't do that job to do what it takes to keep the shell going, the very group I agreed to join, the rules I agreed to and instead of making that work chose to make a whole new system. So they made a new shell to ignore all the things they agreed to do when they were leaders of that shell? And what happens if Encore goes sour too? They just gonna run away from that too instead of doing the proper job as leader and fixing the problem?

 

[meeze]

Same leadership. Same group. That leadership was responsible for TDS. It was leadership's responsibility to maintain the shell and keep it running. They failed, chose to make a new shell and foregoe any of the previous efforts of members. They failed me. Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it leadership's responsibility to look out for member's interests? Isn't it their responsibility to keep the shell running to maintain those interests? They didn't do that job to do what it takes to keep the shell going, the very group I agreed to join, the rules I agreed to and instead of making that work chose to make a whole new system. So they made a new shell to ignore all the things they agreed to do when they were leaders of that shell? And what happens if Encore goes sour too? They just gonna run away from that too instead of doing the proper job as leader and fixing the problem?

sounds lik 90% of the shell was happy with the way the new shell was moving, you and the 10% that didn't are the minority. Usually shells split more like 50%/50% or 60%/40%, they did a pretty good job keeping 90% of the shell together.

 

[Audino]

The new system is placing whatever you want in search comment for primary or secondary. If they drop, you can lot. They opted to throw away hard work for random luck in the hopes they can lot future pieces.

Stop saying "The new system." Its not your system and it isn't a new TDS system. Maybe having the same time slots makes it look like a new TDS but its not. I took a look at the people that were excited about the fact I was trying to keep a few of us together and saw that their shells basically revolved around the existing schedule. With TDS going out of the picture it left an empty slot on the schedule here. If TDS was staying I would have moved nights since Tuesdays have enough shells running already.

You chose not to join and thats fine. If the shell I made with Myihta fails then its something that I'll have to live with. At this point its not really a concern since the majority of my members actually count down the days until our next run. Its been said already, no one whatsoever was forced to join my shell. I didn't put up a recruiting thread on qcdn and no one was stolen from any other shell. The people that are there are the people that came to us and thats the way it will be.

Sure the lotting is different. That is something that will seperate us from other shells in either a negative or positive way. Time will tell. It all depends on the person. The way we're doing things doesn't bother people enough to make them not come and so far everyone is having a great time. All I'm really concerned about is the people that are there, not the people that aren't.

I had nothing to gain by starting a new shell. In TDS I had no competition for NIN gear (the only other job I have higher than 65) and I sure don't need a shell to continue my upgrading on polearm. I could have very easily chosen to just join a new shell and just left everyone I knew behind to let them do whatever the hell they wanted.

We have our ways of making sure that we keep only the people that show up continuously. But again, outside of the shell its really no one's business, including you. Encore's members know that any previous dynamis standings from any shells have no bearing there so why does that make them bad people? They made their own choices just like you made yours and they don't deserve to be degraded because of it. So many people are proud to be there and no matter what you want to say Lavi, no matter how you want to make it look like we all fucked you out of something that you had a chance for, you cannot take that away from them or myself. Its really that simple.

And Ishaela's right. I bet more than half of our members would have passed that body piece for you if you were with us and it dropped. Why? Because thats what kind of people my members are. They are sincerely the best people I've ever met and thats what makes it worth it to me.

 

[CmdrFly]

Tried to fix the problem. Didn't work. Wiping a clean slate may not have been the best idea, but time was running short on keeping the members interested. Myi and Ores both have plenty of RL stuff holding them up (which we're warned well in advance of from both). Aud was sick of being hammered about lotting problems. Foo is rarely logging on from what I can gather.

Had Aud not stepped up to make a new shell, we'd all be standing there in LS asking "whats going on" last Tuesday. No leaders, no glass, nothing. We'd disperse and all be posting in LS Recruiting Forum looking for a new home.

If you were under the stress the other leaders were to fix the lotting system, you would undoubtedly do the same - say "fuck it", start a new shell, and operate under your rules.

