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FLameass u must be lucky.My thf with th2 and another thf level 60 plus killed that thing for 2 hrs straight and like 40 times still no drop... i was sleepy and logged.
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Firestreak, as amusing as your graphic is, there is a minor diference between a Crawler, and a Notorious Monster. As well as somone's Moblin Helm scenario.
Crawlers are abundant. As are Moblins. If you Get a crawler stolen from you, you can walk thirty seconds away and get another. Where the average NM pops 3,000 times a year, your average crawler spawn (Just one spawn point) has the potential to spawn roughly 35,000 times a year. It's not a Rare occurance like a NM is. Same thing with the Moblin helms and crafting Items. There is a huge difference between camping th eAH for an item that you could in theory atain very easily, and it's rarity is not really a factor. However, Items such as a Damascus Ingot or Shining cloth generally fall into the same catigory as a NM drop, even though they are crafting items, however though.. people don't tend to waste thier time on those drops until they have a higher chance at a HQ, I.E. they do wait until they are several levels above the synth. In most cases synths are a waste of gil unless you HQ. SO if you relate that to the original topic, if a Crafter wants to spend 3,000,000 G on a synth that is 3 levels above them, to produce an item that is worth 2,500,000 G, for the 1:1,000 chance they can produce an item that is worth 4,000,000 G, they are indeed wasting thier time, and really shoudn't complain that they just wasted 500,000 G in materials. However, I give them credit for trying, albeit a hopeless cause.
Some of you tapped in on a particular facit of this discussion that I don't thing you fully realized. Yes, you are wasting a kill by not fully taking advantage of your resources (I.E you gots no TH II.) And yet you lash out at me because even with TH II there would be a rise in prices, and yes, that is the case, because as a thief, when ever I waste my time and watch some non-TH II armed person kill and get no drop, that means I just saw the over all rarity go up. In essence you have helped me decide my asking price. If I cam VE, and get a 80% drop rate, and camp it 24/7 for a week and in that time watch a WHM/WAR capture 80% of the kills by luck and attain maybe 4 pins, even though I only got 20% of the captures, I still got twice as many pins than my buddy the WHM/WAR... But in that time very few were going up on the market, because the kills were spent by somone less optimized. Therefore, i see there are none on the AH, I see there is going to be less on the AH, and I also see that I am in charge od 66% of the market. And since, i spent the same time wasting my time watching somone else kill and not get drop time after time, I am going to compensate myself for my losses. Mainly because the demand is there, and I am in control. Had I had more thieves there competeing and there were more drops peut into the AH, and I was only in control of 10% of the market, my pricing may be a little different. So stop complaining when I raise the Price because your buddies made it more rare, supply and demand.
Competition comes from success, not failure. You want me to lower my prices? Give me a reason to. You want me to lower the price of the Emperor's Hairpin? Well considering that that particular bug dies pretty much as soon as it spawns, the only thing you can do to decrease the rarity of the item, is to raise your chances of getting the item.
So don't get pissed at me and Complain that the prices are going up on select items. Quit whining. Go out and camp it if you don't want to pay, in doing so you might pull your heads out of your asses long enough to realize WHY it costs so much.
Crawlers are abundant. As are Moblins. If you Get a crawler stolen from you, you can walk thirty seconds away and get another. Where the average NM pops 3,000 times a year, your average crawler spawn (Just one spawn point) has the potential to spawn roughly 35,000 times a year. It's not a Rare occurance like a NM is. Same thing with the Moblin helms and crafting Items. There is a huge difference between camping th eAH for an item that you could in theory atain very easily, and it's rarity is not really a factor. However, Items such as a Damascus Ingot or Shining cloth generally fall into the same catigory as a NM drop, even though they are crafting items, however though.. people don't tend to waste thier time on those drops until they have a higher chance at a HQ, I.E. they do wait until they are several levels above the synth. In most cases synths are a waste of gil unless you HQ. SO if you relate that to the original topic, if a Crafter wants to spend 3,000,000 G on a synth that is 3 levels above them, to produce an item that is worth 2,500,000 G, for the 1:1,000 chance they can produce an item that is worth 4,000,000 G, they are indeed wasting thier time, and really shoudn't complain that they just wasted 500,000 G in materials. However, I give them credit for trying, albeit a hopeless cause.