Your problem is obviously with the "fuck it" part, and the only viable answer I can offer to you there is:

We, i.e. everyone except you, moved on. We're human enough to realize shit happens. Greener pastures on this side of the fence.

You got boned just like the rest of us, human nature takes over here and realizes that the leaders - our friends - could not solve the problem on their hands without someone getting a sore vag. It was their responsibility, absolutely, but they couldn't fix it. Who gives a shit? They're human just like you and I, if you think you could have solved this whole ordeal 5 months ago, you had all the opportunity in the world to. Via forum or in-game discussions, you can't blame them for a problem you seem to think you could have fixed.

Thanks to the outsiders who took the time to read through everything and understand the real problem, or lack thereof. I see no point in continuing here, take care Lavi.

 

[Raesvelg]

Again there's this line that the shell failed you... by not giving you what you want. But that argument fails on the simple basis that you are not the only person running in that shell. You can piss and moan about how the Show should have stayed together, but that didn't happen. You can carefully overlook the fact that you profited from the system that existed in the Show that arguably screwed over new recruits, but I don't think that fits into your argument all that well. You can sling insults and say that the people who left are greedy, but that's also generally not true either.

For the most part, the person who's coming out of this looking bad is you.

 

[Mirewen]

Luck isn't a factor though, with good rules in place and if you put in the work, you will get what you want...

Tell that to Beaucedine! *grumbles*

 

[Lavi]

Again there's this line that the shell failed you... by not giving you what you want. But that argument fails on the simple basis that you are not the only person running in that shell. You can piss and moan about how the Show should have stayed together, but that didn't happen. You can carefully overlook the fact that you profited from the system that existed in the Show that arguably screwed over new recruits, but I don't think that fits into your argument all that well. You can sling insults and say that the people who left are greedy, but that's also generally not true either.

For the most part, the person who's coming out of this looking bad is you.

It must be a good thing they did Dynamis Jeuno the first run or maybe a certain couple might warp out on the entire linkshell when they don't get their way. Man, that'd be just selfish... Don't try calling me greedy when all I expected was my hard work to be rewarded instead of the leadership abandoning it entirely for a quick cheap fix. But good luck with that though.

 

[Raesvelg]

It must be a good thing they did Dynamis Jeuno the first run or maybe a certain couple might warp out on the entire linkshell when they don't get their way. Man, that'd be just selfish... Don't try calling me greedy when all I expected was my hard work to be rewarded instead of the leadership abandoning it entirely for a quick cheap fix. But good luck with that though.

A.) I've no idea who you're slinging barbs at in the first part of this paragraph. Then again, I wasn't there for the first run of Encore.

B.) Have I called you greedy yet? No. Read what I write, not your bias against my position. The closest I've come to calling you greedy is to say that screaming at others for wanting to get their gear is hypocritical when the problem is that they didn't hand you your gear first.

 

[Zyndara]

I wasn't going to post in this at all because it just seems kinda sad, but I feel I need to because I think you're being unfair to people because you're upset Lavi. I've always thought you to be a cool, kind person, and this whole argument doesn't become you at all. I'm not saying what happened to TDS was fine or that you don't have a right to be upset in general, but I think you're taking it out on the wrong people.

I was there the run you passed on that briault so someone else could lot, and I remember wondering at the time why on earth you would do that. Because yes, you were always there, and yes, you supported the shell and yes, you were entitled to reap the reward from that. But when the moment came for you to collect on your reward for your work, you passed on it. I'm not saying that wasn't generous, Lavi, and I'm not faulting you for it. However, you passed on it so that someone who had not been in the shell as long as you had could lot. You made a choice. Should that choice be blamed on the person you graciously gave your lot to? Or the shell? No. One thing my mother told me growing up was if you want to do something, do it, but own it. Don't do it because you expect something out of it, rather because it's what you want to do, and live with the consequences that follow. You did what you did based on the assumption that there would always be another time for you to lot. You passed on a fairly rare item on the hope that someday it would roll back around. But no shell is guaranteed to go on forever, and you put an unfair burden on others by blaming them because you didn't lot when your time came and expecting them to somehow fix a choice you made yourself. That's not right.

I understand you invested time and effort in the shell and so did everyone else to varying degrees. All of the ones who went to Encore are starting over again, and no, not all of them are 5/5, I'm one of them. But I think you really sell short the people you're browbeating here. You don't need to trumpet your accomplishments like somehow everyone's been in a coma the last year. People know you were dedicated and worked hard, and the same people you've been calling out are the ones I'm pretty sure would have been excited to have you lot a briault and/or passed to see that you received it. But instead, you've lashed out at a group of some of the most fun, fair-minded and warm people I've met in this game in your frustration and that's too bad.

I hope you reconsider doing dynamis again and I hope you get your briault. More than anything, I hope you step back some and gain some perspective and stop pushing away people who like you and want for you to have what you're after too.

 

[Toboe]

But when the moment came for you to collect on your reward for your work, you passed on it. I'm not saying that wasn't generous, Lavi, and I'm not faulting you for it. However, you passed on it so that someone who had not been in the shell as long as you had could lot.

Just a correction to this Zyndara, I was with TDS since their very first run, and my attendance was just as good as Lavi's. However my lotting luck was an entirely different story. Lavi passed on the Briault because the previous week that two whm hands dropped in Xarcabard, I lost my lot against her and it was very obvious that I lost the Briault bid against her as well. She thought it was fair I get a piece finally.

This is why I am still saying that the Lavi starting this flame is not the same kind, fun person I came to know in Dynamis.
I can very much understand her frustration over the situation, but it is out of anyone's hand.

 

[Lavi]

A.) I've no idea who you're slinging barbs at in the first part of this paragraph. Then again, I wasn't there for the first run of Encore.

B.) Have I called you greedy yet? No. Read what I write, not your bias against my position. The closest I've come to calling you greedy is to say that screaming at others for wanting to get their gear is hypocritical when the problem is that they didn't hand you your gear first.

A) Not two weeks ago when we were supposed to do Dreamland zones, we decided to since we lacked a large enough group. We had about 20 or so members. Reya wanted to do Jeuno since she had a piece she desired from there and when the shell said no (another shell had already scheduled the zone), you and Reya both left the shell and/or logged. I am not implying anything, you did it all yourself.

B) You're trying to imply I am greedy for saying I earned my gear. It's not hypocritical when I earned it. You all want to just free lot crap without any thought of earning anything. Fine, that's a "great" system. When you get a batch of new recruits, you can free lot with them. Enjoy.

Zyn, I know I passed on the briault once before, but I did so because I felt Toboe deserved them since I had already obtained 4/5 pieces and she was much like me. She had been in the shell since the very beginning and had pretty good attendance. Her overall amount of relic was similar to mine and at the time, I had no idea TDS was going to break and perhaps had I known then, it might of been different. Not that it was a guarantee I would get it, I still could lose the lot. Do I regret it? Not really. I regret joining a group that had no intentions of returning my effort equally.

My problem is that the shell did nothing to preserve the shell. The problems with the lotting system had been known for a very long time, at the very least since October (date of earliest forum discussion) and more than likely months prior since members had been leaving long before then. At the very least 5-6 months ago, leaders had to gave known there was a serious problem and it was effecting membership. What exactly did they do? Nothing. They watched for sixth months while the shell crumbed. Leadership is supposed to work for the shell and to preserve the shell. It's their job to make a shell last so the effort of all players doesn't go to waste and instead, they did nothing. I have every right to be angry, they did nothing to make sure the eleven months I spent in the shell meant something and instead, didn't care. Really, why would they? They got the most out of it themselves. With the exception of Foo who wasn't around quite often, all leaders had obtained the most out of the TDS system and with Audino quitting the shell, he loses his cash cow for dynamis coins.