Some of you tapped in on a particular facit of this discussion that I don't thing you fully realized. Yes, you are wasting a kill by not fully taking advantage of your resources (I.E you gots no TH II.) And yet you lash out at me because even with TH II there would be a rise in prices, and yes, that is the case, because as a thief, when ever I waste my time and watch some non-TH II armed person kill and get no drop, that means I just saw the over all rarity go up. In essence you have helped me decide my asking price. If I cam VE, and get a 80% drop rate, and camp it 24/7 for a week and in that time watch a WHM/WAR capture 80% of the kills by luck and attain maybe 4 pins, even though I only got 20% of the captures, I still got twice as many pins than my buddy the WHM/WAR... But in that time very few were going up on the market, because the kills were spent by somone less optimized. Therefore, i see there are none on the AH, I see there is going to be less on the AH, and I also see that I am in charge od 66% of the market. And since, i spent the same time wasting my time watching somone else kill and not get drop time after time, I am going to compensate myself for my losses. Mainly because the demand is there, and I am in control. Had I had more thieves there competeing and there were more drops peut into the AH, and I was only in control of 10% of the market, my pricing may be a little different. So stop complaining when I raise the Price because your buddies made it more rare, supply and demand.
Competition comes from success, not failure. You want me to lower my prices? Give me a reason to. You want me to lower the price of the Emperor's Hairpin? Well considering that that particular bug dies pretty much as soon as it spawns, the only thing you can do to decrease the rarity of the item, is to raise your chances of getting the item.
So don't get pissed at me and Complain that the prices are going up on select items. Quit whining. Go out and camp it if you don't want to pay, in doing so you might pull your heads out of your asses long enough to realize WHY it costs so much.
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I think Phraust has a good argument if you have mages camping things like VE for cash but his argument completely falls appart if you apply it to mages who are camping items they actually need and can't afford.
If you are looking to make a career off NMs and you're a BLM/WHM go level a theif but there are certain items that mages whant to use for their job that are high priced.
Me for example...I want an astral earring. It's the only NM drop item (other than Serket Ring of course) that I want for my summoner right now. I am currently camping Padfoot as a SMN/WHM because frankly it's all I can do. I have claimed him and gotten no drop and have spent about 17 hours in the meadows lookng for him. I would love to sub my 15 THF just to up the chance by even a bit on getting the drop but he kicks my ass as is and I need my cures...also with no /WHM I don't have a way to really claim him as I use Dia to nab him.
I'm not going to level a theif to 45 just to get this freakin item....I don't plan on selling the earring but plan on wearing it for the remainder of my gaming time as a summoner and a whm. I've never even considered building my gil career on NMs...Yes I have camped mary a lot but I was trying to help my friend (bard) to get the horn to use and now I just do it for shits and giggles....also I camped her during my wool phase with /THF subbed in clothcraft.
I'm trying to find other means of obtaining gil...crafting/harvesting/farming stuff with my TH1 but I'm not anywhere near my goal of getting 3 mil together for an astral earring as I still need to get another astral ring, a pluto/apollo staff, erase and a vermy cloak...nevermind all the other stuff like capes etc so my only option is get the stupid earring to drop.
You find me a high level theif willing to part with a 3 million gil item and I'll camp padfoot with TH2.
If you are looking to make a career off NMs and you're a BLM/WHM go level a theif but there are certain items that mages whant to use for their job that are high priced.
Me for example...I want an astral earring. It's the only NM drop item (other than Serket Ring of course) that I want for my summoner right now. I am currently camping Padfoot as a SMN/WHM because frankly it's all I can do. I have claimed him and gotten no drop and have spent about 17 hours in the meadows lookng for him. I would love to sub my 15 THF just to up the chance by even a bit on getting the drop but he kicks my ass as is and I need my cures...also with no /WHM I don't have a way to really claim him as I use Dia to nab him.
I'm not going to level a theif to 45 just to get this freakin item....I don't plan on selling the earring but plan on wearing it for the remainder of my gaming time as a summoner and a whm. I've never even considered building my gil career on NMs...Yes I have camped mary a lot but I was trying to help my friend (bard) to get the horn to use and now I just do it for shits and giggles....also I camped her during my wool phase with /THF subbed in clothcraft.
I'm trying to find other means of obtaining gil...crafting/harvesting/farming stuff with my TH1 but I'm not anywhere near my goal of getting 3 mil together for an astral earring as I still need to get another astral ring, a pluto/apollo staff, erase and a vermy cloak...nevermind all the other stuff like capes etc so my only option is get the stupid earring to drop.
You find me a high level theif willing to part with a 3 million gil item and I'll camp padfoot with TH2.
Phraust, I understand your point of view, the problem I'm having is this. As the price for the item goes up to a ridiculous amount, you have to look at Argus like this... There is no way possible to get more amount of gil in one kill than possibly 20 million all solo. Now it's true if THFs only got the claim, the drop rate would be much higher. However, look at your own logic for a moment.
I recall you talking about how you came to camp Argus in the first place. You said you calculated the amount of money you made every hour farming, figured how many hours it would take to = Argus jackpot, and you spent that much time testing out camping Argus. Well guess what, unlike you may think, being for example a WHM, does NOT open up a whole lot of doors for making money. SOME people find ways to make money other than farming or camping NM, others don't. Maybe it's boring to them, requires too much time investment, whatever.. just think like this...
Their gil/hour camping is worse than yours, just like their drop rate on Argus would be. Now factor in how retardedly expensive crafting has gotten before you can make profit. Factor in how ridiculously high the actual peacock charm price has risen... what exactly do you expect people to do?
I don't hear you offering to let them party up with you and camp together. Therefore your drop rate has nothing to do with their drop rate. It's their cause they believe it's the best way possible they can make money, and depending on their resources they just might be right. have you ever tried farming as a mage? Try making a sustainable profit off synthing before throwing 30 million gil into it.
Argus is EXACTLY like Crawlers, except for one big thing. I GIVE A SHIT what happens to silk threads and honestly, who on this thread really gives a shit if PCC is 20 million or 40 million except the people camping it for gil?`
And I will go back to this point Phraust. Everyone needs to make money somehow. We all have to find ways to get by. It's not possible for everyone to have a level 45 THF, simply it's a mathematical fact. The more people who play THF, the harder it is to level a THF. Take a look at the Event Schedule boards there.. the majority of people starting statics are Thieves.
I recall you talking about how you came to camp Argus in the first place. You said you calculated the amount of money you made every hour farming, figured how many hours it would take to = Argus jackpot, and you spent that much time testing out camping Argus. Well guess what, unlike you may think, being for example a WHM, does NOT open up a whole lot of doors for making money. SOME people find ways to make money other than farming or camping NM, others don't. Maybe it's boring to them, requires too much time investment, whatever.. just think like this...
Their gil/hour camping is worse than yours, just like their drop rate on Argus would be. Now factor in how retardedly expensive crafting has gotten before you can make profit. Factor in how ridiculously high the actual peacock charm price has risen... what exactly do you expect people to do?
I don't hear you offering to let them party up with you and camp together. Therefore your drop rate has nothing to do with their drop rate. It's their cause they believe it's the best way possible they can make money, and depending on their resources they just might be right. have you ever tried farming as a mage? Try making a sustainable profit off synthing before throwing 30 million gil into it.