I knew very well when I started this thread, I would get nothing out of it. I knew I wasn't somehow going to magically be offered a briault, only a fool would think that. I knew I wouldn't be welcome in Encore, I really could care less, their system is based off greed and luck and I cannot stand such a poor system. When I posted this, I really had nothing to lose, many of those people who had been "friends" were only my friends when it suited them. I don't care for that type of a person. Even now, I have nothing to lose, you've taken the one of the few thing I had left that I still enjoyed and still planned on getting items from. Go ahead, call me greedy all you want, but I earned that piece and I had every right to it until leadership failed in their responsibilities. Unlike the rest of you, I don't have another 11 months to sit around and watch the same thing happen and even if I did, it's not worth it. So, sorry if I am a little pissed off at the game and the people had faith in seemed to let me down.

 

[Garvin]

Your LS broke. Cry more.

 

[Raesvelg]

Ah, now I understand. First off, when I logged in (Buburimu as I recall it), the LS was in Sandy already, since I was late getting on. Secondly, the actual position as I understand it was to NOT DO A FUCKING RUN WITH LESS THAN 20 PEOPLE. It's a waste of money. Your chances of recouping the cost of the glass are less than optimal, so why go? I'm told Damita stepped up and sponsored the run, good for him, but I wouldn't have thrown my money at it in his position.

Secondly, the rule in Encore is 65+ gets to declare a lot. Check my sig. WHERE THE FUCK DO YOU SEE ANOTHER 65+ JOB DOWN THERE?!?! Oh, that's right, there's DRK at Sixty ONE that I was already picking up all the pieces I wanted for regardless, since generally nobody else wanted it. Or wait, I can start lotting the pieces for my COR when I get it to 65+ someday!

You want to know my lotting comment? It goes like this:
1.) DRK if nobody else wants it

That's my fucking comment. Not "Gimme gimme gimme I want more AF2".

You say you earned your Briault. How does one define what you've earned? Because you put time into Dynamis? Is your time worth more than someone else's time who got fewer pieces over a similar period? Don't the pieces that you did get compensate you for the time you spent in the shell? Why are you the only one screaming about how you got screwed out of what was rightfully yours? You're far from the only one to be left hanging with a loss of priority. I reiterate that a number of people lost more than you.

What if the solution to TDS's problems had simply been to wipe the attendance slate clean and start over with a new system? In many ways that would have been the best choice from a recruiting perspective. And hey, guess what, you'd be exactly where you are now.

You're not crying because the shell broke. You're crying because the shell broke before you got your Briault.

 

[Reya]

A) Not two weeks ago when we were supposed to do Dreamland zones, we decided to since we lacked a large enough group. We had about 20 or so members. Reya wanted to do Jeuno since she had a piece she desired from there and when the shell said no (another shell had already scheduled the zone), you and Reya both left the shell and/or logged. I am not implying anything, you did it all yourself.

Whoa Whoa Whoa. Step back a sec. When I found out why they were doing a run was to put money in the back to afford future runs and changed to Sandy I had no real problem with that. My beef was that they were planning on farming a run with less than 20 people right after the holidays when no one was online. My arguement was not that they were doing Sandy over Jeuno but that they wanted to farm with 20 people when they I thought they should of waited on Saturday when we would of had more people. I could give a shit about AF pants, I already have my armor I want to wear for my legs. It was a total waste of a run is how I felt at the time, and the fact they changed their run schedule last minute was bad news bears. So get your fucking story right before you talk shit. You apparently have a bad habbit of that.

And don't chuck Raes in that. He doesn't get home from work until after 8. When runs start at 8 he needs to be logged where we're going. TDS changed last minute so when he finally logged on in Bub. Pen. you can see why he was a little peeved that night.

You're throwing away a lot friendships over a stupid reason, and making yourself out to be the ass here, but whatever. I thought you were pretty cool in the past, I thought of you as a friend, but now I want nothing to do with you.

See ya around in Vana'