Argus is EXACTLY like Crawlers, except for one big thing. I GIVE A SHIT what happens to silk threads and honestly, who on this thread really gives a shit if PCC is 20 million or 40 million except the people camping it for gil?`
And I will go back to this point Phraust. Everyone needs to make money somehow. We all have to find ways to get by. It's not possible for everyone to have a level 45 THF, simply it's a mathematical fact. The more people who play THF, the harder it is to level a THF. Take a look at the Event Schedule boards there.. the majority of people starting statics are Thieves.
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Jealousy is common.80 percent of the thieves level the job just to camp Nms and i know it sucks when a non-thf gets it...So!!
All whms should teleport 5 million times... all melee should buy gil and every thief should have atleast 3 mules like rinas ,around argus and other NMs 24/7.Right?
All whms should teleport 5 million times... all melee should buy gil and every thief should have atleast 3 mules like rinas ,around argus and other NMs 24/7.Right?
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Don't know how to paste a link to a topic... cuz mostly it gives the message "Thread doesnt exist anymore".So check out "Phraust from inside" should be right above this thread i belive :lol:
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I NEVER camp a NM I can solo I only camp it for the item to make use of or for a trusted friend to use. And I REFUSE to pay the rediculous prices Anyway... keyboard still not fiXed... I just learned the ALT+Number key for most the broken key^^
Wolf, you're an idiot. The second character I was talking about in that thread was Mistasia, I used her to watch the Leech King a lot, while she was vacationing for four months. Now she's back.
Btw, LOOK! Links DO work! http://qcdn.org/viewtopic.php?t=9720&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=180 WOOOOOOOW
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what ever... mules around argus .Thats the point.
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My bad school pc doesnt let u keep cookies or w/e so u have to log in every time u click on link i think.
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Who gives a shit if someone has a mule around Argus? As long as that mule's being controlled by a person, I really don't care.
Re: 
That's cause Myi's TH is broken
<3 Myi
kriist said:Not to stir anything up... but one quick question...
Where is the proof that TH even effects HNM/NM drop rates? I have always heard rumors that TH only effects normal mobs, and the drop rate of NM/HNM's is a set drop rate.
This may be horribly incorrect, but just wondering where it was stated by S.E. that TH effects NM/HNM drops at all?
The only reason I ask is because I myself am A NM hunter. I don't go for the "Big Dogs" so to speak, but not a day goes by that I don't camp at least one of my 4 favorite NM's. One of my best friends in this game is a 75 THF/NIN and to be honest... I haven't noticed a difference in the drop rate, with her in my pt, or not...
Hope you all don't hate me now...
That's cause Myi's TH is broken
<3 Myi
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Ezikiel said:
Ezik, you're a good guy but she is justified in saying that a lot of thieves aren't the same. Nothing pisses me off more than when I'm camping an NM to use the item and a theif blows by with Flee and claims the mob for the 10th time....
<3 Ezikiel though
Sabia said:
Thankies Sabs <3
I actually get bored, quite often, and sit in Jeuno watching shouts for something interesting to do. I am perfectly happy to loan out my TH 2 to people.. Heck, I can camp as THF/RNG, THF/WAR, and THF/NIN depending on the mob.
Idk.. /sigh.. this was a long read. But I have seen many a VE (non thf) camper whine about the drop rate.... Sad thing is, I woulda loaned my TH2
Just a small point, I camped VE and LL for my boots and pin as a paladin, but I used them as my ninja... I actually would never have taken ninja up to the level it could fight VE without the pin.
And I got no drop 4 times in a row with a friend's TH2, then first try with just my TH1... I know the odds are still on my side with TH2 but... sheesh apparently I WASN'T wasting my time, eh?
And I got no drop 4 times in a row with a friend's TH2, then first try with just my TH1... I know the odds are still on my side with TH2 but... sheesh apparently I WASN'T wasting my time, eh?